Liverpool banter 4

12 Apr 2024 15:35:31
It was a very disappointing display last night, tactically outsmarted, Anfield sounding like a graveyard, and it seemed players were just not up for it. Hat's off to Atalanta though for taking full advantage of that - can only beat what's in front of you, and they certainly whooped our behinds. Credit to Gakpo who's had a bad patch, but seemed to be one of the only getting out of first gear.

But there's still another leg to go, and we have overturned far worse results. Liverpool have a knack of finding that extra bit of magic on European nights, in recent time Dortmund and of course Barcelona springs to mind. Let's go full throttle. A quick goal and who knows what might happen. It ain't over just yet!

If there is a silver lining to be found, this might have been the kick up the backside we need. A true earful like this has been coming for a while. Let's hope Jurgen and the players wake up for this last stretch of the season, and let's show them all that we're still in the run, we need a reaction from this!

On a side note, can we please hide away Gomez' shooting boots. What started as an encouraging thought and seemingly supporter's and Gomez' biggest wet dream, has now become a bit of a dead meme.

12 Apr 2024 15:56:15
3-0 down but few willing to bet against us getting through.
We are Liverpool and that means a hell of a lot.

12 Apr 2024 16:35:34
I’m going for a 4-1 win for Liver In the return leg and seal the deal in extra time.

12 Apr 2024 16:48:50
Verdo - I would certainly bet against us going through. No chance (screenshot this and beat me over the head with it if we win next week :) .

This is not Barcelona at Anfield and that miraculous turnaround. The second leg is away, we're bang out of form, can't keep a clean sheet and need about 20 efforts on goal for every goal scored.

If we can hopefully muster something for the remainder of the season, it's going to be all in on the league now. Europa League has gone.

12 Apr 2024 19:04:48
Does anyone else think that by not having the banners last night, subdued the crowd which in turn had an effect on the team.

12 Apr 2024 17:58:51
We’ve gone from mentality monsters to tsimikas over hit cross has affected everyone’s mentality and performance in one night.

On the Anfield crowds criticism why didn’t those who are criticising create more atmosphere themselves.

12 Apr 2024 18:33:01
Bit disappointed JK didn’t own the tactical blunders. He was completely outthought but sought to infer the issues laid everywhere else. Not a disaster and we’re not out of it, but sometimes be nice to hear when he owns some of the problems created.

12 Apr 2024 19:45:29
Ashy no mate. Crowd were in good voice before the game and even up to about 10 mins in. I can take the lads losing but they really looked like they were in cruise control and that showed to the crowd.

We started the Jota song and numerous others but it was hard to stay enthused when the players looked far from it.


Only criticism of the crowd for me were the ones who left early but I suppose that’s their rights.

12 Apr 2024 20:12:44
JK, tsimikas did more than that, for the second goal, I thought he was in the crowd protesting the 2% he left that much space.

12 Apr 2024 20:39:36
Stuie he was awful mate. But Kelleher didn’t let it go under his body because of Tsimikas. And we were even worse 2nd half when he was off the pitch.

If the players were that awful because there was no flags then mentality monsters they are not.

12 Apr 2024 23:43:30
I thought the Utd games were the kick up the backside for us, season might be over before these kicks up the backside take effect.

13 Apr 2024 00:40:02
RR - sounds like the odds are against us. I like our chances.

13 Apr 2024 11:35:37
Mcgoveb, we were still the better team for large portions of both the FA cup game and the one at old trafford and were sat with more of a feeling that we should've won both.

This one was just pure annihilation from top till bottom. I'm just hopeful we'll see a reaction to it.

12 Apr 2024 13:52:41
Thanks for the reply ed001.ye could you imagine the boost that line up would have giving the atalanta players beforehand. im hoping this result is the kick up the arse they need for the run in. has to be a reaction this weekend or else wel only have the league Cup for klopps final season
On another note ed001 what do you make of Virg's captaincy. i heard him on a podcast recently describe himself as very vocal and maybe he is and I just haven't noticed.

{Ed001's Note - exactly, Atalanta must have been delighted to see the team sheet.

I think Virgil has shown a massive improvement due to getting the armband. He has grown as a player and has been very vocal, he has been helping the youngsters a lot by all accounts.}

12 Apr 2024 23:06:04
Really poor team selection and tactics last night, Gomez being iinverted wasn't there available for a simple pass on the right side which gave us lots of problems and made it harder to bring the ball out been been plus the third goal could have been avoided if a proper right back had been there.

13 Apr 2024 20:41:23
Anyone else feel Atalanta are a poor team? I didn’t rate any of their players as top class! I don’t buy into the pundits “Atalanta did an absolute job on Liverpool” tripe. I saw a bang average team play a good team that were awful. A team that made mistake after mistake and played terrible. I’m absolutely confident If we play well in the second leg we’ll go through. Atalanta won’t be able to come with us if we turn up. Just hoping this is the final kick in the ass we need to wake up, front up and take some individual responsibility.

12 Apr 2024 13:37:12


Anonymous Woolback has written an article entitled, Is Jurgen Klopp Burnt Out At Liverpool FC?

12 Apr 2024 15:40:33
Enjoyable read, that. Thanks.
I fully concur about the “more casual” aspect of our play as time has gone on. That’s exactly what it feels like.

12 Apr 2024 18:03:46
Nice one, AW. Is this a moment of any sorts? Well, only time will tell as our reaction in games coming up starting with Palace will determine this, imo. If we see anything remotely resembling the absolute ship show we all saw from the off in last night’s game then, you are on the right track. If not then, on to the next game to confirm or disprove.

12 Apr 2024 23:34:25
I hope that the bad vibes subside and we win our last seven league games, Oli, only time will tell. I meant it was a significant moment irrespective of what comes after. I say that because it was, in so many ways, very far removed from the teams of the late 2010's. So many things happened last night that would never have happened back then. Even the scoreline itself is a glaring example. Okay sure, early Klopp teams were sometimes well beat, but no way would they have allowed a first leg tie to get to 3-0, at home, in that manner. They'd have just stemmed the tide and kept the tie alive. As well as Atalanta played, goals two and three are a disgrace and basically a gimme.

What comes next is immaterial, for me. It is a symptom of of something larger even just in isolation, even if we win the league. Entirely unnecessary casualness.

13 Apr 2024 07:37:09
Excellent thread but it’s so true.

13 Apr 2024 11:35:46
Well written, deep stuff AW.

I hope it is not as deep as that but rather than we've been putting tactics above intensity over the last few weeks. We've been trying to either match and/ or out-think the opposition of late and it has taken the edge of the intensity and sharpness of mind.

We need to get back to being compact in midfield and to attack and defend in numbers without making it so tactical. We're at the point of the season where the size and physicality of our squad should tell. This is not the time to outwit midtable managers at their own game.

12 Apr 2024 13:27:17
Hi eds1
In your opinion how do we get back to winning ways asap. How does Klopp turns this round so we don’t go out with a whimper because this has to be done quick!
Thanks in advance.

{Ed001's Note - get the selection right, stop rotating unless absolutely necessary and drop the inverted full-back to bring back width. That is the key thing, we need some width.}

12 Apr 2024 14:03:21
And to add to that Ed, we need to start whipping crosses in again from our FB’s. We have a n aerially deadly CF in Darwin on our hands and we seem to never cross the ball enuff which is weird cos when we had the 3 amigos, Robbo, Trent and Hendo didn’t hesitate to whip balls in. We have Darwin. Use him.

{Ed001's Note - Robbo still does it, but he has been injured. Elliott gets too narrow before putting balls in, which means it is difficult to put pace on them or they just go straight out of play.}

12 Apr 2024 14:28:04
Agree fully about the width statement, Ed001. Their 3rd goal last night was totally avoidable. If Gomez hadn't been tucked in midfield behind their press, Szoboszlai would've had a simple pass out to the right back position. Instead, he delayed waiting for Gomez to drop back into space and ended up getting caught on the ball.

It's costing us goals at both ends of the pitch.

{Ed001's Note - it's frustrating because it has been obvious all season.}

12 Apr 2024 15:16:48
It's almost like we go narrow because we are petrified of being counterattacked or counterpresses being broken.

12 Apr 2024 16:43:53
The inverted fullback nonsense is so stupid. Pep tried it for one season and jumped off. He won the treble using it but with a very different set of players.

For one, Haaland playing as a focal point of the attack, a striker whose sole purpose is scoring goals, as opposed to Nunez who has a much better all round game. Secondly, the defenders he used were 4 actual centre backs, far more sturdy than anything we have used in the last 18 months. City were far better using this than we have been in the entire year we have persisted with it. They were very solid at the back and controlled games well. They didn't have players of the quality of Alisson, van Dijk or Trent while playing it either. Yet we still persist with this flawed idea that they jibbed a long time ago, not even coming close to achieving the control or solidity that it was intended for.

I think the persistence with the inverted fullback over the past 18 months feels like another symptom of a manager that is beginning to lose his edge when it comes to tactics and long term planning.

12 Apr 2024 18:12:15
AW, I was saying it at the time earlier in the season that this system is fundamentally flawed and mainly does not work if you are playing vs a narrow block like Atalanta did BUT I got told to keep it moving cos we were top and that how dare I question Klopp like you know, the same thing these same people are doing now.

Now to be fair, some tweaks were made to make us more secure BUT now, we seemingly are inverting just for the sake of it rather than it fulfilling an actual purpose to improve us, which it didn’t last night. In fact, it was the direct opposite. Like I have said, we need width from our fullbacks and we need to go back to them whipping balls in to serve the aerial danger that Darwin possesses. We got to switch it up a bit.

12 Apr 2024 22:21:32
In todays episode of it never actually happened

got told to keep it moving cos we were top and that how dare I question Klopp like you know, the same thing these same people are doing now.

If anyone criticises Klopp Oli your go to response is stop crying because the club aren’t doing what you want them to do.

Well guess what.

13 Apr 2024 10:29:43
"If anyone criticises Klopp Oli your go to response is stop crying because the club aren’t doing what you want them to do. "

So you are telling everyone on the internet that you literally cannot tell the difference in context btw. crticizing/ challenging Klopp on his tactics and criticizing the club for decisions being made off the pitch that have nothing to do with on-pitch tactics?

Not surprised tho, as it is coming from someone who went to the gound to watch the Sheff. Utd game YET had NO idea Endo was not playing until he was corrected on this forum. Only heaven knows what what you are seeing when you go to the ground to watch games at this point if you can't tell who is playing and who isn't. Keep the jokes coming. Or whatever it is you think are actual jokes.

13 Apr 2024 12:36:18
Nice one Woli 😂.

13 Apr 2024 13:57:13
AW great post mate but in man u two games we were far the better side the finishing was what let us down the Atalanta game was flat from start to finish the crowd, team selection, tatics but at 0-3 down we had four or five chances to score with out the chances in whole match so i would say the match is not over until the fat lady sings. Point also in last several seasons we have had a bad period around xmas and January were we have drop points we seem to be having that bad period now but i am sure the manager, players, coaches and fans of Liverpool fc will turn it around YNWA.

12 Apr 2024 13:21:59
ED1. looking at last the performances in last few games I have following comments and queries for you

1. How is it that our defense is so open. Only year I remember our defense was perfect was the year we won the league. In last few years defense has been really poor and there seems to be ne effort in training to correct this thing. Is it lack of focus towards defense or plainly down to players. As they say defense win you cups and it explains why we won just 1 league in these many years.

2. In past decade I have not seen a top team which is so poor in finishing. I don't have the data but I can safely assume Liverpool might be in top 3 in terms of shot but bottom in terms of conversion. Again is it down to lack of training or simply down to out offensive players.

3. Lastly on using data while selecting players. While I support that approach but I truly believe selection of players should not be based on this approach singularly. It looks are we are selecting players who have good all round game but they are not masters of their trades. Our offensive players are excellent when measured in terms of all round qualities but when it comes to finishing they might not be in top 5 players in the league (when measured in terms of goal conversion) .

Happy to hear your views and happy to be corrected.

Praveen.

{Ed001's Note - 1. I think the constant rotation of centre-backs is a big part of the problem but added to that is that we play a high risk game of leaving defenders one on one with attackers. That allows us to put more pressure on the opposition higher up the pitch. This season in particular, and to a smaller degree last season, we have also suffered due to our tactical approach meaning the full-backs are not pushing back the opposing widemen as they are drifting inside so much.

2. I don't know, if you actually watch other teams, they all seem to miss a lot of chances, I think the problem is the way we play. We have no width so the opposition can crowd their own box and stay compact, so we are working in tight spaces and snatching at chances. No one is being dragged out to deal with our wide players, so it allows them to keep everyone in the way.

3. Players are also scouted.}

12 Apr 2024 14:07:18
We are also guilty of “overplaying” as in, trying to be too intricate in the final stages which leads to poor decisions and poor execution being made in the final third.

We got to go back to being a bit more direct and have our FB’s start whipping crosses in again as we hit Darwin and Diaz who are lethal in the air. The way we play now dies nor allow for this to happen so their quality in the air is being wasted, imo.

12 Apr 2024 14:29:46
Reading the above, I accept that we have issues, but for gawd sake, we are top of the league. If you didn't understand football and you read through the posts and Ed's replies you would think we were about to get relegated. Like I say, there are things that need fixing and last night was as poor as I've seen us for a long, long time and I had the misfortune of being there, but things aren't beyond fixing.

12 Apr 2024 16:12:13
Rome1977!, I propose you read this thread a second (or even third read, if required) cos NOT single soul so far has acted or reacted the way you are describing in your post.

12 Apr 2024 16:52:40
OliRed, I think you may be right, mate. I suppose I was reacting to other posts and used this thread as a means of replying. I read the chat on the way back from the game, last night, and youd have thought we had been relegated to the Conference. There are also other negative posts, which people are entitled to. But, like I say, we are still top and whatever is wrong can, and I'm sure will, be fixed.

12 Apr 2024 18:17:07
Ah okay then, Rome. I see it what you’re saying now. For sure, people are allowed to be negative after arguably the worst perf since the drubbing at Snfurkd by RM last season and at least on that one, we were crap all of last season so there’s a valid reason.

Last night, we shipped the bed and nobody knows why Klopp made the lineup he made and the tactics he deployed and that’s even more annoying. As for the “Throw the baby with the bath water out” brigade, i stopped caring about such rhetoric years ago.

12 Apr 2024 13:33:25
I think Klopp was right - he has run out of steam. Who knows what will happen next season, but I think the time is right for a more tactically aware manager. You can only go so far on man motivation, and he seems to be losing that now. His team selection last night was very poor. How many times does he have to see Elliot in Salah’s position to know it doesn’t work?

Why has Gomez suddenly become a ‘must play’ player? Because that clown Southgate included him in an England squad? Gomez is woeful on the ball, no creativity at all and slows the game down. His defending is even worse. He has no defensive awareness at all and just strolls back. Don’t get me started on Tsimikas. Although Kelleher was ultimately to blame for the first goal, it was really Tsimikas’s fault.

He dived in and actually tackled Gakpo on the touch line, leaving the Atalanta player acres of space to make the cross. I have always stuck up for Nunez because of his work rate and ability to always be involved, but he looks no more composed in front of goal now as he did when he first came. If he can’t sort that out, he needs replacing.

Diaz flatters to deceive and is not the same player since his injury. We need a lot of reconstruction in the back 4. VVD had been great but it getting older and can’t do it on his own. Konate is quite poor defensively and never stays fit Matip going at the end of the season. As previously mentioned, Gomez and Tsimikas are Championship standard.

12 Apr 2024 14:04:49
Give it a rest, joe has been one of our players of the season filling in at whatever role the team needs and performing admirably each time, it’s not his fault he was asked to invert to disastrous results…I do think he should probably relax with the long range shooting for the time being, though
As for Kostas, everybody was anxious about the fact that he got hurt earlier in the season, he was playing that well standing in for robbo, if they were championship standard how are we tied for points at the top of the premier league?

12 Apr 2024 14:37:12
What an absolute load of nonsense redjersey.

It was a very poor performance last night but we can’t let that undo the unbelievable work the team has done this season.

In reality, with the amount of injuries we’ve had plus losing Salah and Endo for January and half of February to internationals we have been nothing short of miraculous.

All players, including Tsimikas, Gomez, Nunez, Konate and Kelleher have contributed to that so to start saying they are not good enough after one poor performance is just pathetic.

It was a bad night, in my opinion that is largely due to us underestimating Atalanta but even more so the Anfield crowd underestimating Atalanta. Why would we decide to stage a no flag protest in a European quarter final? If that was the CL against Madrid would they have done that?

Absolutely not, they chose that game because they thought we’d win anyway. In my opinion the Anfield crowd are as much to blame as the players.

12 Apr 2024 15:24:50
I am with Beckers Pecker on this one about the no flag night. The atmosphere last night reminded me of the atmosphere at Everton when they played Man City a few years ago and the fans wanted them to lose, so that City would beat us to the title. And a little bit like when the fans wanted Benitez to lose so that he would get sacked. Never Ever Ever repeat that please, it had a profound effect on the players, they couldn't pass straight, couldn't anticipate what their team mates would do and couldn't concentrate on their shooting.

12 Apr 2024 16:14:20
Beckers pecker, awesome post. Also, I told you these people would be back on here, didn't I? So easy to predict.

12 Apr 2024 16:51:04
I see, blame the crowd.

The definition of apologism.

The players played rubbish and the manager was tactically schooled.

Pity the fans who paid to watch that garbage rather than say “they’re as much to blame as the players”.

Absolute nonsense.

12 Apr 2024 17:39:14
Agree with you, Ron. So it was my fault we put in the most inept display since Roy Hodgson.

12 Apr 2024 22:19:50
Fans who don’t go to games blaming the fans who do go to games

Welcome to football in 2024.

12 Apr 2024 13:29:00
Dominic needs to start playing a lot better at the Mo he should be nowhere near the first team. For me he is way too weak I lose count the amount of challenges he stays out of. Definitely playing for his position or not playing you could say.