07 Feb 2023 12:21:02
So. if City are stripped of their titles and they're awarded to us. that would be 4 PL titles plus all the other trophies. Does that enhance FSG legacy as owners? Even if we're not awarded the titles, I am sure there would be many fans who would make the argument that those titles should be ours. I am ambivalent to it to be fair.

But it did make me think a bit about the current state of affairs and how the owners are perceived. I know we're not perfect, but in the context of this investigation - the allegations surmise that City needed an almighty bending of the rules to build their championship winning depth to sustain this success for so long. If that is proven as illegitimate, then surely that can only enhance FSG as owners?

Thoughts? :)

{Ed001's Note - what is that sound I hear? Sounds like a can being opened and lots of worms slithering off....}

1.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 12:36:40
I would say it's more a sign of what a great job Klopp did personally.

2.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 12:38:58
What happened happened regardless. For example I was in Paris last year for the final and it was a day that had some of the best and worst moments in my life. If for example something happened now and we got awarded that final and we're proclaimed winners it's not going to make me feel better or worse about that day.

So to your point I don't think initially it would have much bearing tbh. I think in the future as kids who didn't live through the time talk about it, like I would the 80s now, they might look at it as a much more successful period of time and talk about how great it was differently than anyone who has actually lived through it.

So in very short no but for future generations potentially yes.

3.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 12:39:20
Ed1 - just saying…. lol.

4.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 12:42:53
IF City were found guilty and they were fined and had points deducted but that was it, do you think us and other teams would launch a legal battle to get their trophies, titles? It opens so many cans of worms, what about the teams City beat on their way to relegation? Could they have a legal case if they were relegated by 1, 2, 3 points etc? I personally think the Premier League are just flexing and saying to them and others - get your house in order. They will be fined at most and that's it. It has too many ramifications for the Premier League. Im not condoning it, I'm just saying it will amount to a fart in a hurricane at best.

5.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 12:55:15
nope Adam, I would say its everybody involved in the club top to bottom.

6.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 13:25:59
If found guilty how about city get an eye-watering fine, the PL divides the money by 19 and gives it to the other teams to gift to their local charities. If only the world really worked like that.
For a more realistic punishment how about a points deduction of maybe 15 to probably stop them winning the next season. And a season transfer ban like Chelsea got with a fine.
But all this title stripping is just desperate, I wonder if fans will be demanding such harsh punishments when our club is put under the microscope.

{Ed025's Note - good point mate..

7.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 13:34:38
If they were stripped of titles I would prefer it to go down as no winner awarded. There is going to be no triumph if they were respectivley awarded to teams other then the record books, so what would be the point? And it isn't as simple as remove city and we win the league, we were arguably as good as we were because we needed to be to beat city. Also, if city weren't about where do the players they had go, the likes of Aguero and Yaya?

If it was me handing out the penalties, and IF they are guilty. Then I would strip them of all trophies in those seasons and leave it as no winner, and remove their status as a PL club (more worms, where would they end up, the EFL wouldn't have to accept them) . This has to be a punishment that activley acts as a detterent for others in the future, if it is just a hefty fine, others can just build it into the accounts in the future and effectivley laugh it off.

8.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 13:45:44
Faithworks For me, it proves nothing about FSG. We know they ran us the way they did and were successful by hiring Klopp (forever grateful to John Henry for allowing himself to be convinced and hire Klopp) and giving him the funds he needed (even after his tapping up spree) to get the players he asked for to compete and win. Nobody can take that away from them no matter how much they try esp. with what we know now about who and what we were up against. They have a winning legacy and that's that, for me regardless of what happens to City.

Now IF found guilty, City should be stripped of EVERYTHING they have won during the period and NOBODY should be awarded their trophies. Let the asterix be on all those years they won things for posterity which IMO, will put the absolute stench of their despicable conduct on there for all posterity. The titles we lost to them? I want NO part of them, personally but that's just me.

They should also be relegated to a mandatory 2 years purgatory to the Championship like Marseille and Juve suffered for match-fixing along with a transfer ban for a couple of years. I say all of this cos it is based on actual precedent.

{Ed025's Note - but this is not match fixing oli..

9.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 13:47:51
If stripped there will be no one awarded.

10.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 13:50:32
If anything good happens to the club, it's Klopp who got us there.
Anything bad, we'll that's FSG, Ljinders and Curtis Jones fault.

11.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 14:22:38
There is no point in stripping titles, we all class City title wins as nonsense anyway, they could win 30 titles and will still be a small club, they are and always will be associated with fraud just like their plastic fans.

12.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 14:26:44
You forgot TAA in there, Tristan.

13.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 15:13:19
@Ed25, indeed it is not match fixing per se BUT it is sever impropriety that spilled over onto the pitch that gave them a strong competitive advantage over their rivals who were doing things the right thing which is essentially, what match-fixing is set up to do, really. Just my take.

Also remember that some of the charges have to do with financial fraud due to misrepresentation of information on bank records and tax statements which if found guilty, the people who signed off on all this crap could be looking at white collar crimes for which people have gone to jail for. Like I have said to City fans, it's a tsunami that could be coming their way should even 20 of these 100 changes stick.


@Tristan you forgot to add Fab Carvalho and Thiago to that list.

{Ed025's Note - I’m not making excuses for city oli. In fact I hope they throw the book at them. But they will have very clever people who will try to justify their actions mate. It is still only an allegation yet and it will be very interesting to see the outcome..

14.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 15:40:40
Tough one to call. I don’t think I’d want the titles, but on the other hand if they were stripped we achieved a domestic treble last season.

15.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 16:06:36
Why now? Why not back when they was last investigated did they not unearth the evidence then? Feels like a witch hunt. I don’t want there titles awarded to us. As for punishment I don’t care.

{Ed001's Note - the previous investigation was by UEFA and was not able to cover most of the events involved. Hardly a witch hunt, they were proven by UEFA to be guilty but then City appealed to CAS and dragged it out until most of the offences timed out. So they have not been punished for their offences yet.}

16.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 16:07:48
Generally speaking I agree with most here that I wouldn't really want the Leagues, but if it meant Gerrard lost his title of never winning the League I would get some joy from that.

{Ed001's Note - in almost any other sport, if someone is caught cheating and the title is stripped, it is handed to the person/team that finished highest without cheating. It is an oddity of football that seems to feel it is ok to accept being cheated out of a prize.

There are exceptions such as the 1988 100m Olympic final, when 6 of the 8 failed drug tests but still Carl Lewis (who was one who failed and had been suspended while a college athlete on at least two occasions for doping violations) got the gold for finishing second, while Ben Johnson was the only one disqualified. Which does seem harsh.}

17.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 16:31:09
@Ed001 I remember that race in 1988 and everything leading up to it. Seriously, I do not remember any 100m race that gathered SO much attention and anticipation before that race and I have not see any like that since. It felt like who ever lost that race btw Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis should just hang them up and retire, it was that intense. I felt sorry for Ben Johnson cos I think the pressure got to him and he was scared of losing even tho, he was the favourite.

Now that 6 of the other runners failed drug tests is hilarious BUT Carl Lewis' failed drug test was kept from the U. S public for years and years afterwards until it was disclosed and glossed over. Just like Lance Armstrong and many others, really. Americans are VERY good at such things.

{Ed001's Note - I just feel it is a shame for the 2 guys who were clean and all those who never got to the final who were clean and missed their chance because of a bunch of cheats.}

18.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 17:10:29
I totally agree its a shame Ed, as a fan, without a time machine I will never be able to replace the disappointment of the time with joy and celebration, and that's why personally I'm pretty ambivalent and apethetic, but I do think the players and staff deserve it, I was just focusing that point on Gerrard as he is the one who has generally had that negative focus from the outside.

19.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 16:32:28
ED25, I never said you were making excuses for City and like you, I hope they get the full fury of the law and punishment just like Bury and Bolton did if not worse.

{Ed025's Note - i never said you did oli, but i have my doubts about the severity of the punishment mate, it would be very messy for them to take titles off them i feel..

20.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 17:46:17
If they are in breach strip them of the titles, fine them heavily and, most importantly, kick them out of the league.

The end.

Make it quite clear what will happen to any teams who do that in the future or have found to do that in the past.

One thing I would say is that City have again been charged with failing to assist the investigation (or however it is worded) . If you don’t assist with the UEFA investigation and do the same with the premier league one that suggest you have something to hide.

21.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 18:48:54
People aren’t answering the question lol it’s not about why should happen, what I’m asking is - do FSG and their way of running the club get proven right of City are proven guilty?

We have been compared to city this whole time and the idea that Klopp has turned lemons into superstars is made against the backdrop of City’s owners being able to buy Pep whoever he wants. But what if that spending power is proven wrong? Doesn’t hat mean that FSG we’re right in how they approach building the club? I mean whether we’re awarded the titles or not, you can easily make the claim that we would have been as worthy winners and done it without having to cook the books to build the squad.

Anyways, I think it can only enhance FSGs legacy as owners.

22.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 18:56:09
In 2018 I was working with a guy who had no interest in any sort of football or team.
One night when out having a drink I bumped into my work mate and out of the blue he started telling me about a women he new who worked at Man City and that he had been having a drink with her earlier in the night and he asked her what she did in her position at Man City while informing him what her position of employment was at Man City.

she went on to divulge that her job was to move money all over the place for man city and to hide it then stopped speaking about it anymore obviously realising what she was saying.
I know this sounds like a likely story but I assure you this real happened.

23.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 19:27:28
Tristan - you can’t have a pop at FSG for the way they run, or allow the club to be run, but then deny them the plaudits for hiring Klopp. That’s not how management works. They either take both the stick and plaudits for what they have done well and done badly or none of it. I do a bloody good job where I work and I know full well my boss gets credit for it. Of course he does, he hired me, me manages and directs me. If I fail the powers above him won’t be having a go at me, they’ll be on his back. That’s how it works. If you are accountable, which FSG are for LFC then they deserve both the applause and critiques they have earned.

24.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 21:20:53
Westwood, steady now, bro. Don’t you know that FSG get no credit for anything good that has happened to us under THEIR own tenure which includes actually hiring Jurgen Klopp whereas their the ones who write the checks including Klopp’s checks? They only get the smoke for all the bad things including Klopp’s mistakes which he actually admits are his.

With the way some people talk, you would think Klopp hired the owners to work for him and not the other way around.

25.) 07 Feb 2023
07 Feb 2023 21:55:32
She sounds like the type of person a huge business like City could trust, albey. Until she has a few blue WKDs.