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24 Feb 2016 11:29:39
Morning
Question for ed002, with the proposed breakaway league will the FFP rules still apply to the teams in it, if not is this why certain teams are pushing very hard for this to happen especially after the comments of the Barcelona president highlighting the premier league tv deal?
{Ed002's Note - No the FFP rules won't apply to any teams breaking away. Certain teams are pushing hard because of commercial opportunities, because of the political situation in Spain, because of television and other media monies etc.. Twice already this season a proposal by two clubs to begin the breakaway in 2018 only received support from one other side – the others in general voted against it with either one or two abstaining. It pretty much ends the chance of an early breakaway. This though may simply have been posturing as they look to a more realistic date of 2022. Because of the World Cup and the general mess with high-end sponsors related to the WC and on-going issues at FIFA, the original pencilled in date of 2027 is back on the table. There will be a at least one more meeting this season - date has been set in April and I rather suspect that the clubs involved in these discussions will discuss the issue again as the situation with FIFA and UEFA is not going to change overnight.
What many are overlooking is a caveat to the Spanish TV agreement that, regardless of the new agreement kicking in means all sides will earn at least what they did last season (it might be this season, I would need to check) for six more seasons – this was reluctantly accepted by the other clubs simply to push through the deal. However, the only clubs protected by it are the only two that would potentially lose money – Real Madrid and Barcelona.}
1.) 24 Feb 2016 12:39:50
Hi eds2, not sure if you know how this breakaway league will happen, or if you even want to talk about it, but is it just a breakaway from the champions league and the teams will still be involved in their domestic leagues, or is it a breakaway from their domestic leagues as well?
I hope it's not a breakaway from the domestic league as it could have huge implications with football in our country as I'm sure the money would follow the high profile league which in turn could impact on the development of football in England. Our league could end up like the Scottish league (no disrespect intended), with teams struggling financially and then a slippery slope of poor quality football being played.
{Ed002's Note - It has been covered before but here goes. It remains very much an on-going issue with regular discussions on the matter between a dozen or more clubs.
Without going in to too much detail: (a) A number of clubs take the opportunity to meet and discuss various issues including changes in rules, club versus country issues, television and other media rights, the power of UEFA, exploitation issues for new technology streams, etc.. The meetings were annually but now they happen two and sometimes three times a year. There was a meeting in December – where there was a discussion about the state of FIFA, the situation with UEFA and a so far unpublished claim from a retired referee that the result of a Champions League game was influenced by a third party. These discussions also always turn to the possibility and structure of a breakaway pan European league. Several are ex-G14 clubs, several are not, and some clubs decline involvement in such discussions. (b) The plan is that at some point a number of clubs would break away from their national leagues and UEFA. They accept that they would be banned from all existing club competition and the players would initially be banned from all FIFA competitions as well, but know that FIFA would be looking to negotiate in any case. It would be the end of UEFA in all probability and UEFA are very aware of this. It would also result in a restructuring of many of the national leagues. (c) The clubs would renegotiate their television and media rights, rights of distribution via other streams etc.. (d) It remains the greatest fear of UEFA and all major national authorities that one day this will happen – which has resulted in a counter-proposal being drafted by UEFA. (e) Timing wise, two very prominent clubs want it to happen as soon as possible (2018) and they have the support of a third club - but most are looking at 2022 being a good option. A few clubs are looking at 2025 to 2027 and I suspect that could end up as the reality.
There is going to be a counter-proposal backed by UEFA to try and save their own skin which is soon to be tabled. The proposal is to rename and change the format of the UEFA Champions League to make it an elite closed-shop pan-European league with a fixed number of teams – and these would be the same teams every year. Although one FA has come out in support of that approach another has proposed a variant on it - effectively allowing entry for the champions of the 12 top ranked European leagues plus a fixed number of "elite" clubs. This fails somewhat in that the Champions in many cases will be in the elite group and not allowing replacements limits the competition rather. It would then require the restructuring of the Europa League and the possible introduction of a lower-tier European competition. Although they have yet to flesh out the detail, one major Football Association has given their support but I suspect they will struggle with others.
If the proposal for a breakaway goes ahead, there is every likelihood that the big money from television, sponsorship etc. would go with a breakaway league. It would completely rupture the operations of UEFA and I would expect it would require national associations like the FA to restructure their leagues. Nobody wants this but it is the eventual consequence I would expect. Initially it could be that there is a single 16 team league with 2 or 3 EPL teams making the initial plunge. If I had to speculate, I would think (1) you might eventually see something like five or six EPL teams leave for two-tier pan European league - but it won't be based on the UEFA rankings; (2) the Premier League would be disbanded as an organisation; (3) the FA would restructure in to two 20 team divisions with lower leagues regionalised as they were many years ago; (4) FIFA would ban all players from the breakaway teams from International football - perhaps rescinding that position to stop FIFA breaking up as well - they don't want further issues but the troubles are not going to go away. I could also see many teams lose their professional status. I would think we are probably 10 years away from any significant move at this time.
I hold a reasonably strong view in terms of the need to restructure football in Europe in any case. For me an eventual a breakaway pan-European league would force the restructuring of many of the national leagues, possibly resulting in a British league with perhaps only a couple of professional tiers and then regionalised amateur leagues below that. Financially I do not see that so many pro sides can be sustained within the sport which, like it or not, will see more and more money going in to the highest levels of the game. Governments will ensure that grassroots sport get funding but everything in the middle (Southern, Northern, Conference, Division 2, Scottish Divisions 1-3, League of Wales will not get the funding needed to continue on any sort of professional basis.}
2.) 24 Feb 2016 14:23:20
Thanks ed a fascinating read once again, YNWA.
3.) 24 Feb 2016 22:43:27
I know ed has said time and time again that it will happen, but I just don't want it to. We wouldn't be one of the teams in the first tier, so would be in the reformed English league, which wouldn't be as interesting without say a couple of United/ Chelsea/ Arsenal/ city.
If the two tier thing comes in ed, would there be relegation and promotion, so if we originally weren't in the pan Europe league, could we win the English league and earn a chance to play off for the tier 2?
{Ed002's Note - It depends when it happens as to what will happen to Liverpool. Right now there would certainly not be involvement from the club. Something could happen to change that.}
4.) 25 Feb 2016 03:59:59
While on performance we would not be involved, but how many teams from Germany or France or Spain or Italy have a bigger global fan base that we do? Ultimately those that can contribute to the most money will likely be in it.
06 Aug 2017 23:04:43
If he leaves so what that's what happens we will find someone to replace him.
30 Nov 2016 23:58:33
Understood, many thanks to you and all the other Eds for all the excellent work you do for the sites.
30 Nov 2016 22:19:49
Thanks for the update ed002, much appreciated.
{Ed002's Note - You are welcome - there are some good contributors but it easily runs away with itself. I would like to get it back but it is pretty essential to put that framework in place.}
27 May 2016 20:21:05
It will all depend if clubs are willing to pay the price Liverpool wants.