04 Apr 2020 15:27:59
Very disappointed that the club have opted to furlough some non-playing staff. The club has enough money to support them, they should not be going cap in hand to the government. Makes a mockery of the You'll Never Walk Alone mantra.

{Ed025's Note - most clubs will go down that route seano, sad actually but indicative of the times we live in mate..

1.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 15:47:49
You're right Ed, I was just hoping Liverpool would actually set a good example, sadly they haven't. I know football is a business but I thought it was supposed to stand for something more - obviously not.

{Ed025's Note - i does look that way seano, im sure they could stretch to looking after the guys and gals who keep the place running, even if its at the expense of the players who lets be honest can afford it mate..

2.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 15:56:35
I agree, although not sure about making a mockery of “you’ll never walk alone”.
Surely a club willing to spend £75m on a player can cover non-playing staffs wages? in fact I’m 100% certain they can but are taking advantage of government hands outs which I suppose is above board but it doesn’t sit right with me.

{Ed025's Note - nor me cobra..

3.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 16:02:04
Totally agree Sean and Ed25, shows a complete lack of class and empathy to what’s going on. A little ashamed of the club to be honest😥.

{Ed025's Note - im with you toe knee, i expected better mate..

4.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 16:13:02
So far as I can see the only reason to do it is greed. Very tone deaf from the club but in keeping with a pretty abysmal response from the Premier League generally, from players discussing a 30% cut - now they'll only be paid the annual salary of two nurses rather than three, boohoo - to the likes of Andros Townsend calling players 'easy targets', a man who gambled 46k with a few clicks of a phone.

A really appalling response so far - say what you like about the player but Ronaldo has been throwing money about left, right, and center back in Portugal to try and help people out during this crisis - a lot of players in the UK need to self reflect a little, realise how unbelievably fortunate they are, and perhaps give a little back to the community that pays their wages. The game is so morally vacuous it makes me sick.

{Ed025's Note - i cant argue with that seano..

5.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 16:13:53
I’m actually embarrassed to be a supporter right now if this is true. There must be enough cash sloshing around the club to have kept paying salaries for a few months at least. I’d understand it a bit more if they’d gone down this route if the situation had dragged on into, say, June, but to do it so soon has shocked me. Very poor if you ask me.

{Ed025's Note - it leaves a very nasty taste in the mouth johnny..

6.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 16:20:40
I think there are some decisions being taken at the moment Ed025 that could see a lot of people turning away from football when the current situation is resolved. I am disgusted we’Ve done this already, just gives more ammunition for other clubs supporters to throw at us.

{Ed025's Note - a lot of the clubs will be doing the same johnny, you would think the top clubs would set an example though and with the amount of money in the game it seems very petty, i would like to see the players step up to the plate and collectively guarantee the staffs wages myself, god knows they can afford to mate..

7.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 16:25:50
I've seen we have put non playing staff on furlough (which by definition is temporary leave) however does that automatically mean that they are going to apply to the government to pay the rest?
Sorry if I'm being a bit thick but all it said in the statement is they will be getting 100%.
I'm just not sure if that's 100% from the club or 80 from government and 20 from the club.

{Ed002's Note - 80% from HMG and 20% from the club.}

8.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 17:05:51
Whilst the staff are on furlough, they won’t be losing out on income as the club will top up the extra 20%.

9.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 17:02:19
That's disappointing ed002 but thank you for clarifying.

Obviously we don't know the figures of what the wage bill is but on the face of it. When clubs pay millions for transient employees and get millions from us mere mortals through tuning in week in week out it feels like we could of picked up the bill for a couple of months.

Whilst it's great what the government have offered we will have to pay it at some point, one way or another.

10.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 17:19:00
"Whilst the staff are on furlough, they won’t be losing out on income as the club will top up the extra 20%. "

True, but the tax payer is now basically footing 80% of the wages bill for non-playing staff.

{Ed001's Note - it really is sad as they players themselves could have easily contributed enough to cover all 100%.}

11.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 17:29:24
This discussion is fundamentally flawed, there is no work for the staff at the moment and they are being paid 100%.

Like for most businesses the role of managing cash flow during this pandemic is paramount, and with no fixed end in sight to not take the help offered by the government would be foolish and may place the furloughed staff in a much worse position in the medium term - especially with the elimination of all matchday revenue. There also seems to be a mismatch in peoples understanding of a companies 'worth' and what they actually hold in cash.

I'm sure the players will take a pay reduction soon, but the PFA aren't exactly aiding this cause.

12.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 17:37:47
From a business point of view it makes complete sense. The staff receive 80% from the Government and topped up (20%) by the club. What is the issue?

{Ed001's Note - the issue is that Liverpool used to stand for more, but I guess you don't understand YNWA?}

13.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 18:05:50
Absolutely gutted that the club has gone down this route. Complete lack of class and flies in the face of YNWA and "we are one family".

What leaves an even sourer taste in the mouth is, I just happened to be looking at Ox and Gini isolating in their indoor swimming pools whilst isolating.

And before anyone jumps down my throat, I'm sure all our players will step up to the plate, but it still leaves a bad taste.

14.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 18:09:16
Nobody has been sacked or paid off. They are getting paid 100% of the wages. I'm sure from an employee point of view the most important thing is what goes into their account each month to pay their mortgage and Bills and not who is paying it.

{Ed002's Note - The point is that they are taking Government money on the basis of not knowing what their financial obligations will eb going forward. They really don't need to do taht. But at least the large number of Liverpool fans calling out the others sides who have done this should now be suitably embarrassed.}

15.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 18:20:40
The staff won’t notice a difference, that much is certain. And we should also agree they didn’t need to top up the wage but it’s the way they’ve got there that’s the issue.

I really don’t think our club needs to lean on the government just yet to get staff through this time.

Eventually all this money will want paying back and it will likely be through higher taxes.

The furlough system should only be used as a final resort for companies that would have to make people redundant, not just to save a bit of cash, which from the outside is what this feels like.

Also from a public image point of view this isn’t great and if we post a sizeable profit next year we will be scrutinised further.

{Ed002's Note - You need to understand the business paradigm at Liverpool does not extend to doing the honourable or principled thing.}

16.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 18:29:32
FORNAX, the players aren't working either. Should we furlough them?

The point is that Liverpool, along with most, if not all Premier League clubs, could easily absorb the cost of non-playing staff if their senior players took a small pay cut that they should be able afford. The annual wages bill for the LFC senior squad is reported at something like £110m, so just shy of £10m a month. 10% or 15% of that would go a long way, and if any of our players personal finances are so skewed that they can't survive on £45k per week after tax instead of £50k for a while, they obviously need to stop investing all their money in high-risk hedge funds and betting money on horses.

And if this goes on long enough for paying wages to staff who aren't working to become a major financial problem for the club, then we're looking disruption well into next season, which is going cause financial problems anyway.

But no, we'll stick more people on the governments books because there's clearly not enough people there already who've been laid off by businesses who are not in a position to absorb the costs in the way that Liverpool FC could.

Socialists get criticised for 'running out of other people's money' when they want to spend money on government services or a social security net, but there's no problem with the government paying wages at a private company that showed £42m in profit in its last declared accounts. Funny that.

17.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 19:31:14
If this had happened during Shankley's reign I'd say he would have resigned over the club doing something so morally reprehensible.

{Ed001's Note - exactly.}

18.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 19:49:42
This whole thing leaves a really bad taste in my mouth. I hoped that the season ticket fiasco would have taught the leadership team a lesson but clearly hasn’t.

Serious own goal, the worst part is that they are trying to justify it by saying they will cover other 20%.

A little bit of my love for the club just died.

19.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 19:52:20
Absolutely shocked, embarrassed and frankly disgusted the club went down this route.
A million PR led "we are giving away our extra food to food banks" photo ops and they do this move that essentially means we will pay for the 80% so the club can pay only 20 and the players contribute nothing!
Liverpool (YNWA my behind) and all the rest of them should bow their heads - although doubt anyone will 😡.

20.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 19:58:45
Have tweeted John W Henry to let him know my feelings. Not abusive just voicing my disappointment. Perhaps if enough others do he might intervene to reverse this morally reprehensible decision.

21.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 20:43:22
I will like to add that in a lot of cases the club will be paying more than 20% as the grant is capped at £2500 a month from the government. My work are doing this and would be stupid not too especially as they are a national company and not doing so could cause them to go under if it drags on.
Liverpool are doing it with approx 200 employees so if they are all on over £3k a month (some probably not) then it’s saving the club £500k a month, it’s nothing in the scheme of things and just not worth the bad press and sour taste, especially when we supposedly have 12 players earning over £100k a week.

22.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 20:46:19
When Spurs did this to their non playing staff I said here I hoped our club would not let anyone walk alone, but what I feared happened. The management and playing staff are getting their £100s of thousands a week but staff that cut the grass and make the meals or clean up after them for a hell of a lot less are being left to walk alone.
I don't care what the PFA say this was a chance for the players to make a stand with the rest of the staff and show what this clubs ethos was all about, they failed.
At times like this who do they think they are? Nurses? Doctors? Decent co-workers? No, just greedy entertainers who think it is tough because for the first time in their adult lives they have to cook their own food.
This has made me sick of football, let the season be cancelled.

23.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 20:49:46
Absolutely gutted. I have always thought that our club was a class above every other but today is one of our darkest days. We are a disgrace. Probably one of the most successful clubs in the world with huge profits from it via sponsorship etc and we do this. It is a complete disgrace and we deserve any rubbish thrown at us.

24.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:06:20
Cobra666 so are my company. Who is to say whether it’s needed I don’t know. Point is that if a businesses doesn’t have to do it they are playing the system and ultimately taking food off the table of the poorest in society in the long run.

Make no mistake there will be big tax increase and cuts to social security down the line. I suspect LFC don’t need to do this now and if that’s the case then they will contribute to someone starving in the future. End of. Yes others are doing that but we’re supposed to be bigger than that.

25.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 20:32:18
Clearly not ed002, just a shame it doesn’t come into the equation.

From a business POV I kind of understand, an opportunity to have the staff bill being paid and then just filling i the gaps can be an attractive proposition but I think it’s just a very short term view. And any profit in the future will be heavily criticised.

If it was a short term loan I also don’t think it’s be as heavily criticised but us as fans will foot the bill for this in the long run imo through taxes.

{Ed002's Note - It became clear yesterday that Liverpool were heading this way.}

26.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:25:43
Just signed a petition there weather it will make any difference to our clubs stance I don't know. My background is in finance and we are heading for a recession like no other seen in anyone's living memory. That money should stay in government coffers.

27.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:26:15
BigJohn, you and thousands of others, mate. Going to set up a Twitter account and join the masses.
As the banner says "it's not the people in power, it's the power of the people"

28.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:29:34
Ed1, you have your finger on how the club is run. Do you think those that run it will take any notice of the outpouring of disgust, which is surely pouring out at the news of furloughing staff, and perhaps reconsider?
Forgive me for living in cloud cuckoo land, it's been along day.

{Ed001's Note - not unless it becomes a huge issue which threatens future profits. Sadly it is highly unlikely that it will do so.}

29.) 04 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:42:34
Shocking absolutely shocking from us am afraid!

30.) 05 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 22:13:06
Rudder where’s the petition mate, I want to sign it.

31.) 05 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 22:15:54
Gutted they’ve made this decision. I’d hoped Liverpool/ the players would have covered the wages of the staff. I’d also hoped the top teams would have helped out the clubs lower down but that doesn’t look like it’ll happen anytime soon either. Shameful.

{Ed002's Note - The FA are responsible for flowing down money from the PL through the structure of the lower leagues - so you should not be calling anyone out over that. The Liverpool fans seem to be in “monkey hanger” mode - hitting on the clubs seeking government assistance, blaming players and clubs who are doing much without it being in the public domain - perhaps they need to be a little more humble in accepting there is a great deal going on that they don’t realise.}

32.) 05 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 23:06:27
Ed25 at least you club have said they won't go down this route shows what a class club you love really proud of our blue neighbours when I read this.

33.) 05 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 23:17:42
I'm going to take ed2's advice and not get involved in discussing finances.
But as an observation, it took literally days for some NBA players to announce announce how they would pay for the non-playing staff's wages etc. Football at all levels has been pretty quiet since the whole way through.

{Ed002's Note - Some clubs and players to not seek advertising or press coverage of what they do. Don’t lose sight of that.}

34.) 05 Apr 2020
04 Apr 2020 21:30:12
Imagine the uproar when we buy a player for millions in the next transfer window. A complete shambles in which, regardless of our outstanding on pitch performances, we will have lost our soul.

35.) 05 Apr 2020
05 Apr 2020 09:55:19
Not sure why everyone is getting so annoyed about the furlow situation, the club and players pay their taxes and are therfore entitled to use furlow if they choose too.

36.) 05 Apr 2020
05 Apr 2020 10:38:44
I am against what they have done but people saying they are taking food off tax payers plates need to realise the club and players contribute millions in tax every year so claiming back 500k-2m is a drop in the ocean in comparison. It’s just another reminder that football has turned into a business and I think the bad press over this is no way worth the money they will be claiming.

37.) 05 Apr 2020
05 Apr 2020 10:46:40
They are Liverbird1 but it’s just doesn't sit right and is just another sign that football is one big business.

38.) 05 Apr 2020
05 Apr 2020 12:27:21
good point ed2. I understand why people see this as a bad look, but I don't think the club have done anything wrong. Staff are being paid 100%, that is a good thing. The next few months will be very interesting and I'll be keeping an eye on public mood as things change with finances, funding etc etc.
Ed2, couple Qs - what is your take on LFC putting their non-playing staff on furlough? should football clubs be doing this? and what are some initiatives you are aware of that football clubs are doing to help in this crisis that the general public don't know?

{Ed002's Note - (1) It became evident of Friday afternoon this would happen - nobody is surprised except for the Liverpool fans who are trying to defend a morally bankrupt business that care nothing and respect nobody. The money should be available to not for profit business firstly, and those businesses who may not survive, and football clubs like Hartlepool who are struggling. (2) Clubs and players are agreeing wage cuts, clubs and players are contributing financially, etc..}