03 Oct 2023 23:47:01
This reminds me a Mayday episode I seen once. You know, the air crash investigation show. Basically a plane stalled mid-air, the co-pilot recognised the issue and but late to communicate it and even then the head pilot either didn’t receive the info or act upon it. Then the plane crashed. Through the investigation they made modifications to how co and head pilot communicate and moved to empower the voice of the co-pilot that would help lead to action.

I think the referee association are at this same crossroads. They need to micro manage the guidelines for the communications between VAR and on-pitch ref so it clearly communicates the rationale and final decision. It isn’t good enough to say “check complete”. Other sports do this very well and PGMOL should be calling in leaders from NBA. NFL, rugby etc to advise these changes to the game.

Have said it before elsewhere, but they also need to work on diversifying the game. Too much of the same yobo blokey blokes running the game. It’s no wonder change is slow when you have an incestuous system that just protects itself.

Finally, not buying corruption at all. They’re too stupid incompetent dumb and stale to concoct some kind of corruption.

{Ed001's Note - but you have said there is corruption in this very post when you refer to the system protecting itself. That is corruption. So you do think there is corruption, you just don't understand what corruption is.}

1.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:00:53
Ed1 - I get that interpretation by definition. But I’m talking about there not being a corrupt regime deliberately working against Liverpool like a lot of people seem to be making that point.

For me, this is like systemic racism or a systemic power imbalance towards men. It’s the same minds thinking alike, doing the same things and that creates a system that inheritently protects itself. When I think of corruption I think of a intentional dishonesty, changing outcomes for an agenda.

I don’t believe that is at play and ultimately is unhelpful to making change. This is a system issue that requires diversity of mind and real leaders to drive the change.

{Ed001's Note - ok, whatever. You are still saying it is corruption and then trying to say it isn't.}

2.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:04:49
If Darren England is not stood down for three months minimum (I think he should be outright fired) then these mistakes are doomed to repeat themselves. It is just incompetence of the highest possible level he had every opportunity to halt the play even before the freekick. It's almost impossible to do what he did. He can't be back in a job week after next. This needs a proper suspension to wake up the Var referees. I think they treat a VAR duty as a day off from the "real stuff". Unprofessional and incompetent to the max. It cannot slide as it is simply too obvious. It's like a crossing guard waving on a car when a small child is crossing the road and there's someone shouting at you that there's a child there. Like literally he is barely present in his job. He has to go. It's simply too big of mistake. And if there's not proper punishment here then all hope is lost for refereeing in the country.

3.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:31:05
Davey, I couldn't agree more mate.

4.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:34:49
All teams should refuse to play when he's on duty until he's sacked. But that won't happen.

5.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:36:47
Ed001, is the corruption linked to UAE and Man City or is it a system protecting itself?

{Ed001's Note - or is it both? Why does it have to be one or the other? The only thing that is certain is that it is at least one of them.}

6.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:37:49
Honestly haven't they just screwed it up even more? I mean the explanation they gave doesn't fit anymore seeing as how the replay operator is constantly saying onfield decision is offside multiple times and they are saying they are happy with it.

7.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:43:40
Corrupt on every level. It’s to easy to get away with. They answer to themselves they set there own punishments outsiders not allowed to question or criticise without a monetary penalty. They may not be taking cash bribes but something is definitely amiss it’s akin to blatters FiFA. Call me all the fools you want. It’s the Scouse in me, we question, your not pulling the wool over my eyes.

{Ed001's Note - that is the biggest issue, the complete lack of any oversight. Anyone who questions is punished, while their own offences are brushed away as simple human error. That is fine if you are going to take action to try and remove the errors, but they have not taken any action to improve matters. They have taken action to increase their income with a nice TV show to tell us how they were right though. So clearly money is the key mover for the PGMOL. Which is very much akin to Blatter, and his protege's, FIFA.}

8.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 00:54:44
Ed1 - not sure why you’re caught up in trying to dissect my interpretation of corruption versus yours. I gave you a fairly good explanation of my view and then my interpretation of corruption because you made the point. Yet you seem to be more interested in the use of the word, it’s definition and your interpretation of corruption. The system can be corrupt by all the points that I made. But I think you’re saying it’s corrupt in that there is some higher power trying to manipulate the game. I don’t believe that to be the case.

Anyways, what are we doing here mate? Lol this is secondary to the point I was making about the real issue is and some ideas to change it.

{Ed001's Note - I am not saying anything other than you stated that this corruption was happening and then ended by saying you didn't think it was corrupt. I was just pointing out that you were contradicting yourself. Never once did I suggest anything else, you are reading more into my words than was there.}

9.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 01:07:15
Ed001, it doesn't have to be one or the other. Do you believe this is linked to Man City and why?
That's a bold claim. We were playing Spurs in September and I think you're tilting at windmills bringing City into it.
It's ludicrous without any proper evidence.

{Ed001's Note - ok well coming from you, with the crap you have been posting, I would rather you thought me ludicrous than you agreed with me to be honest. As for no proper evidence, what do you want me to do? Produce a paper trail of proof that City have cheated? Only that has been done before with irrefutable proof of their pay offs and financial shenanigans. Unfortunately the only way to obtain such evidence is illegally, which makes the evidence completely useless.

Thankfully, we always have people like you to claim it is nonsense though, even though you have even less evidence. You seem to think that the only way a team can profit from a result is if they are directly involved in the match, but as Barcelona and the Calciopoli scandal should tell you, the best way for the team to benefit is by affecting the results of those who are likely to challenge them at the top of the table.}

10.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 01:45:11
I fully understand that, when emotion is stripped away, there are serious matters that should be addressed, but won’t as there is far, far too much money involved, but honest to God, I really do wish I was about 9 or 10:again and could just go to the match and be entertained happy when we won and sad when we lost but always ready to go to the next one.

11.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 02:09:43
As maximus endorsed, shtick together lads and nevermind this dividing rubbish. Irishman is wise ?.

12.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 05:58:37
PMGOL is an officiating body that has massive amounts of influence over our game, yet it has miniscule amounts of oversight, professionalism and transparency. Because recent events have involved one of the most prestigious clubs in the world who will almost certainly be challenging for silverware, they have been forced into action. Imagine what goes on when they're not under ferocious scrutiny, PMGOL is precisely the sort of organization open to corruption.

13.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 06:22:15
Theres only one way to prove there's corruption is for a police or govt investigation, monitor the officials bank accounts their passports their physical property ownership whether they have affiliations to any club owners outside of officiating prem games. They should check all the var teams. They should check betting patterns on the day of the game of players and officials. Unfortunately corruption in football can only come in 2 forms players bunging a game and refs bunging a game the one more likely is the refs but its a cert players bet on games. Too many things not right about football. there's an arrogance from sky they try to play Arsenal and Spurs up as bigger than Liverpool its as if they try to belittle Liverpool its as if they are desperate for them to fail. So also Skys involvement should be investigated do they get to put pressure on officials by saying var too slow our customers need fast decisions. They put money in but then forget its customers money not theirs. So if they want to root it out or discover it, a police investigation or a ministerial investigation. But i guess its like asking Hitler to investigate rumours of person war crimes. Its not going to happem.

14.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 07:14:23
I agree with ed1 100%. big fancy tripd abroad, v well paid and v well looked after to gain infulence . no doubt in my mind.

15.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 08:14:43
Ed001, you are the one making claims without any evidence. You even admit that you have no evidence.
You are even going on about Barcelona and Calciopoli; that is not evidence.
I said it was ludicrous for you to make claims like you have because there was the UAE story in The Times. That publication had the sense not to suggest that it was 'corruption' though.
And why is the best way for a team to benefit is by affecting teams that are likely to challenge them at the top? Can you explain that and how it worked for Barcelona and with Calciopoli, please? I think you have just made that up but if you can have a go at explaining it, that'd be great.
Can you also explain how and why City have decided that we are most likely to challenge them at the top, please?

{Ed001's Note - are you really this dense? You need it explaining how the best way to win without it being too suspicious is to ensure that no one else can possibly get as many points? I give up you are being deliberately obtuse and facetious. If you have to be told and explained everything then you deserve to be lied to. It just smacks of wilful ignorance. Still this is better than your attempts to be funny, which were frankly embarrassing last night.}

16.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 09:14:23
Well, I wouldn't say it was the best way and I asked how it worked for Barcelona and Calciopoli.
I don't have to be told everything and have everything explained to me but we are talking about your views.
Your views are not common knowledge and some of them are quite extreme and who else can explain them? I take it that you don't want to or that you can't and that'll do for now.
I wasn't trying to be funny last night, I was being sarcastic. And don't be embarrassed on my behalf; it's just a feeling and it'll pass.

{Ed001's Note - you clearly do have to be told everything. It is not difficult to work out that stopping your opponents racking up many points makes it easier to win the league without having to fix as many of your own results to raise suspicions.

My views are quite extreme? Really? You really are just trolling.

You really are just a troll then? If you weren't even trying to be funny, then you were just trolling to be a dick, don't do that it is pathetic. I would never waste my time being embarrassed for you, it is just sad that you lack the intelligence to understand why you should be embarrassed for yourself.}

17.) 04 Oct 2023
04 Oct 2023 16:06:00
There's two main schools of thought with this. Either:

1. There is wide spread corruption and officials are part of some back alley, shady conspiracy involving fixing matches/ betting syndicate type thing - City never involved in these type of calls so some believe they are offering bribes etc; - similar shady suspicions and some people's belief given the magnitude of issues seen and zero action taken to rectify such issues.

2. The officials are completely incompetent and/ or only human so it is inevitable that mistakes will happen - the PGMOL acknowledges (some) of these and then claims others were the 'correct' decision based upon. a clear distortion of the same rule they read out the previous week

These are the main 2 sides of this discussion but is there a 3rd?

3. The officials do make mistakes but, the VAR officials, rather than actually point out a glaring error to an official, instead is used to back that official? Mike Dean admitted that he refused to call the officials attention to the blatant hair pull on Cucarella because the ref was 'a mate' and had already had a hard day and he did not want to make it worse.

So instead of VAR properly intervening it is being used to help friends? This would then indicate a form of institutionalism that we see in other professions - they all band together and have each others back, no matter what wrongdoing has occurred.

Now whilst I commend the team ethic, it is surely at a detriment to the actual role?

Whilst not corruption as in the first thought above, surely making wrong calls to back your colleagues because you do want to see them under fire or in trouble is still a form of corruption? At the very least such wilful disregard of ones duties, deliberate dishonesty and calculated fraudulence is certifiable as gross misconduct in every other profession

The most insane thing about all of this is that these issues have persisted since VAR was introduced and have only gotten worse - the fact that the PGMOL have not devised a plan to tackle these issues is simply gross mismanagement.

18.) 05 Oct 2023
05 Oct 2023 10:10:41
@Fbart it’s nice that you think the police or Government should investigate corruption. Who else would be better placed ?.