Liverpool Banter 2

23 Sep 2026 11:27:13
Great article on BBC Sport about Lewis Koumas (currently on the first page).

He's one I really really want to succeed - born in Chester and has been a Liverpool fan since birth, as has his Dad who played in youth teams with Gerrard and Owen at Liverpool.

He's a bit of a slow burn - 21 and only just breaking through - but we had another Welsh striker a few years back who had a similar trajectory, and he did OK.

23 Sep 2026 11:40:56
Craig Bellamy?

23 Sep 2026 12:12:32
My first thought was Harry Wilson but he's not exactly a striker so I'm not sure who it is now.

23 Sep 2026 12:23:31
Max Boyce.

23 Sep 2026 12:33:12
Rush maybe?

23 Sep 2026 13:40:53
And the prize goes to Robbo! Chester was a vague clue too!

Have a warm round of applause, Robbo!

23 Sep 2026 13:49:18
I automatically thought Rushie, but was too shy to say! I see him around Chester, when I'm there. I leave him be.

23 Sep 2026 14:16:10
I thought Rushie was obvious my reply was tongue in cheek.

23 Sep 2026 15:17:34
Ian Rush wasn't a slow burn, Zed.
He came with a big reputation as a teenager & soon lived up to it.

23 Sep 2026 16:41:02
I'll take your word for it Rigsby, his breakthrough at the start of the 1980s was a wee bit before my time - when I started following us, he was already established (mid-80s).

I was looking purely at the fact that he didn't get his first full season (according to the stats - and by full I mean 30+ games) until he was a similar age to that which Koumas is now.

23 Sep 2026 17:49:37
No worries, Zed, and you're right that Rush's first full season was his second with us.
He was 20 at the start of the season but we went on to win the League and he was our top scorer.
I'd be happy if Koumas achieves half of what Rush did, mate.

24 Sep 2026 08:42:18
Is Chester in Wales these days?

24 Sep 2026 12:38:55
We're referring to the Roman map, WDW4.

23 Sep 2026 11:03:30
Listening to Andy Robertson talk about the impact of Diogo Jota's death on the team and seeming to attribute at least some of last season's on pitch struggles to it, I was reminded of something from a few years back which moved me at the time and I still think of as a display of huge mental strength and resilience.

2008 Champions League semi final second leg. We were up against Chelsea, remarkably the third Champions League semi final in four years that we'd played Chelsea. Went to extra time. Chelsea were awarded a penalty and Frank Lampard scored it. His mum had died a few days prior to the match. Huge match, huge pressure and he not only played at a time of huge personal loss but was able to compose himself to take a crucial penalty in extra time. I hate Chelsea and I'm not a massive fan of Lampard but for that moment in those circumstances I admired him hugely.

22 Sep 2026 20:29:15
Hello ed1 hope u good. As regards contract situations of ali and vvd do u know if they would be open to staying on at lfc beyond this summer when there contracts up? Or is club willing to offer them new contracts?
I think both started season bit ropey, by there standards, but have improved as they've got a few games under there belts.

I thought ali looked back to himself Sunday, world class save early on and dominated his box all game. A long time since we had 3 clean sheets in prem league in a row.

{Ed001's Note - both want to stay, but the question is whether the club will want them to stay enough to agree a new contract. Both are highly paid, so Virgil will defo need to take a pay cut and Ali will probably have to as well, which can be difficult while staying at the same club. It is much easier to accept a step down when you are moving elsewhere, it feels less like a demotion then. This will be a difficult negotiation and a lot will depend on how well they do in the next few months.}

23 Sep 2026 07:22:44
Thanks for response. Good that they want to stay, that's a starting point.
I see ali not called up by Brazil this int break, be interesting to see can he stay fit this season maybe less long hauls to Brazil benefit him. only reason I could see not to offer him new contract would be if he had another injury prone season.

23 Sep 2026 07:42:22
I think Becker will head back to Brazil to play for Inter. He has mentioned before his "plan" to go back there to play while still at a high level. He's 34 in a few days time so will basically be hitting 35 early in to next season. It makes sense for him to go at this stage in his career.

23 Sep 2026 07:28:48
Ed001 do you think it would make good business sense to offer them reduced wages but increase their appearance and win bonus.

Basically if they're playing and winning games they're getting paid closer to what they're used too and emphasis is on them.

{Ed001's Note - yes, I would say that is how it should always be anyway.}

23 Sep 2026 09:45:38
Really need to keep hold of Ali until we have a good keeper in who is ready for first team action. Good keepers are in incredibly short supply and are the difference between winning a title or not in my opinion.

23 Sep 2026 09:59:26
Think they are putting there's eggs in the young lad we just signed tbh, since we signed him I watched a few highlights and he is very similar to Courtois just a wall and looks imperious with how tall he is. when is Jaros back? I thought he looked a very good keeper at Ajax and game or two for us.

23 Sep 2026 10:14:48
The thing with the new keeper is he is very young Kloppers. It's not commons to see keepers ready at that age but it happens sometimes I guess. He might be a few years off still from being first choice material.

Jaros is back in Dec/Jan I think? Agree with you, he looked like he had a bit of something at Ajax. Would like to see him get some games in the cups. Marmalade just is not the right profile for how we play.

23 Sep 2026 11:01:01
I think Jaros has massive potential and is much better than Mama, he should be our no.2 once he's fit. He is also homegrown.

23 Sep 2026 12:15:18
Would love them both to stay! Absolute legends.

23 Sep 2026 12:21:26
Donnarumma 17yo played for Milan and Italy. May turn out to be a generational talent age wise and an outlier statistically, but if you're good enough, you're old enough.

23 Sep 2026 13:14:43
Not common to see keepers of that age go for £30m either.

23 Sep 2026 16:49:39
Kloppers, not sure if putting in eggs in someone will help them at all. Where are they putting the eggs? Do they only do this to keepers? Haha.

23 Sep 2026 19:46:43
Ed01, I think both veterans know the score and know what could happen or may not happen either way interms of staying while taking a pay cut or Ali wishing to go back to his homeland and retire the club he still supports till this day.

VVD is a bit diff. because if he thinks the likes of Jacquet and Leoni can keep him young (depending on how this season goes), he may just re-up as he thinks he cans still play till 40, like Thiago Silva, who he actually referenced.

22 Sep 2026 17:37:28
Just watched an interview with Arsene Wenger he made on a panel before the legendary come back at home against Barcelona. When asked about his thoughts on the game.

He said,

" they've not one the championship for 30 years [pre Klopp and Slot winning] but they do well in Europe - why?
Anfield!
Home game. This is the most heated stadium in Europe in a return game. That's the only place you don't want to go is to Anfield because of the atmosphere, everything is special there, you know. And so we will - I'm keen - to see what they do tonight."

The rest is history.

Question: why is Anfield not like this for Premiership games?

22 Sep 2026 18:29:37
It cannot be under slot and iraola. These may be good coaches but they dint have that aura that command and influence people.

22 Sep 2026 18:35:21
All I can say, being lucky enough to stand on the kop for that game, is we all knew we were going to go through an hour before kick off.

You could just sense it in the air. Anfield was electric that night. From the Bus Welcoming to the YNWA at the end.

22 Sep 2026 18:35:53
No doubts this will offend people but too many tourists. PL games they pay through the teeth. Trying to get a ticket for big CL games if you're not a regular is like gold dust

Utd have the same issue. No idea about Chelsea, City and Arsenal but I'd say possibly the same.

22 Sep 2026 18:50:34
I'd say there are multiple reasons -
• Evening vs afternoon KOs is a big one.
• Knock out vs League. There's something about it being decided on the night instead of in 'n months' time.
• Not your usual opponents - PL teams don't vary much whereas CL opponents do.

22 Sep 2026 18:59:12
There is something in that, JK. I turned a ticket down for that game. The person offering me his ticket didn't even want face value, he just wanted rid of it. Suffice to say I've regretted it ever since.

Dortmund, Chelsea, 2005 were also special, which I didn't turn down a ticket for. Not lucky enough to be at St Etienne, 1977, which I know some posters on here were.

Like I say, JK has a valid point. Night games also adds something to the atmosphere. PL games, the atmosphere mostly comes from the away support. Apart from the big games. It's been the same for decades.

22 Sep 2026 19:42:56
I managed to get to every CL home game that season. It takes a lot of time, money and effort for me to get up there so on the morning of the game I was in 2 minds. I was busy at work and we were 3-0 down against Barcelona so I really didn't think there was much chance of us going through.

My wife said yeah but what if you do? You'll never forgive yourself. So I made my way up there to the game and it's probably the best decision I've ever made.

I remember a mate in the pub had put a bet on us winning 5-1 and we all thought he was mental.

Then as the game got closer and we made our way to the ground you could sense something special was about to happen. You could literally feel it in the air.

Man, what a night that was. One of the best nights of my life.

22 Sep 2026 21:59:11
European nights at Anfield is in our DNA - the fans, banners, flags, history etc is just different - no point even trying to explain it - it just is.

It's some kind of beautiful concoction of pedigree, history, glory, triumph, resilience, passion, spirit, scousers and bevies all rolled up into something every club on the planet envies and is afraid of - the best place on the planet to be on such nights.

22 Sep 2026 22:09:27
Statto it because locals from merseyside can get tickets for champions league but not for Premier League games. We have people coming from around the world who add to our fantastic support who can get tickets through internet in their country.

23 Sep 2026 00:35:20
Totally agree with that JK23. And I think it is a huge issue for all big clubs across the board. Too many tourists are at games just using their phones and recording videos for their social media instead of singing and supporting the team. I can't blame them because it'll be a once in a lifetime experience for most of them but it does dampen the atmosphere.

Not to mention that local fans who contribute the most to the atmosphere are priced out of tickets themselves. Overall it just leads to a very quiet Anfield.

{Ed666's Note - I dont understand this hate towards tourists at the match? It’s their money let them do what they want. If they want to record videos on their phone so what? Why does it bug people so much? Why should local fans get a dispensation because they arguably sing more? A Liverpool fan is a Liverpool fan whether they are from Merseyside, Malaysia or Mongolia. I’ve spent a tonne of money watching Liverpool round the world than some fans born in Liverpool does that make me more or less of a fan. This local Liverpool fan v out of town/tourist Liverpool fan shit winds me up, it’s proper discriminatory.

23 Sep 2026 01:46:16
According to the numbers I could find tourists make up about 10% of fans at Anfield on a match day. The there are also about 3000 away supporters. Assuming these numbers are fairly accurate that still leaves about 50000 local supporters at every game. Seems a bit weak to blame 10% of the crowd on the poor atmosphere.

{Ed666's Note - This

23 Sep 2026 02:28:19
In addition, the capacity of Anfield has increased from 42000 to 61000 since 2015, wouldn't that mean there are actually more local supporters in the ground not less?
I think the main reason for the decline in atmosphere at the big clubs is because younger fans can't afford to go to games anymore so the crowd is getting progressively older and older.

23 Sep 2026 02:38:43
I can say with confidence that there is a lot more tourist at anfield on match days than 10 percent. These numbers probably don't factor in illegal ticket touts so when a ticket gets scanned and it comes from a l post code but in reality the person going the game is from Hong Kong or another part of the world.


I am not saying it's the main issue but it is definitely a part of it.

23 Sep 2026 03:28:49
Probably because most of the PL games aren't played at night against European elite?

23 Sep 2026 04:07:20
I see Ed666 mentioned Malaysia there. Kudos to Ed666. Up the Malaysian.

{Ed666's Note - it’s one of the only countries I could remember beginning with M the alliteration wouldn’t of worked otherwise 😀

23 Sep 2026 04:24:14
I'm not a local fan too Ed and I always look forward when Liverpool announce their preseason tour and my country is listed as one of the places they'd visit. Maybe it's also just me being jealous but I don't get it when people pay so much money to watch Liverpool play live at Anfield and spend most of match taking selfies and videos of themselves instead of immersing themselves in the atmosphere.

{Ed666's Note - I hear you mate but for some of these fans this is one of the only times they will get the opportunity to come to Anfield and the way they choose to record the moment for prosperity is up to them like I say it’s there money. It’s all subjective of course.

23 Sep 2026 06:53:15
Based on club ticketing data and independent fanbase studies, roughly 30, 000 to 35, 000 local supporters attend a typical home Premier League match at Anfield

Demographic surveys (such as the Premier League Fan Survey and independent fan research) show that roughly 49% to 50% of fans inside Anfield live local of the ground. Across a full capacity crowd of 61, 000, that accounts for about 30, 000 supporters from the immediate local area.

Hospitality & Corporate: ~8, 000–9, 000 seats across the expanded Main Stand and Anfield Road Stand.

Away Supporters: ~3, 000 fans (standard Premier League allocation in the Anfield Road Lower).

Official Members Sales: On average, around and up to 21, 000 Members access tickets per Premier League match through ballot sales, ticket exchanges, and forwarding. While membership draws fans nationwide and globally.

23 Sep 2026 01:59:41
I disagree that it is discriminatory, Ed. It is, however, only one factor as to why Anfield is tends to be quiet for league games. Liverpool is an internationally-supported club but it shouldn't be forgotten that it represents the city of Liverpool, and the city of Liverpool is the core identity and fabric of it. I say that as someone who lives a *long* way from Anfield.
The atmosphere suffers for a lot of reasons:
1. Fewer 18-40 year-olds, who are the loudest and have the most aggression and energy to make noise. Economics and availability are the biggest drivers of this.
2. Sterile experience of matchdays in general - no beer while watching the match, scanning technology and security checks everywhere, high prices throughout. There are a lot more than this.


3. It is a myth than Anfield always had raucous atmospheres for regular league games - sometimes it did, and better than now, but it wasn't a cauldron for Wolves (H) every week.
4. Cameras/phones everywhere - I watch in despair every week at people just stood there like zombies with their phones filming inside the ground. Honestly, grow up and enjoy your life. Memories are stronger when you just enjoyed the moment anyway.
5. Liverpool have had comparatively more success in recent years. Arsenal's atmospheres remain good for league games because their fans have been angry for a long time due to long stretches of failure. Liverpool atmospheres are always better when the team is facing a more powerful foe - Chelsea, Barcelona (we were actually better), Dortmund.

23 Sep 2026 07:35:55
Some of the non-local fans will be from Ireland. Having been to Istanbul in 2005 with their fan group, I can confirm they are some of the loudest, most passionate singers I've heard in my footballing life 😂😂 My voice was gone before I got on the plane at Dublin airport 😂😂.

I don't think you can easily carve up the fan demographic into Merseysiders sing and non-Merseysiders watch silently through their phones.

23 Sep 2026 09:56:45
I'd imagine Rome and others like him who travel long distance within the UK also sing and make themselves heard.

23 Sep 2026 13:56:11
Locals sing more? No locals moan more. I'm from belfast and it costs me in around 500 quid to get to a game maybe get twice a year due to the cost so me and any others that pay that sing our hearts out.

Can't remember who mentioned about can't get tickets there's a website called livefootballtickets you can get tickets to the Porto and Lens games for just for £100 take it from someone who has paid £700 for a single tickets that that's a great price.

22 Sep 2026 11:32:31
Good news on Leoni, he's back training and will play a couple of games with the u-21's in the international break. CB seems sorted. In another news 26 of our players have left for international duty leaving almost no one for AI to work with!

22 Sep 2026 11:53:32
Great to hear re Leoni. I actually love that there's an opportunity for some kids to shine while the lads are away. Hopefully Andoni takes more interest in the academy than Arne did and rather than flying home, he might uncover a hidden gem in the pile.

Seems to have trouble trusting youth which is great to see, a lot of coaches wouldn't have turned to Koumas and Nyoni on Sunday when defending a 1 goal lead but I love to see it. If you're good enough you're old enough!

22 Sep 2026 13:12:10
Best of luck to the lad. Can't have been easy to get injured like that on your debut, especially as a young lad in a new environment (club and country).

Look forward to seeing him get his career back on track.

22 Sep 2026 13:16:23
Good news that. I think all us supporters are looking forward to seeing him on the pitch again. especially beside Jacquet.

22 Sep 2026 13:24:26
YNWA YLFP.

22 Sep 2026 16:02:05
Obviously meant to write seems to have no trouble trusting youth but left out the no 🙈😂.

22 Sep 2026 16:59:54
Be great to see Leoni back on the grass, for me he looks fantastic.
I thought he looked an absolute gem when he was playing, looked like he just glided across the turf. Good luck and hopefully see you soon!!

22 Sep 2026 18:55:26
The good thing about Leoni's inury (as horrible as it was) is that he is still a kid.

Hence, he has the ability to fully recover and get his legs back underneath him unlike an older player who could struggle in his recovery.

Really looking forward to seeing him play again.

22 Sep 2026 19:27:52
Leoni and jacket will be a superb pairing, absolute monsters.

{Ed666's Note - you can’t say that because we don’t know how Well Leoni will come back from his injury.

22 Sep 2026 20:06:35
Harvey Elliot's career sadly took a nose dive with the ankle injury. Chiesa was world class before his injury. Sometimes a player may be ok physically but not quite the same mentally or vice versa.

If he can repeat his debut performance and push from that then we'll have a very, very strong CB pairing, and no5 to mention Ndukwe 2ho looked very promising in the pre-season.

{Ed025's Note - who told you Chiesa was "world class" WDW, never been any where near that mate a journeyman at absolute best..

23 Sep 2026 00:53:00
@ed25 i think that is harsh - chiesa lit up the Euro 2020. In fact before he did his ACL, pretty much every big club was checking him out. Problem is he didn't do it for long enough to earn the world class title but he was def on the way.


I still can't work out if its a mental thing but since 2022 he has been nowhere near the same.

{Ed025's Note - he was a decent enough player Phil and yes had a couple of good games at a Euro mate...does that make you world class?, that term gets used far too often for me..

23 Sep 2026 09:43:18
Chiesa!? World Class??? Just stop.

23 Sep 2026 11:32:44
A matter of opinion, I guess. Let's just say, all things being equal, if the injury hadn't happened I doubt we'd have got him for £10m.

23 Sep 2026 11:34:26
Forgot to add, the point about player recovery from serious injury be it physical and / or mental still stands.

23 Sep 2026 12:53:42
You are Malaysian, mfahmee? I always thought you are a Singaporean haha. I'm Malaysian too. Up Malaysia!

23 Sep 2026 19:49:34
Maybe people should read the actual comment. WDW said he was world class before his injury, which is true because he was the best attacking talent in Italy and a 100m euro tag was put on him by Juve.

N btw, LFC tried to sign him but clearly, Juve weren't having it.

{Ed025's Note - but thats like saying Eddie the eagle was a world class Ski jumper because he was the best in Britain Oli..

23 Sep 2026 22:38:18
Well he made the olympics 😅.

24 Sep 2026 08:48:09
That made me laugh out loud @MoT.

@25! I reckon you and me should turn up for the Olympic Ski Jump trials - we could be the new Chiesa's of the piste 👍.

{Ed025's Note - im a bit old for all that lark now WDW, mind you we would still be better than Eddie i expect mate..

22 Sep 2026 07:39:01
{Ed's Note - Davey Sulls has posted a new article entitled, My Thoughts on Liverpool's Start to the Season

22 Sep 2026 08:48:44
I've seen Slot defended in the past under in his 2 seasons he won the league and got CL. If he had done that in reverse order then that's progression, unfortunately he didn't and it was clearly regression.

Under Ai performances haven't been great but we've had 3 cleans sheets and for me performances have been better (apart from Fulham) than last season so whilst it's still early days it's progression.

Ultimately Ai will be judged on final league position at the end of the season on whether the club have progressed or not.

CL is another big one and domestic cups a bonus.

22 Sep 2026 09:04:51
They don't need to be compared. Personally I don't see much improvement in the performances but it's only been a few games. I'm fully confident in Iraola. The start was always going to be the hardest part. I can only see us improving under him.

22 Sep 2026 09:29:59
The defence looks good. Am pretty happy with the team as long as the defence is tight and teams have to really work hard to score against us.
Its not always about breathtaking football. I won't mind to shore up the defence and be very difficult to score against even if that means less entertaining and dross games. don't mind the 1-0 at all.

The problem lies in the midfield and the sooner AI realised he needs to give trey a go the better. Macca has been good and back to his usual self so he is my second midfielder. Gravy on rotation duties

Upfront barcola isak and gackpo look pretty much the first picks with rio munoz and koumas rotation duties

That leaves us with wirtz or szobo as the 10 or pivot and the sooner AI picks one the better.

Pretty clear both of them in the squad affect the balance and is not the best team.

22 Sep 2026 09:37:08
Agree with Florian but there are good signs that certain individuals are upping their game - Gakpo, Vyrgil & Mac have been tonnes better & Issac is putting his chances away.
I'm hoping Jurgen can give Wirtz a bit of a confidence boost while he's away and Iraola can get him performing!

22 Sep 2026 09:54:57
Virg just isn't having to babysit people as much this season. Silly to ever doubt that man.

22 Sep 2026 10:17:56
Gakpo has been best player so far and doesn't deserve to be moved so Barcola can be involved. Only do that when his form drops.

22 Sep 2026 10:24:15
I've been very vocal in my criticism of Virgil Florian. Rather than him babysitting anyone in my opinion he's been the main issue for the past 12 months and the rest of the team have been babysitting him.

The one thing Iraola has done is getting him and the rest of the back 4 to defend higher up and defend on the front foot. It's the biggest change he's made and it's very noticeable.

Look at the Newcastle game where Virgil backed off until he was in his own box for both goals. The last few games he's been engaging on the halfway line as have the rest of the back 4. They are tighter to the opposition and getting in front of them as they receive the ball. If they don't win the ball they are fouling to stop the break.

Fair play to Virgil because he's taken it onboard. I had started to think his legs had gone and he was so terrified of people getting in behind him that the only thing he could do was retreat.

It caused massive issues with the connection between the defence and midfield and opened up a big gap which gave the midfield no chance of getting close to people no matter who was playing.

We are now winning the ball earlier and getting it to the forwards with more space to play but they are misfiring. They still seem to lack confidence and invariably either choose the wrong pass or take too long to play the right pass.

It's a work in progress but I can see incremental improvements in the team structure and connections between the lines. It's not there yet but hopefully will get there.

22 Sep 2026 10:47:18
Rios, where was the rest of the our team when Newcastle broke from well inside their half and van Dijk ended inside his own box for their goals?

22 Sep 2026 10:49:41
Certainly for the 2nd goal vs Newcastle Virgil was right to back off. i think there was 6 LFC players vs their 2 and I don't think he can be blamed for thinking if he delayed the attack our numerical advantage would end the danger.

Lets not make out he's never did this. He's done it as far back as the famous incident vs Spurs at Anfield. No one minded then. i couldn't disagree with you more that Virgil has been the main problem but hey it's all about opinions I suppose.

22 Sep 2026 11:16:09
The point is Florian and Rigsby, Virgil and Jacquet were too deep to start with for both goals.

They were both just standing around on the halfway line marking nobody. Had one of them pushed on then when the ball pops out into midfield Osula is under pressure immediately and they can either win the ball or foul him to stop the attack.

Once he's turned and running at them they are in trouble and it's something that happened time and time again last season.

Front foot defending. Get tighter and be aggressive. Don't allow them to turn, stay closer to the rest of the team and close spaces.

Even if they had just managed to hold Osula up for a few seconds or made him pass backwards it gives the rest of the team a chance to get back goal side.

But standing 20 yards off him marking nobody gives you no chance of affecting the play and once he's got the ball under control and running at you you've got no choice but the back off.

It should've been dealt with way before they started to retreat but because our defending has been so passive and reactionary we've allowed stupid amounts of space in front of the back 4 and allowed players to pick up the ball and run at us.

Most will say that's because we don't have a DM. that's just too simplistic in my opinion because if the spaces are that big no DM is going to be able to cover the ground anyway. Any DM will just be cannon fodder.

Anyway, that's my observations and I'm glad Iraola has spotted it because as I said, the change is very noticeable.

22 Sep 2026 11:48:04
When wises gets the ball he's 80 yards away from our goal if not further, and Willock is even further away. Elanga had pulled out to the left and at that stage especially after the 1st goal was maybe the more immediate danger.

Maybe Virg and Konate thought that the 3 LFC players surrounding Wissa when he picks up the ball was more than sufficient to deal with him. That goal should never have happened but Van Dijk would not get the most blame from me.

22 Sep 2026 12:27:27
I think Virgil is really enjoying being able to sit back and let Jacquet handle things this year, he even defers to Jacquet a lot to get the ball forward lately.

22 Sep 2026 12:27:45
I feel like our press is deliberately suppressed at the moment. In pre season we saw us playing with a full press and going into a lead but the players were completely gassed before half time and the team then fell apart late in games. I think we are doing the sensible thing of making ourselves solid and hard to beat whilst building up the insane fitness levels needed to carry out the full AI press. It will take time and over the next few months I think we will see an increase in pace and pressing which will hopefully massively help the 4 up top excel.

The midfield balance is the only real concern for me. Szobo, Macca and Grav are all too attack minded to sit deep and control games. Although he looks to be 3rd choice at the moment I think Grav is probably best suited if (very big if) he can go back to the disciplined way that he played a couple of seasons ago. I'd be interested to see how a pairing of Nyoni and Grav performs (maybe against Chelsea in the league cup) but my suspicion is that we will see Grav or Macca leave and be replaced with somebody who can add a bit more balance to the midfield.

Overall though, a positive start and a good foundation to build on.

22 Sep 2026 12:38:56
I agree with FM.
On the second goal the midfield was more at fault than van Dijk. Grav gives the ball away and Szob and Wirtz were too soft. Wissa, I think, beats them both!
There's more of an argument against for the first goal. But, again, Grav gives the ball away and I think the pace of Elanga catches van Dijk (and Kerkez) out.

22 Sep 2026 11:16:35
Positives are: 1) We are clearly fitter than last season, 2) Araujo, Jacquet and a better Macca have added more enthusiasm for sticking a foot in and 3) the youngsters are being trusted to come off the bench.

Negatives are: 1) the squad gaps are clear as day, 2) midfield balance is lacking and 3) the press is still a work in progress.

Davey, banking on Gravenberch becoming a focused, diligent and effective DM is borderline delusion. He's the biggest fairy in the squad.

22 Sep 2026 13:57:37
Rio - Spoken like a true CB. Kudos.

At the end of the day, no matter what your MF does the buck stops with the defence and GK. I going to keep going in about this but clean sheets win you titles.

22 Sep 2026 14:21:30
Fm i wasn't meaning to compare them i was talking about progression and regression and used both as an example.

However if i wanted to compare them on the World Wide Web mate i don't need a stranger telling me what i can and can't do.

22 Sep 2026 16:33:26
As things stand no way he routinely benches Wirtz or Szoboslai for Nyoni. Too much talent there to sit on the bench, both have quality to win a game on their own. I do agree however, that the balance is off with both playing essentially the same style of player. With the money invested I just don't see the club sitting either of them longterm.

22 Sep 2026 20:16:32
Midfield the focus for me - tbf Mac looks a lot better this season

I'd rotate Wirtz and Szoboszlai in the number 10 role - when Szoboszlai plays as an 8 he just keeps bombing forward and runs into the same space as Wirtz

Grav would need to regain the discipline he had, then he, Nyoni and Mac a good option as the two - still talk of Camara who would be a great option.

22 Sep 2026 05:41:05
Lots of wirtz comments.

All wirtz needs to do is sit and watch coutinho clips on repeat.
Drop deep for the ball - take a man on dribble past and find the spaces and shoot. He has possibly more ability than coutinho. He has the same frame as coutinho.
He can do a lot better than coutinho.
For some reason he is trying to play technical passes and be cute and hold the ball!
No need just express - dribble run stepovers and shoot from distance. He has the talent for all that and he did all that at Leverkusen.

He needs to become a problem and he needs to score 2-3 from distance so teams know they can't just sit on him. People have to rundown to close him and that opens space for those cute passes

People have got it wrong its not the physical aspect its not the skill. Its the IQ. When they don't let you play your game dribble past find space and shoot.
I remember this with coutinho when he joined he was weak, got bullied and lost a lot of balls and we had that horrible brendan season. Then klopp happened and he had that freedom to do whatever he wants play where the game takes him and shoot from wherever he feels like.
And then he scored some bangers and the confidence of that lit a fire that made him the best player we had and bought us money that we are still spending 🤑.

22 Sep 2026 06:33:04
He has nowhere near as much ability as Coutinho.

22 Sep 2026 07:03:43
Coutinho was a baller, Things he did with the ball was sublime, Wirtz isn't close. We are going to spend the whole season excusing wirtz with "no runners ahead of him". The fact is we need to accept he has flopped massiveley and needs to be sold.

22 Sep 2026 07:07:53
Don't be ridiculous.

22 Sep 2026 07:58:21
I don't think Wirtz is able to move like that, coutinho wasn't quick but he tuned and moved with ball effortlessly and had a wicked shot on him.

I'm not sure what it is with Wirtz to be honest as I actually think the skill is there but he's not showing it on the pitch. How many times has he hit the ball and he has less power than a kid.

I'd imagine he's the best player in training but can't replicate it on match day.

Maybe it's nerves. Maybe the actual match is too quick for him, sometimes it just doesn't work.

Did anyone actually watch him in Germany? I bet you'd be surprised by what you actually saw. His goals and assists were a lot higher but did he actually ever run a game of football? He definitely didn't when we played them with slot, we won comfortably in fact I don't remember Wirtz doing anything at all.

Be good if someone did watch him over there that knows.

22 Sep 2026 08:40:00
Coutinho was a highlights player. He had ability, but ultimately did not do enough for the team in the 90 minutes, especially off the ball.

We improved when he left.

{Ed025's Note - im with you Taurus, a lot of people have selective memory mate..

22 Sep 2026 08:49:33
Coutinho, and the team, thrived best when he playing as part of the front three. Not as much as the center point of a three man midfield.

22 Sep 2026 08:50:37
Wirtz isn't even highlights player Taurus.

22 Sep 2026 09:07:00
So far Wirtz should be compared more to Luis Garcia or Benayoun than Philippe Coutinho.

22 Sep 2026 09:15:18
Thats why i say see those clips. See what coutinho did. Then ask if he can do it why can't I.
Essentially coutinho had same problem when he joined but he was a bargain basement signing and nobody had expectations so i didn't bother us. Plus we had suarez firing on all cylinders so coutinho was not the main guy

Wirtz is huge price and supposed to be the main guy.- that is why i dint believe in 100m ++ players. They never work.
Not one 100+m player has ever worked not even one not for any club bar maybe ronaldo.
Not even one.
Yet big clubs keep making these signings.

22 Sep 2026 09:26:32
I have been living in Germany for the past three years, and the way Bundesliga fans revere him is how PL fans revere Gerrard.

However, Wirtz is more of a high volume player than a big moments player. At Leverkusen, everything went through him, and to be honest he was very good at running the games. He would drop deep, float all over the pitch, make nice touches, keep the ball moving, and find nice passes to the wing-backs. However, he was not a highlights reel player even in Bundesliga. While he can sometime score good long range goals, he doesn't have the technique/power of Dom. While his first touch and ball control is elite, he can't get past people while dribbling like Coutinho or Rogers because he doesn't have that acceleration. While he is a good passer, he is not like Trent. The issue is that the team really needs to be built around him to maximize his talents. And it is very different to how in PL the star players are generally who also have the biggest moments. I think all of this would have been much less of an issue had he been able to show his abilities consistently for us. Right now he looks so short of confidence that even the things that he is undeniably elite at (first touch, manipulating space, etc) seem to be deserting him. I can only hope that Iraola and Klopp together can help him shine. He seems like a nice lad and I really want him to do well.

{Ed025's Note - sometimes TKA you just have to admit you signed a lemon mate..

22 Sep 2026 09:34:00
Personally I think Florian would be better if he was playing as part of a three with us no matter who the other two were. i know it's a mute point because Iraola doesn't play that way and the thinking behind it is to get him close to Isak but I just think he's getting too isolated up there.

Its like we're playing with a from two.

22 Sep 2026 10:28:49
Wirtz needs to get in the gym, he's brushed off the ball so easily.

22 Sep 2026 10:39:48
He's not a lemon, has loads of ability, we just need to see it.

{Ed025's Note - if its yellow, looks like a lemon and smells like a lemon then its usually a lemon Ecogsi...admitting it seems to be the problem mate..

22 Sep 2026 10:50:47
Watching videos of Coutinho is a genius idea. I wonder why no one thought of that before. Just let him watch videos of Coutinho, download it into his brain, and we'd have a Coutinho regen in our team. Maybe we should let all our forwards watch videos of Messi while we're at it too so that we'd truly have a world class forward line ;)

22 Sep 2026 11:58:12
I think you might have the wrong kind of idea of the kind of player Wirtz is, OP, thekoparmy is pretty spot on in his description of the player. Wirtz is a combination/connection kind of player who links things up all across the left side of the opposition half. You need a functioning midfield, a left back that combines with him and a forward (the way Schick and Wirtz worked together rotating up front was a work of art) who works with him for him to be the kind of player that he can be.

I very much agree that Wirtz looks a player short of confidence and that the criticism looks like it's going to his head and affecting him, he hasn't been anywhere near as good as he can be in critical moments. Still he does keep trying and doesn't let a poor start affect him to the point of just giving up for the rest of the game, he continues showing for the ball everywhere, running non-stop off the ball, making the kinds of runs off the ball to make space for others that he needs to. So you can say that he is lacking in confidence for sure, but at the same time he has the mentality and the awareness to do the basic things that a team player needs to do.

His understanding with Isak is actually incredibly poor right now, sometimes Isak wants the ball inside of the block and Wirtz pokes it around the defenders the other way around, and sometimes it's the reverse, they just never seem like they are on the same page. I expect that this will not always be the case, and it will invariably improve over time.

Yes Wirtz was very very poor against Bournemouth. At the same time if some of the very good chances he created the previous games were finished and if he had got at least one of the goals that he could very well have scored (such as the excellent finish from the assist by the borderline offside Frimpong) his numbers wouldn't actually be very shabby. I still think he is a top top player and he really needs to show it in a Liverpool shirt soon. I believe we will start to see a better version of him very soon though.

{Ed025's Note - hmmmm..

22 Sep 2026 12:05:10
Find it funny people say Coutinho was only good under klopp which is a straight up Lie, the kid was Brilliant from his 1st game under BR and scored and assisted a lot in his 1st 6 months at the club.

Also Coutinho cost 8 million £ not 110 million +. Right now Coutinho was twice the player Wirtz is but it could change if Wirtz starts doing something sometime soon maybe 🙏.

22 Sep 2026 13:13:47
Ahh."if only". those 2 words are becoming a regular feature when analysing Wirtz. if only he did this. if only the others did that. if only he tied his laces tighter..

22 Sep 2026 14:21:10
Last fan of Slot, I'd argue Rice and Caicedo have justified their price tags with what they've brought to their respective teams (granted Chelsea have been a mess, but Caicedo hasn't)

22 Sep 2026 16:09:59
@shanklys ghost I think what we expect from Wirtz will never happen. By we, I mean the English media. He is just not that player, never was even at Leverkusen. He is not a highlights reel player, he is and has always been a system player. He can't win you matches alone, but as he showed at Leverkusen, in the right system he can make you win matches consistently.

Maybe the penny will never drop for him in PL, but I sincerely hope that it does, because I would really love him to shine for us. In the right environment he raises the floor of the team significantly, just because of how a high volume player he is.

22 Sep 2026 16:47:52
We just need 9 other outfield players then to compliment Wirtz by the sounds.

22 Sep 2026 17:40:01
Sounding like that to me too JK.

22 Sep 2026 19:03:21
Indeed, Dracred. To even compare Coutinho to Wirtz is bonkers because they are not even the same type of player and both offer very different things.

And just so we are clear, Cou's best work was done as a wide (left) no. 10, not in behind the striker because we essentially played with two strikers with Suarez/Studge while under Klopp, we played with Bobbie in the false 9.

Again, I do not allow nostalgia to trick me into believing in things that literally did not happen back in the day.

22 Sep 2026 19:03:30
9? No. Just a functioning midfield that know when to run and when to sit deep. We want wirtz forward connecting with isak and barcola, yet he's coming deep to get the ball while szobo flicks his hair and gravy loses the ball.

You don't buy a Ferrari and take it off roading.

23 Sep 2026 11:38:30
Agree totally with Taurus about couts.

22 Sep 2026 05:26:38
When dom goes through a period of not scoring, which he will as all players do, what will he offer?

This is a genuine question.

His passing is fairly average and not better than macca really. He does have high stamina to run about but he can't press or tackle and rarely wins duels which makes him a passenger when defending.

I think his goals often gloss over the rest of his tool kit which is fairly limited. He also tends to leave big gaps due to his runs up front. He reminds me of Patrick berger in that sense, another player with a hammer shot who scored rockets all the time but didn't offer much else.

I think if we want to try and find space for both Dom and wirtz then we do need a high energy DM who can mark, press and tackle. There's honestly not many around.

I honestly think a season playing right wing might be a big benefit to both Dom and the team. We have nobody that can play there and it would help to teach him positional discipline the same way it did Gerrard.

Just my two cents.

22 Sep 2026 06:29:42
Gakpo has been our best forward player so far.

22 Sep 2026 07:05:25
He runs a lot which got him "He was the best player" award last season from the posters. He is henderson with a better technique.

22 Sep 2026 07:35:25
He can and does press.

22 Sep 2026 08:24:08
jesus when a player has a bad game or two the knives are out Wirtz I understand but Dom?

22 Sep 2026 08:48:36
Henderson was a better footballer than Szobo.

22 Sep 2026 08:53:40
Wirtz is offering nothing but running and seems to be getting a pass.

So I'll go with that - lots of effort and running.

These scenarios are fun.

22 Sep 2026 09:08:45
Totally different players.

22 Sep 2026 09:15:55
Corners and set pieces.

22 Sep 2026 09:31:38
Problem we have in midfield is the best midfielder we have is the only one not on a long contract 😂

The worst one gets paid the most, make it make sense.

22 Sep 2026 12:08:13
Dom is a very good presser, but he is a very poor ball winner. This is why he was so good leading the press from the front from the number 10 position. I would say that the number 10 is actually probably his best position, though he has said his favorite position is as a deep lying midfielder. That being said though, he was good in the number 10 because the real number 10 in our side the title winning season was Mo, and Dom effectively played like Hendo did with Mo on the right side, forming triangles with the fullback on the right with Mo coming into the right half space like a 10.

I would also add that I think Dom is really good at carrying the ball upfield, but when he gets into advanced positions his decision making is often not the best, and he doesn't have the ability to execute an incisive pass. He actually has a very good range of passing but he needs time to pick a pass and is very average at hitting those passes quick and first time from midfield. Which is why he could make better use of that from the right back position.

He is one of the best free kick takers in Europe and his delivery from a dead ball is frequently very good, so that's a plus. I also don't think he is as poor at winning duels on average than he is made out to be, but he can also turn in wretched performances in that regard like the 1 duel won against Fulham. He has a lot to do to prove that he is one of the premier midfielders in Europe, I'm sure he believes that he is in that tier of players and it's good to be confident, but surely he should know there is huge space for him to improve.

22 Sep 2026 19:05:19
Szobo is a handsome bloke who scores the odd banger so gets away with consistently poor performances.

When he presses he chooses the wrong moments, opening up pass g lanes for the opposition. His passing is wayward for the most part, he runs a lot but to little avail. And his attitude seems wrong.

21 Sep 2026 22:33:11
To the szobo 10 talk. What goddamn player have people seen play over the past three years. Dom can run he can shoot and he can pass over long distances. He is a worse version of Valverde. A limited player that would best be a water carrier at RB or CM in a 4 3 3.

Ask Dom to create anything and he can't. He couldn't in Leipzig he can't here. Sadly Wirtz will end up like De bruyne at Chelsea and he will be a city player in 5 years because cherki can't run. Please people be patient and don't get impressed by Everton fans like Carragher.

22 Sep 2026 00:13:01
well he runs around like Wirtz. I'm sure he can at least do the one thing that Wirtz is capable of.

22 Sep 2026 01:11:47
Szoboszlai would be great on the right of a three man midfield, unfortunately Iraola has never played that way. Szoboszlai isn't good enough to play in a two man midfield or as a number 10.

Wirtz has an infinitely higher ceiling than Szoboszlai and is worth preserving with. Dropping him for Szoboszlai is like giving up on your dream girl to go back to the ex that you don't like.

22 Sep 2026 01:07:38
If Szobo is so good in the No. 10 position, why would we go out and spend £116m on Wirtz then? I don't think anyone who works in football recruitment professionally would advise the club to spend that kind of money on someone who primarily plays as a No. 10 if they genuinely thought Szobo was already good enough in the same position.

I know Hughes might not be very good at his job, but come on, even he can't possibly be that stupid. Surely even he would realise that spending £116m on a player for a position where we supposedly already have a top-class option would be a bit ridiculous.

22 Sep 2026 01:34:59
No idea where you stand on Dom, you went from praising his abilities to calling him a water boy in one sentence. I know some people like to 'ride the fence' but that's the most aggressive form of it I've ever seen, fairplay.

Obviously you haven't actually been watching Cherki, he would run rings around Wirtz at the moment. Why would city want Wirtz for his running abilities in 5 years when he's 28 and not even a good runner now? What is this twilight zone of a post.

22 Sep 2026 05:31:01
Tô an extent I agree. Dom can smash a banger that's for sure. But I've never seen him demonstrate consistent long range passing like VVD, Trent or even macca to be honest.

He has high energy but then is awful at pressing and can't tackle so his high energy isn't really useful on defence.

His crossing is decent and he can get about the pitch a lot, for me he should play RW.

22 Sep 2026 06:36:14
It's crazy that the worse Wirtz performs Dom seems to get crapper and crapper as a player on here. i wonder why?

22 Sep 2026 07:51:35
FM, my theory is that defending Wirtz is simply attacking another player. Whataboutism.
People struggle to find positives so resort to criticising another or other players.
That said, I think the criticism and defending of players very often goes too far on here.


I definitely think ego (posters') comes into it. I'm no different and I find myself defending our players, some that I don't even rate, to fans of other teams!

22 Sep 2026 08:49:20
I can understand defending to other teams fans but we are all LFC fans here. Deep down we all want EVERY player to play out of his skins every game. But just be honest about it when they are and when they aren't. For example I agree with what Carragher was saying about LFC fans convincing themselves Wirtz does be playing well. They are so longing for him to work out, and I get that. But the truth is he is really struggling and it's not just about what other players aren't doing.

Now I'm seeing posts saying he needs until the end of the season. Really? Two seasons to settle? if it was another teams fanbase we'd think it was hilarious. Thats where Dom comes in. With the common consensus being that the two of them may not work in the same team some fans are now attacking Dom. He was our best player last year.25 g/a from MF. Granted hasn't started well this season but still at least has a few goals. I know who I would rather play against from the two.

22 Sep 2026 10:30:41
FM, I agree with most of that but what I mean about ego is that a lot of people will attack Szobozslai and others rather than admit they *could* be wrong about Wirtz.
It's not really about Wirtz. If they've nailed their colours to the Wirtz mast and he isn't performing it becomes personal.

It was the same with Nunez.
We all get it wrong. I thought Baros was going to be good, argued in his favour but ended up with egg on my chops 😁.

22 Sep 2026 11:57:34
I see what you mean Rigsby. Having not watched much of Wirtz in Germany I can only judge him by what he does for us. I find it very easy to judge him on that sample size. He's been a disappointment. No two ways about it. If he doesn't pick up his game he'll be back in Fermany with Bayern by next summer.

22 Sep 2026 12:22:18
Wow when are you reds going stop complaining first about VVD then Gravenberch, then Wirtz and now Sboz. We are getting every man and his dog telling how the team should play or the team the coach should pick some of you think that you can do better than the coaching staff.

The problem ìs you have been spoiled by Klopp and now you all are PlayStation managers. Just get behind the players and the coaches and the club you are becoming like that shower down the east lancs road. YNWA.

22 Sep 2026 19:08:17
Fully agree, Iwillbeared. Seems like it is the same ol' "Crabs in a bucket" mentality among many in our fan base.

In order to big up a player, we have to drag down another one.

Pathetic mentality, really.

22 Sep 2026 19:11:33
It seems to be a case that Wirtz takes the flack for himself and the whole side while szobo gets a free pass, then when somebody calls out the fact he's been poor and a limited player people on here get a bit touchy and start bringing wirtz up as a comparison.

The reality is put them both up for sale, top teams would have your hand off for Wirtz, you'd struggle to find anyone for szobo. Some players are worth persisting with, others aren't.

Add to that szobo has the ego of a man who's the top of his game when we couldn't be further from the truth.

I find it funny this 'we're all Liverpool fans' thing comes up when a personal favourite is starting to rightly receive flack.

Wirtz, szobo and a few others haven't been doing enough at all.