Liverpool Banter Archive February 09 2013
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09 Feb 2013 22:20:08
Just wondering eds, do we have any interest in Adan? seems very good and I don't see him playing a lot in the future because Casillas is still very good.
Cheers The Coon. {Ed002's Note - No idea, sorry.}
09 Feb 2013 22:14:59
Eds or reds can you answer? With the FFP coming up is it likely that we may have to sell to balance the books? {Ed002's Note - That is not really how it works.}
09 Feb 2013 21:41:57
I think we need to be realistic and accept that our top 4 dream is all gone this season. Our squad is simply not good enough to make top four and the manager and owner must know this by now. In fact, we were never in top four all through most parts of last season and this season. So how do we expect to magically find ourselves in top four when there are much better teams ahead of us? Is this not unrealistic optimism?
I honestly don't expect that the likes of Downing, Borini, Allen, Assaidi, Wisdom, Sterling Robinson and Coates can walk into any team in the top 4?
Out of 75 points on offer from the 25 games we have played so far, we have picked only 36 and dropped 39 points. So do you now expect that we will get about 30 points from a possible 39 that is still available from our remaing 13 games? This is not impossible but it is extremely difficult, seeing as we still have to play the likes of Spurs Everton, Swansea, West Brom and Newcastle all of whom we got only 3 points out of 15 from those fixtures.
We either need to wait till the next three or four years when our youngsters in the academy and the ones we have signed would have peaked before we can stake any claim for top 4, or we can go out there and sign quality players to help us challenge just the way spurs and arsenal are going about it.
But the problem with waiting is that those in their peak right now will likely seek an exit if they feel we are not challenging and we may not even be in a position to attract top players to come and play with kids by the time we lose our quality players.
We can either make a bold statement now and sign the likes of Sanchez, Jovetic Howedes and Ter Stegen this summer to make us strong again and get into CL or we keep signing more Assaidis and Borinis and hope for the best.
If we go with the quick fix, it should be in this manner based on rumours and confirmed interests we have in players as well as suggestion from Eds and other posters:
In:
Sanchez 25m
Jovetic 20m
Ogbonna 5m
Any decent CM 10m
Ter Stegen 10m
Diakite/Amoriebeta free.
Total 70m
Out
Downing 7m
Carrol 13m
Borini 8m
Assaidi 2m
Coates 5m
Reina 12m
Total 45m
Net spend 25m
Not saying it has to be in this order but we can do something similar in terms of quality.
I know this is quite difficult to acheive, considering the financial implication but we can at least try. After all we spent close to 60m on Downing, Erique, Henderson, Adam and Coates last two summer ago.
Why shy away this time if it will undoubtedly make us stronger and bring CL money which will cushion the effect of this financial strain.
Abroad Red
Get rid of Borini (21) and Assaidi (21 ish) after one season? Patience Padawan!
To first reply Assaidi turns 25 this season
And what about the British presence you seem to forget
Never Give up Abroad Red! Never!
If LFC Players had your attitude we'd only have 4 European titles.
But they don't and we have 5.
Davey Sulls
09 Feb 2013 21:35:20
We will not make the top 4 this season.
We aimed low are will therefore will get what we deserve - nowt!
FSG have given a lot of money to the club, but by appointing an inexperienced manager they must take some responsibility.
Suarez ought to be sold in the summer to raise more capital and buy more players.
This is LFC - we were once the best side in the world. we have lost our winning mentality and fans now accept mediocrity.
Well - it's time we demanded more. Why should we accept midtable mediocrity - we are better than that!
It's not good enough -and the we fans deserve better
M
It's not good enough we the team deserve better fans!
Mate, stop trying find blame with one individual. LFC are where they are in status & table position because they lost too many matches in the last 20 years. Deal with it & don't be arrogant & asume we have a 'right', it's insulting to other teams.
dd
09 Feb 2013 23:25:58
We shouldn't "accept mediocrity" (nice straw man going on there btw), but we should sell Suarez, without whom we'd be 13th or so.
Okay.
- Something Red -
So, if we had spent 50 million more we'd be in top 4?
09 Feb 2013 23:54:00
No you're wrong the club demands better than supporters like you. We are aiming for the top but its a long term plan of rebuilding the club by the foundations with a young manager and new player. The alternative is to throw money at it and hope it works or go bust. -McMememy
Weve been average for 4 years we are now trying to build the team back to a competitive one it won't happen in one season, all the teams above us have taken years to build their squads
Its a massive job one of the hardest in the world, a midtable team with fans who expect to compete for the title even though we had at one point konchesky spearing and ngog in the team
Cmon dude we will get there but it will take 1 or 2 seasons, we may get CL next season if we have a good summer and sort out our defense whove cost us top 4
You must be blind to not see that BR is the right man, yes he's made a couple mistakes but which manager hasnt
You cannot be a red, sell Luis, are you mad? fsg aimed low? how can anyone who SAVED our club be aiming low? get a grip and look at the bigger picture! T-Mac
FSG appointment of Rogers is for a long term project to enable Liverpool football club to be able to seriously challenge for the Premiership title and then to get back into the champions league.
Any fan of football if they are truly honest regardless of who they support can see that Liverpool are a great team to watch and are always entertaining. Other Premiership sides have changed managers too often after having not achieved the desired wishes of their respective owners. Liverpool have ( until the past few years) usually had a long term manager who can over time impress his style on the team and bring in players to deliver sucess. Brendan Rogers has got the team playing well in a relativley short time. All Liverpool supporters have to keep the faith with what he is trying to do and with our support he will become another name to line up along the great Liverpool managers of our illustrious history.
Liverno1
You guys sit passively and have bought into the spin of 'transition', 'bringing a style of play' rhetoric.
We haven't won the title for nigh on 24 years!
How much longer should we allow this once great club to slide into a cataclysmic demise?
We have a right to demand more from the team and the manager.
I don't seek to criticise FSG - they have invested heavily into the club. but the players have not shown the requisite desire and commitment this season.
Putting on the red shirt - means playing through a brick wall for the cause.
The players need to be reminded how fortunate they are to be playing for LFC.
However - we need to win games - every game!
'If you are first you are first. If you are second you are nothing' - (the great one Shanks).
M
09 Feb 2013 21:23:16
we have to win now monday to have any chance of getting 4th place these are the times we need to progress if we can win tomorrow and keep it up it will be a step forward in my opinion cause these are the best games to judge as if we can't win under pressure we have no rigt going into champions league just yet
Phouka
Agree, however, there is no pressure. We have an outside chance at challenging for top 4, and nobody really sees us as contenders right now. So, in my opinion, players are under no pressure at all.
09 Feb 2013 21:20:28
Hi Eds
I see Ngoo scored again today, he is doing well up in Scotland what are the plans for him at the end of the season?
Thanks
Marc {Ed002's Note - I have no idea and I would doubt the club do right now.}
09 Feb 2013 21:12:00
Eds fellow red, been on legends tour today with Phil neal. the best £70 I've ever spent coutinho no 10 shirt pegged up in changing room with rest of team. and if anyone thinking of going eat at the boot room the place is amazing and the food is very good highly recommend. Great day all round
I went on the tour last with Ian Callaghan and yes it was well worth the money. The boot room was great too, my wife had scouse and thought it was amazing.
Just to add a guide called Gary showed us around and he never failed to answer any question
My mate did a normal tour last week prior to the city game then watched it in a local pub and has not stopped talking about it
Sweetcorn
09 Feb 2013 20:48:14
In summer
In
Manuel Neuer 12m ( Valdes off to Munich)
Michael Dawson 6m
Xabi Alonso 6m
Out
Pepe Reina 10m
Martin Skrtel 12m
09 Feb 2013 23:26:23
Lol Dawson.
- Something Red -
Won't get alonso for 6 m
09 Feb 2013 20:46:49
Results didn't go our way today, we must win on Monday to keep up
09 Feb 2013 20:17:11
Ed how come my post was included with another like as if it was one post? My post was not intended to be with Paisleys a Genius thus it doesn't make sense, thanks'
Big Al {Ed002's Note - Because you are not replying to posts but adding new ones which won't be linked.}
09 Feb 2013 19:25:33
i see BR has added the young american MARC PELOSI
to the europa squad. now I havnt seen much of this youngster this season. but from what I saw he looks decent. nothing special but certinaly works his socks off on the pitch. I think his verstality is what BR is more intersted in as he plays cm, lb, lw at the same level. and I remember someone (marsh or mcparaland. can't remember?) saying that this kid reminded him abit of gareth barry!
i just wonder if any of the eds has any views on this kid perhaps?
i would be very intersted to hear opinions!
thanx
Like you I'm interested to hear what he is like - not seen enough of him to comment - looking forward to the replies :o)
Hoola
09 Feb 2013 19:24:00
is it fair to say that this site as much as it is addictive has become more of a questions for eds site namely ed2 than a rumour site? maybe lfc forum these days!
billybully
09 Feb 2013 18:42:01
Not suggesting we should buy him but what a player Jason Puncheon is turning out to be!
LS7.
09 Feb 2013 18:22:45
Diakite will sign on a free, benedikt howdes is also being lined up. no decision has been made on reina's replacement yet.
09 Feb 2013 18:21:38
Do the Eds always come up with witty replies on the spot or do they have an archive of responses?
I had a picture of an Ed withholding a post being put on here until they came up with a good enough response.
Jollt Re
09 Feb 2013 18:46:21
Sorry, supposed to be from me but I typed to fast.
Jolly Red
09 Feb 2013 18:18:50
What a player bale is, wish we had him!. hope we
Sign a quality wide player in the summer.
Why the hell would people disagree with this! who wouldn't want gareth bale in their team, he is one of the best players in the world!
He's a fine player, but I can't stand him. So thanks, but no thanks on him playing for LFC.
World's greatest!
There really are some persons on this site. 14 of you disagree with a wish to have Bale in our side. Another 9 disagree with the statement that he is one of the best players in the world which he is. Another 7 agree to 'no thanks on him playing for LFC'
I suppose you all reckon Enrique and or Downing are a class above him.
Don't like him. However, like Suarez, if he were on the team, you'd love him.
It's at least 15 disagrees cus I just couldn't be bothered to click the disagree button, but after reading your reply I thought I would bother to post. Why do you find it so hard to believe that some people wouldn't want him to play for LFC? He's OK at what he does, but he leaves a sour taste in my mouth whenever I watch him play. I just don't like him. Obviously I'm not alone. Get over it, just because people don't agree with you doesn't make them wrong - it's just opinion.
Nick
Whether you like him as a person would soon be forgotten if he signed for LFC tomorrow. 'He's okay at what he does'? Have you ever seen him play because that description is one that decribes the likes of Stuart Downing not Gareth Bale. Get over your personal dislike of him and give the guy some credit even if he plays for a rival team.
Good footballer but I don't like him
You have to admire football talent.
I like him as a player except when playing against LFC.
Liverno1
I think he is a good player. Credit where credit is due. He has lots of pace and his first touch and dribbling is brilliant. I would take him for Liverpool but no doubt that he is vastly overrated by everyone. He will be okay, then have a good month or two where he is in form and then fade again and be called the worlds best. He can be one of the top few players in world football, however I don't think he is quite there yet.
derryred
He makes no secret of the fact he's a Manchester United fan who hates LFC.
I dislike him. G Neville was a good right back but I wouldn't have wanted him to sign for LFC, same goes for Rooney.
I don't care how good they are on the field, if their hearts not in it they will not be welcome here.
09 Feb 2013 17:59:24
Ed will Coutinho ever play for us haha? Dying to see what he can bring to the team! Any idea when he will be available for selection Ed?
Cheers,
LS7.
What do you mean 'ever play for us' so far haven't we only plaid one game since we signed him? and he's been injured? give him a chance
Well actually he's been here for 2 games but he was never going to play against Arsenal I suppose! Its not that I'm not giving him a chance it's just that it feels like he's been here months even though he's only been here about 2 weeks! He just seems to be that tiny bit away from playing on both occasions that's the only reason I'm saying it haha.
Cheers,
LS7.
I'm guessin you are the same guys who slated Daniel Sturridge? really can't believe you are slating a player who has not even kicked a ball for us! ffs get a grip! T-Mac
Didn't see the OP slating Coutinho at all- quite the opposite really?
Lol T-mac you need to read the posts! Where was the slating?
Dribbler!
Red Lee
A poster askes if a player is ever going to play (stressing their excitement) and people think he is slating the player. Wow!
derryred
09 Feb 2013 17:58:11
Some keeper that Joe Hart, wish we had him insted of Pepe. We would have beaten City 3-0 or 3-1 if we had him. . ( irony or what! )
Waro
Love it waro
Guess what joe hart has won a premier league title I wouldn't be taking the mick
All keepers have the occasional howler Waro, but I think it's fair to say Hart has had far, far less of them the last few years than Reina.
All players have can have one or two bad games or even a loss of form and find themselves on the bench.
Reina has become error prone on a regular basis? Which is an entirely different thing.
kidmillions
09 Feb 2013 23:53:48
My post wasn't having a go at Hart, he is a fantastic keeper. I was having ago at so called experts who post here, slagging there own and making ill informed and unfair comparisons, glossing over errors made by the very players they choose to bring into there critiques of Liverpool players. Its easy to say its one off errors when they don't play for the club you support. And for the record, as good as hart is, I don't think he's been at the same level since the euros. But maybe city fans back there players more than some of you on here.
Waro
Have to agree, Hart is top keeper in Europe right now. Every time he's beaten it is by an amazing goal. He rarely makes mistakes, and really bosses the defence. Don't see him leaving City any time soon though.
09 Feb 2013 17:50:06
Since Rodgers became our manager these are the players he brought to Liverpool
Allen
Borini
Assaidi
Sahin (loan)
Sturridge
Yesil (future)
Coutinhho (yet to kick ball for lfc)
Can anyone tell me how many players would be playing for top4 sides and please be honest-
Who gives a monkey? They play for us.
Jamie.
With the exception if sahin who has left I hope they are all with us when we become top 4.
Paisley's genius
Mate shut upp' with would these players be in a top four side' Mikel is in a CLwinning chelsea, santos plays for arsenal' and united signed. the. sensational. ly bad bebe! Support the team or use your energy ona crossword
Mon Liverpooooooool!
Big Al
Is your point that Rodgers has bought sh*t players? In my opinion these players have the potential to make LFC a 'top' team again. I perfer it this way than the way you're alluding to which is pay mega-dollar for ready made players, that doesn't always work.
dd
None of them they are Liverpool players
numnuts
While I'm not too bothered to figure out whether your list are 'top 4' quality, I do have some concerns that so far the incoming players (Sturridge aside) have perhaps improved the squad but really done little to improve our first 11.
Looking at Allen, Assaidi, Countinho, and Borini, I think they are all good, but perhaps not quite ready for starting spots but I think they are also too good
to want to sit on the bench for Liverpool for any length of time. My gut tells me they would prefer to play in the first team for a weaker side. It's sort of like are we better off with say two 15M young CMs, or one 25M established one with a 5M backup? Right now I feel we're going with strength in depth, which is okay except I don't see people wanting to hang around for a chance at some game time.
I would rather buy a Coutinho or Borini for around 10 million and put them on reasonable wages than buy a Jovanovic or Poulsen with no potential on a massive contract.
Bank on their potential.
Hey remember when konchesky and poulsen were first teamers and we only had ngog upfront
Thank you BR for building us back up as a team again will take time but unfortunately due to past managment its where we are atm
I agree they all have potential, but will they be content to bide their time on the bench? Sahin didn't want to do so and I don't think Borini, Allen, or Assaidi will want to either.
Thus the dilemma- they improve the squad undoubtedly, but are they willing to wait and fight for their chance? Or will they become disgruntled (like Sturridge did at Chelsea) and decide they'd rather move on and get some regular playing time? Spending 10M+ on 'potential' only works if the potential is realized and given a chance.
09 Feb 2013 17:47:42
Monday is a must win game now
Paul the red
What game from now until the end of the season isn't a must win?
IncaMan
IncaMan, how about the last 10 games, when we are already out of the running for top 4?
09 Feb 2013 17:09:22
If sturridge is injured then our front 3 should be
Sterling--Suarez--Downing Suarez should play in midle its simple, Borini shouldn't start unles we are winning by 2-3 goals. We need to start climbing the table before the gap starts getting bigger.
I'd rather Borini start than Sterling, just my opinion.
BoriniCanDoIt and the sooner he's given a succession of games to show that the better.
BCDI.
I'm curios as to when we will ever start a league match 2-3 goals ahead?
derryred
Derryred
curious, a curio would be an lfc prem winners medal
Totally disagree. Sterling just coming off injury, has been poor for months, and we really need Borini to build some confidence, and where better than at Anfield? I actually think Sturridge will start, but if not then Borini up front with Suarez and Downing support. Otherwise team should stay same, including Carra in place of Skrtel. He's playing well, and should continue until he isn't.
09 Feb 2013 14:37:55
Dont worry about 4th spot too much, just win the cup. Simples :) Would be a lot easier if sturridge wasnt cup tied though :/
4th spot was always a bridge too far for Liverpool this season, it's something we need t build for.
Tottenham did something very similar a few years back and have done very well in the last three seasons in the League, I think we did something very similar and we are using the youth players very well, build big for a bright future.
BCDI.
09 Feb 2013 18:28:24
We shouldn't think of top4 too much we should just be focussing on our own games if we start winning our own games then everything will be fine or should I say the league table will take care it self. 9 points is not a big gap if you see teams above us are not consistant or untouchable but the key is we need to atleast win 5-6 games on trot and all of a sudden league table will look compeletly different. Since benitez left we have failed to win 4 games on trot in epl which is not good enough for a team looking to finish top4 and its a big shock why can't we win games on trot but now its an opportunity to do against lesser teams and show how hungry we are for top4.
09 Feb 2013 15:38:22
Are we good enough for the top four?
1) do we have one of the leagues top four keepers? In terms of class I'd only rate Lloris and Hart ahead of Reina, but on his form from the last three or so years I'd say he's still probably a weak link - I'd still rather have him than De Gea or Szczesny though.
2) Johnson is one of the leagues top four right backs; England's finest and his nearest competitor (Sagna) has been shaky this term.
3) Enrique is back in form and showing his class, I'd say only Cole and Baines are stronger left backs in the league than him.
4) Agger and Skrtel were one of the best CB partnerships last year, Skrtel's been a bit off the pace this year but I feel he'd still get into Arsenal or Tottenham's satrting XI. Agger is only behind Vidic and Kompany as far as the league's best CB is concerned.
5) Our strongest midfield three is pretty strong: Gerrard would get into any team in the league, Lucas would get into most teams and an in-form Henderson remains one of the brightest young midfield prospects in England. Yet I still feel Man City, Arsenal and Chelsea have a stronger midfield than us.
6) Our wide areas could do with improving: Sterling's a great prospect and Downing's in decent form, but Arsenal have the likes of Walcott and Chamberlain; Chelsea have Mata and Hazard; United - Nani, Valencia and Young; City - Silva and Nasri; Spurs - Bale.
7) United have the league's best strikeforce in Rooney and Van Persie, that's why they're top. I think in Suarez and Sturridge we certainly have one of the league's top four attacks - it's better than Adebayor-Defoe, or Podolski-Giroud.
8) So what about depth? We have a young squad with at least two players in each position. But I still think we need a bigger squad to compete at the top - look at the Manchester clubs in terms of strength in depth, not to mention Spurs.
Verdict: I think we're not miles away from the top four, but it could be a step too far this season. However with a few alterations in the summer I feel we could jump from being in the mix in the top seven to being in contention for third - that's how close I think we are.
Irishdom15
Im sorry but you like many Liverpool fas are over rating our players
If our players are that good we wouldn't of finished 6th 7th 8th consecutively
Imo only agger and johnson are good enough
Lucas is good but gerrard isn't consistant enough anymore, henderson shown a lot of quality but is no juan mata
Suarez is worldclass, sturridge is top class and coutinho looks classy
So we need to replace our GK, a top class consistant CB, a top class left back, and competition in all positions, competition or Lucas, a top class replacement for Gerrard, top class compition in hendos position allen won't be good enough until another 2-3 seasons, and replacements for downing assaidi
So a lot of work to be done
Click dislike if your dillusional and disagree
Skrtel wouldn't get a sniff at spurs to be fair! They have vertonghan, dawson and france's centre half kaboul who their fans rate as one of the best around!
I must be dillusional then because I don't agree, what you've said is mostly complete nonsense.
MR EM
So your saying disagree with me and your dillusional? I'd be more inclined to agree with Irishdom. We finished 8th last season because the last ten games or so were mainly used to blood youngsters. Then the season before that we had an awful first half to it until KK came back. We don't need a LB, we don't need to sign players purely for competition. That is what our yungsters are doing.
derryred
Excuses, excuses derryred
I agree with the reply to derry red
Excuses excuses!
09 Feb 2013 20:12:19
1) I would've considered Reina one of the best 'keepers around before this season, but he's not doing well this year. There are worse keepers around, but he still needs to get his house in order quick.
2) Jonno's the best fullback in the league. This "he can't defend" business is nonsense. Three out of four Liverpool managers have been content to let him attack, and run the risk is that he'll get caught upfield (seeing as he cannot be in two places at once). When he's in position, his defending is fine. Rodgers can always tell Jonno not to pass the halfway line if he's worried about being caught out, it's a tactical decision for him to make, not a failing from Jonno. And generally, I would say allowing him to attack does more good things than it creates problems.
Now Dossena was a fullback who couldn't defend. He'd actually get back in position and then get demolished by the opposition winger anyway. Don't think I ever saw him win a 1v1.
3) Enrique's not a weak link, but I don't think he's the best LB in the Prem either. Good enough for a top 4 side though.
4) Skrts started well but had too much brain fade in the last couple of months. He might recover is a form. Agger's a good, Premiership level defender, and he certainly won't let us down, but I don't think he's around the best in the league. Never as good as Carra & Hyypia at their peaks, for example. I had high hopes for Coates when he arrived but his days seem to be numbered.
5) Lucas & Gerrard are easily good enough. I think at this moment in time we don't have a top class third centre mid. Hendo's a tryer, a good hearted lad, has a good amount of technical ability and has produced a couple of good moments, but he undermines himself by picking the wrong ball a lot in the top third. It's something he will improve on and I want him to stay at the club, but at this moment in time, he's not got enough quality.
Shelvey seems to have gone backwards, and I'm not sure what role Joe Allen has to play in the first team. I think he's backup to Gerrard rather than a compliment to him at this moment in time.
Coutinho might be a solution to this if he plays through the middle, but he might play nominally from a wide area with three other centre mids picked either.
6) Weak here. Downing's got a wand of a left foot, but he can't beat his man and thus suits an early crossing style of play that generally doesn't work for us. Sterling is only 18 and can't be depended on to put in top performances reliably at this point his career. We should be thankful for how much he has managed to give us this season at his age. In a couple of years he'll be brilliant week in, week out. Suso's tidy on the ball, but he generally hasn't created a whole lot. Really he should be playing through the middle when he does play. Assaidi has plenty of skill, but not much end product and that seems to have set Rodgers cold on him. Our strongest wide man is probably Suarez free-rolling from the right or left.
7) Sturridge is a fine player to lead the line and Suarez can fill in or support him from deep. We've got very little to judge Borini on so far.
Basically, our weakness is creativity and guile in the top third. With Gerrard dropping back into a playmaker role, Suarez is the only truly creative forward player we have. Nothing new there, really?
Hopefully Coutinho will help with that.
- Something Red -
Agree with you Something Red. Don't think Coutinho will be the creative midfielder though, and that roll needs addressing in the summer. I think Coutinho was brought in to give a different option up front, and while he is not a pure winger, he could be tricky coming off the wing like Suarez is. Brendan doesn't seem to be looking for a purist winger type.
We haven't had a good R/L midfielder since Steve Mcmanaman. Skrtel and Reina are our major week links but at least BR has dropped Skrts and will sell Reina. If you want to play through the middle like City and Chelsea you must have that Mata/Silva type player. If its down the wings like United or Spuds you must have fast wingers like Valencia/Bale. We have no identity to our style of football. I think the BR dream is to build a Barca type team from kids who pass pass pass but it's obvious Jonjo, Henderson and Allen are no Xavi Inestsa and Messi. We need an entire new midfield to build great a passing team DBol
09 Feb 2013 15:21:38
Will miss you on the pitch carra.
Keep well keep red
Paisley's genius
09 Feb 2013 14:12:29
Best send off for Carra would be-The Europa Cup, and 4th place. (though the latter be extremely hard)
Europ league would be harder, mate! Much harder!
No it wouldn't, 4th place we have to rely on other teams. Uefa cup is always on our own hands. 4th place much harder to achieve.
FowlerisGod
09 Feb 2013 13:46:07
Hi Ed's!
I'm having trouble with understanding of the FFP rules, would you explaine plz? Isit just to stop dept? Or will it actually stop man city or Chelsea buying a player for 40/50m at one time? I'm just having trouble understanding what exactly it's for?
Cheers {Ed002's Note - In simple terms:
The Demystification of the Financial Fair Play Rules (FFPR)
Introduction
I will try and simplify and summarise the FFPR and give examples where I can.
Putting aside all of the “mother country” fluff, the fundamental purpose of the FFPR is to:
(1) Ensure that clubs are operating within their means with transparent financial reporting. Example: Arsenal has debt which they can manage from the money they make as a club (good). Anzhi has a very low turnover given the amount of money they spend on players through donations from wealthy owners (bad).
(2) Protect creditors. Example: When Portsmouth went bust they owed money for players (the extreme case being Glen Johnson who had moved to Liverpool but Portsmouth still owed Chelsea for), money to local businesses (tradesmen who had worked at the ground, newsagents etc.), utility companies, the police et al (bad).
(3) Encourage responsible spending. Example: Liverpool under Hicks and Gillett borrowed money against the value of the club in order to buy players (bad).
(4) Protect the long-term viability of European club football. Example: They want to avoid the scenario of clubs entering administration or going out of business.
The FFPR apply to all UEFA club competitions and will actively come in to force from the end of June 2014 taking account of the financial monitoring period (the season just finished) and the two prior reporting periods (the two seasons before that). So when they first start, the FFPR will look at the 2013/2014 returns, and they will give consideration to the 2011/12 and 2012/13 figures.
I should make clear that it is not the full accounts of a club that are being considered, but just the “relevant” income and the “relevant” expenses. “Excluded” expenses are critical to the FFPR calculations. To this end, all clubs will need to effectively produce two sets of accounts. An audited set which are provided to Companies House and the relevant revenue organisations, and a second audited return laying out the “relevant” income and the “relevant” expenses for the purpose of the FFPR.
Relevant Income
(1) Match day gate receipts. Example: The money made by the club from paying fans attending games. This includes income from cup games when played away from home where a proportion of the gate money goes to the away side.
(2) Broadcasting rights. Example: Television income for games, money provided for radio broadcasting.
(3) Income from commercial activities. Example: Sales of bobble hats and rattles, club shop income, licensed income (e.g. DVD sales). In the future you can expect to see income from other media (e.g. streaming of games on a pay-per-view basis to the web and phones) increase.
(4) Prize money. Example: income from the Premier League, Champions League etc..
(5) Sponsorship. Example: Shirt sponsors (Standard Chartered, Samsung etc.), shirt manufactures (Adidas, Warrior etc.).
(6) Advertising. Example: Companies who buy time on video screens during games or hoardings at the stadium.
(7) Other operating income. Example: Payments made to a club for playing friendly matches in the Far East.
(8) Income from transfers: Example: All income from the sale of a player regardless of payment being due to previous clubs, the player himself etc. as they are allowable expenses which will later be deducted.
(9) Excess proceeds on the sale of tangible fixed assets. Example: The money Arsenal from converting part of Highbury in to apartments and selling them.
(10) Other income: Example: Interest on investments.
Relevant Expenses
(1) The costs of running the business (confusingly referred to as “the cost of sales” by accountants etc.). Example: Wages, ground maintenance, lighting, telephones, IT equipment, travel costs, policing costs etc..
(2) Employee related benefits and associated costs. Example: Costs of providing insurance, dental care, medical, employer NI contribution, housing, loyalty bonuses etc..
(3) Other operating expenses. Example: Payments for advertising, legal fees, agent fees, accounting fees, payments to players in relation to transfers, payments to player’s previous clubs, etc..
(4) Amortisation or transfer costs. Example: The total amount of money paid to another club to transfer a player or, if a club decides to do so, the amortised cost for that year (where a club is spreading the cost of the transfer out over the length of his contract for accounting purposes).
(5) Finance costs. Example: Bank charges, interest on loans etc..
(6) Dividends. Example: The owners may take a dividend from the profits a club makes as income.
Excluded Expenses
(1) Depreciation of tangible fixed assets. Example: The loss, if any, in value of the stadium, cars, IT equipment etc..
(2) Costs associated with the intangible fixed assets (other than player registrations). Example: goodwill, franchises, trademarks, copyrights etc..
(3) Expenditure on youth development activities. Example: All youth development expenses (housing, schooling, travel, medical etc.) are excluded from the calculations.
(4) Community development activities. Example: Outreach programmes, donations to the local community and charities, provision of equipment etc..
(5) Tax expenses. Example: Monies paid to the Inland Revenue, VAT etc..
(6) Finance costs related to construction of tangible fixed assets. Example: The interest on the £300M loan to build a new stadium.
(7) Interest payments on old loans (pre June 1, 2011). Example: Any interest due on a loan taken out for whatever purpose before June 1, 2011 is excluded from the calculations.
(8) Certain expenses from non-football operations. Example: This does not really apply to British clubs, but in other European countries clubs are often “sporting clubs” and have basketball, football, hockey team etc. all under one business.
The Calculation
FFPR calculates from a club’s “relevant” income and the “relevant” expenses whether the club is running at a surplus (profit) or deficit (loss) within a Monitoring Period (e.g. 2013/14). From this the FFPR decides if a club has met the “break even” requirement or not. This is not met if the “relevant” expenses exceed the “relevant” income by more than 5M euros (an acceptable deviation).
If the club exceeds this acceptable deviation, the owners of a club may contribute toward correcting it to a maximum of 45M euro over a rolling three year period (30M euro from 2015/16 on). Example: If Club X made a loss of 50M euro in 2013/14 due to the purchase of players, the calculation will ignore the first 5M euro and assume an owner contribution of 45M euro and there would not be an issue. However, for the two years following, there would be no allowable owner contribution as the full allocation had been used. If Club Y made a loss of 30M euro in 2013/14 due to the purchase of players, the calculation will ignore the first 5M euro and assume an owner contribution of 25M euro and there would not be an issue. But in this case, for the two years following, there would still be 20M euro allowable as owner contribution to cover further losses.
The Punishment
The Threat: If a club has been determined to have violated the “break even” requirement for a season it may be excluded from the next season’s UEFA competitions.
Likely Situation: If a club can show it has been moving in the right direction and doing what it can to overcome financial issues, perhaps brought on by a recession (e.g. in Spain) then I would expect a strongly worded letter as a warning. Perhaps by then end of the 2016/2017 season, If a club has been determined to have violated the “break even” requirement for several seasons then it may be excluded from the next season’s UEFA competitions.
UEFA are willing to make some exceptions to the rule and have already said they will consider:
(1) The quantum and trend of the break even result. Example: Chelsea has spent a lot this summer rebuilding an aging squad, so even with considerable additional income from winning the Champions League it could violate the “break even” requirement. However, spending less next season will show the club moving in the right direction. Expect a strongly worded letter in a couple of years time.
(2) Debt situation. Example: A possible “get out” for Barcelona, Real Madrid and Manchester United should they have a bad season and need to violate the “break even” requirement. Consideration will be given to the existing debt and the ability of the clubs to service that debt. The trend of the debt reducing and an excuse of “one bad season” and “need to rebuild the team” would likely result in a slapped wrist.
(3) Fluctuating exchange rates. Example: All non eurozone countries need to report the FFPR figures in euros which could fluctuate due to the exchange rate, whereas a number of the UEFA figures are fixed amounts (e.g. the 5M euro acceptable deviation).
(4) Projected figures. Example: UEFA will allow clubs to show that they are moving in the right direction if they provide projected figures showing that the “break even” requirement will be met in the following season.
(5) Force majeure. Example: Any extraordinary events or situation arising that is beyond the club’s control will be taken in to account.
(6) Until then end of 2014/15 only - Ongoing reductions in wage costs. UEFA will be flexible over the “break even” requirement if a club can show that their wage bill has been reducing and with the exclusion of wages of players signed before June 1, 2010 they would have met the “break even” requirement. Example: An escape route for the likes of Chelsea prior to prior season with Drogba, Anelka, Bosingwa, Kalou, Cech, Terry, Lampard etc. wages excluded from the calculations. A possible future escape route for the likes of Barcelona.
The Issues
There are a number of matters that UEFA still need to figure out and a number of concerns that certain clubs and certain national associations have. Off the top of my head:
(1) Loopholes: Whilst UEFA has done what it can to block any potential “loopholes” it is well aware that exclusion of wages for players signed before June 2010 is one it has introduced itself, and one that will be popular with the higher paying clubs as a short term escape route through to the summer of 2015. The matters of excessive sponsorship will be addressed via a cap to thwart the concerns over the likes of Manchester City abusing the rules. The cap has yet to be finalised but will require ratification.
(2) Soft Sponsorship: UEFA are concerned at the aggressive approach to obtaining sponsorship some clubs are taking. Questions are being asked about the ethics in clubs having airline travel partners, photocopier partners etc.. The Spanish clubs have raised this as a concern.
(3) National Sponsorship Variations: As we have seen tobacco sponsorship leave Formula 1 UEFA would like to see alcohol sponsorship out of football. We already have a situation where sponsorship by alcohol related businesses are forbidden in certain countries. Wealthy breweries are now focussing their sponsorship in other countries thereby creating a perceived imbalance in what income clubs are able to obtain in sponsorship. The French and Russian clubs have raised this as a concern.
(4) National Financial Distribution Variations: Concerns exist in countries where different models are used for distributing prize money, contributing to the grassroots game and distributing income from television and other media broadcasting. This led to an original request (rejected) from a number of clubs to restrict the FFPR to only the wealthiest of clubs, those with a turnover in excess of xM euros.
(5) National Taxation Variations: There is a considerable difference across UEFA nations in taxation, and this is seen to be reflected in the wages paid to players. The Spanish clubs have raised this as a concern.
(6) Third Party Ownership: Countries that allow third party ownership of players are seen to have a distinct advantage in being able to keep the costs of transfer fees low as they are only paying for a proportion of a player. The English clubs have raised this as a concern.
The Great Fear
Without going in to too much detail: (a) A number of clubs take the opportunity a once or twice a year to discuss various issues including changes in rules, television rights, the power of UEFA, exploitation issues for new technology streams, etc.. These discussions, the last of which were in late August, also always turn to the possibility and structure of a breakaway pan European league. Several are ex-G14 clubs, several are not, and some clubs decline involvement in such discussions. (b) The plan is that at some point a number of clubs would break away from their national leagues and UEFA. They accept that they would be banned from all existing club competition and the players would initially be banned from all FIFA competitions as well, but know that FIFA would be looking to negotiate in any case. It would be the end of UEFA in all probability and UEFA are very aware of this. It would also result in a restructuring of many of the national leagues. (c) The clubs would renegotiate their television rights, rights of distribution via other streams etc.. (d) It remains the greatest fear of UEFA and all major national authorities that one day this will happen.
}
A truly remarkable response again from our very own ED002! don't know how you find the time with all that dishwashing and nailvarnish remover stuff to do. I know its hard being a woman in a mans world but somehow you manage it ;-)
Tel 1949
09 Feb 2013 14:19:23
No could you explain it in a form of Shakespearean prose? Or in interpretative dance?
;)
Jolly Red
Can you write it in binary please ed.
derryred {Ed002's Note - Not hexadecimal?}
It doesn't matter what way Ed002 describes it. Wht matters is that when he does, it has to be to the tune of Stan Bush's 'The Touch'
Cuchulainn's Hounds
09 Feb 2013 13:23:32
Sissoko what a player he looks
Dalglish you should of listend to camolli
Eds has he got a buy out clause lol
Basy
09 Feb 2013 14:19:06
Mate we have got lots of midfield who are sitting on bench and getting their wages without contributing so I doubt will go for another midfield unless we start selling some of them.
Allen is in danger he must improve or might leave because his not happy at all by lack of playing time just read his latest interview he makes it clear that he hasn't come here to sit on bench and wants to play in order to get his form back again this is the same problem with Borini good player but not goal scorer, not happy sitting on bench and wants to play regularly or wants to go back home to play regularly and be in national team squad. Italian people have made it clear if he wants to be selected again by his national team then needs to play or quit Liverpool in search of regular football. Some of italian teams are pushing for his signature and talking to his agent. The italian media is saying that Borini has told some of his friends his not happy at Liverpool and wants to come back home it will be interesting to know what will happen next.
I must have missed something. What did he do that was so special exactly? I saw him lose the ball often in midfield and play almost no defense, although admittedly the game was poor so may have nodded off for a few while watching it.
09 Feb 2013 13:09:35
8 to 1 for WBA to beat Liverpool, I'm having some of that, easy money.
Ched
Why don't you; have your house on. 8-1 Jeez! them bookies are thick!
Or maybe just maybe they like taking money off mugs like you:-)
kidmillions
A fool and his money are easily parted.
Nick
09 Feb 2013 13:09:01
With Luis Suarez saying that Liverpool are not the team they were and is contemplating his future. I believe he has not got over Kenny going.
What happens when all our big names have gone?
Just a bunch of average players and a wannabe manager?
It was a dark day when King Kenny got sacked by FSG.
Redthai
I thought solar eclipse only lasted 8 minutes max?
Tubby
It was probably the way he said that he enjoys the way BR is getting the team to play and how much he likes playing for him that made you think that. Reading between the lines, he is obviously saying the exact opposite. Thought the same myself. Not.
Nick
I was also upset to see kenny get sacked however Rodgers has done a good job. When we sell players, we replace them. Liverpool FC was around more than 100 years before suarez signed, and will be around long after he is gone whenever that may be.
derryred
09 Feb 2013 17:59:59
Sorry mate , that's weak. Players do often have a link with the manager but look at the stats, as a professional he must realise that even this team is giving the highest profile he has ever had, and is is only now getting the respect he deserves for his talent.
Suarez under Kenny was seen by many outside the club as a liability, who couldn't finish but had great skill.
Now under Br he is seen as joint best player in the Prem & possibly Europe.
Doesn't sound like it has been terrible for him. if we can challenge next season then we will stand a good chance of keeping hold of him.
Kobi
09 Feb 2013 10:56:04
Salute to Jamie Carragher, loyal club servant. Walked in and out on his own terms and served the club magnificently, while there. A shining example for all to see. ra1969
09 Feb 2013 10:05:36
Eds if Sturridge isn't fit by Monday night do you think Coutinho may be given a start? give him a taste of the Anfield experience. I'm sure all the fans will be happy to get a glimpse of what he can do {Ed002's Note - I would expect Borini to start if Sturridge is not available.}
Borini does not present much of a goal threat for the opposition and I for one will be happy if he does not start the match
He deserves a chance support him ynwa
He has had some chances already and has not cut it
Have you not seen the number of chances he creates by opening space with these intelligent runs. Juist recently Suarez' goal vs oldam was partly down to the run made by borini to shift their defenders across. The norwich own goal-if you watch the replay of it who was there to tap the ball in if sterilng missed. I can't think of other examples off the top of my head but he does create chances.
derryred
He is a forward and his job is to score goals- let's judge him on what he has been bought to do
Lads, give Borini a chance. He clearly has talent. Brendan is not an person. On my XBOX Fifa 2013, Barcelona just tried to sign Joe Allen from us. That obviously means he is talented and BR knows this. Maybe BR plays Fifa.
09 Feb 2013 09:33:49
Heres hopefully a post with some sense attached to it,
This summer I very much doubt we'll be buying any foreign wonder centre backs with fancy names we've never really heard of apart from on this site, the chances are we'll be signing or trying to sign Ashley Williams, i'd be happy with that, what with Kelly back and Wisdom getting better all the time that would do me,
I don't really see why there is a need to bandy striker names around really either, If Suarez is staying then we have an abundance of attacking talent and more to come through the academy, sorry I just don't see it, Borini has hardly had a chance and will probably be cover for Suarez/Sturridge, then we have Couthino, Sterling, Suso, Yesil and Whoever comes through the youth, Ibe etc etc, I just don't see Rodgers changing what he's doing with regards to blooding the kids so he'll dip into those again at some point,
As for midfielders well I suppose that's each to their own, personally I think between the lads we have that are getting better and better and gaining more experience in Rodgers style of play we have quite a few who can do particular jobs, I personally see Henderson becoming undroppable he's improved so much, I think we possibly might find a cover for Lucas but aside from that the only place I think we might strengthen would be another winger who I also don't see being a big fancy foreign name we've never hardly seen play, I see more chance of a Sinclair on loan myself,
Like I said only my own opinion no ITK but I think with these new rules on spending coming into play then everyone is going to have to play the game a little differently, were in good shape already so one or two of the aforementioned would do for me if we can kick on next season again,
Heres hoping for a monster finish this season!
YNWA JFT96
Titsquirrel
So the 2 players you mentioned have both worked with br before, Firstly there is no way Ashleigh Williams is going to leave Swansea and secondly Sinclair is nowhere near a premier player, and then of course you would have the critics of br saying he only signs players he has worked with in the past
fforestfach red
Williams is top class as a defender and organiser, we know what he said about Suarez, its insignificant. Suarez may leave and be replaced, then any issue that may have been talked about will have disappeared.
Evo YNWA
09 Feb 2013 09:19:50
Hi Eds,
Do you think we will ever see a Liverpool be team entering the football league? I know that in Spain they have be teams in the lower leagues and surely this is a better idea than loaning players out as when we do they never seem to get games like Morgan at Rotherham. Also why have we never used a club like Tranmere for loaning most of our players? wouldn't it be a win win situation for both teams.
Thanks
Marc {Ed002's Note - That will never happen in England. You will see fewer teams not more in the longer term.}
09 Feb 2013 09:19:49
Hi Ed002
Sound financial advice, however too many skeletons in Bedfordshire so Cambs may have to enjoy the pleasure of my company for a while yet.
Matters football, hearing a lot about the extra cash coming into the premier league next year, what kind of payout will clubs be expecting?
Thanks in advance.
BaldyRed {Ed002's Note - Assume an increase of about 50% on the broadcast payments.}
09 Feb 2013 08:35:17
I would imagine we'll start to see a resurgence in form from Skrtel in the coming months. There is no doubt likely to be some interest in the summer, but I don't think it's from sides he'd really want to go too. If he can find his form, with Carra retiring and Coates leaving I think he'll go.
Personally I think it's very bold replacing 3 centre halves, so I hope he stays as he does have the necessary quality required. I think Carra's replacement should be a strong experienced player, with Kelly/Wisdom stepping into Coates role.
A left back should also be a priority, someone whose experienced in my view which allows rotation with Enrique and Johnson to play his natural position, with McLaughlin stepping up as an understudy, Robinson and Flannagan to go out on loan.
Defence wise, that's probably us set. There are other areas that we'll address, goalkeeper, right wing, central midfield but we're hopefully not looking at another overhaul as we're not a long way from a very competitive squad.
Papa G
09 Feb 2013 08:30:49
In:
ter Stergen 10mil
Diakite free
Howedes 7 mil
Taylor 4 mil
Diame/Fer/Capoue 4-8 mil
Eriksen 15milplus Assiadi
Rojas Free
Ince 6 mil
Total 46-50 Mil
Out:
Reina 9 mil
Downing 8 mil
Coates 6 mil
Skrtel 12 mil
Flanagan 2mil
Carroll 17 mil
Spearing 4mil
Total: 58 mil
If we get Champo League expect experience like Villa, Alonso Soldaldo to come in.
Vorm 7m, Williams 8m, Pearce Free, Iborra 3m, Hughes 4m, Ince 6m, Jovetic 22m, Di Santo Free
Out - 50m
Reina 10m, Skrtel 13m, Coates 7m, Spearing 3m, Downing 9m, Carroll 17m, Assaidi 4m, Flanagan 1m
In - 64m
Im pretty sure BR would run around Anfield naked if we got howedes for 7 million. make it 15 million, then Schalke I guess will accept.
Indian Buzzer
Not the original Poster nor in the know but as far as I am aware Howedes will be in the Last year of his contract in the Summer.
09 Feb 2013 08:12:53
Boot room blarney - first of all well done to jamie, thanks for the great memories and you never know he may be back in some capaciity after a small lay off, look at scholes. Eds or anyone has Carra done any coaching badges I would love to see him coach our young defenders, will miss him, a legend.
I heard carra has uefa be tickets so yes he is well qualified to coach our youngsters. andy.
09 Feb 2013 02:25:42
After Carra announcing his retirement after this season and with likely Reina, Skrtel, Coates, Spearing, Assaidi, Pacheco, Carroll leaving in the summer I'd love to see us getting : GK Ter Stegen
CB Adil Rami
CB Mateo Musacchio
LB Luke Shaw
DM Wanyama ( lucas isn't good as before and he need real competition )
LW Ben Arfa
el capitano
Takes up to 3 months for players to find top form after an injury, especially with cruciate ligament damage or ruptures. So be patient with Lucas, also Celtics defensive midfielder isn't going to move to sit on a bench when he can go elsewhere and actually play.
BCDI.
08 Feb 2013 18:04:45
Ed002, Do you believe the impending (Seemingly) financial collapse of La Liga would be the uprising for a breakout European league? Do you think this could possibly happen even sooner than you had originally predicted? It seems we are on the verge of a new time in football. Anyways, with the news these days, it's at least looking that way. Thanks for your thoughts,
Sk_Red, {Ed002's Note - There have always been Spanish clubs involved in the discussions but it is not something they could easily force on their own. As I have said before I really do expect it to eventually happen and the conseuences will be significant for teh extant league structures.}
How would that work eds? {Ed002's Note - Without going in to too much detail: (a) A number of clubs take the opportunity a once or twice a year to discuss various issues including changes in rules, television rights, the power of UEFA, exploitation issues for new technology streams, etc.. These discussions, the last of which were in late August, also always turn to the possibility and structure of a breakaway pan European league. Several are ex-G14 clubs, several are not, and some clubs decline involvement in such discussions. (b) The plan is that at some point a number of clubs would break away from their national leagues and UEFA. They accept that they would be banned from all existing club competition and the players would initially be banned from all FIFA competitions as well, but know that FIFA would be looking to negotiate in any case. It would be the end of UEFA in all probability and UEFA are very aware of this. It would also result in a restructuring of many of the national leagues. (c) The clubs would renegotiate their television rights, rights of distribution via other streams etc.. (d) It remains the greatest fear of UEFA and all major national authorities that one day this will happen.
There is every likelihood that the big money from television, sponsorship etc. would go with a breakaway league. It would completely rupture the operations of UEFA and I would expect it would require national associations like the FA to restructure their leagues. Nobody wants this but it is the eventual consequence I would expect. If I had to speculate, I would think (1) you might eventually see something like five or six EPL teams leave for two-tier pan European league; (2) the Premier League would be disbanded as an organisation; (3) the FA would restructure in to two 20 team divisions with lower leagues regionalised as they were many years ago; (4) FIFA would ban all players from the breakaway teams from International football - perhaps rescinding that position to stop FIFA breaking up as well. I could also see many teams lose their professional status. I would think we are probably 10 years away from any significant move at this time.
For me an eventual a breakaway pan-European league would force the restructuring of many of the national leagues, possibly resulting in a British league with perhaps only a couple of professional tiers and then regionalised amateur leagues below that. Financially I do not see that so many pro sides can be sustained within the sport which, like it or not, will see more and more money going in to the highest levels of the game. Governments will ensure that grassroot sports get funding but everything in the middle (Southern, Northern, Conference, Division 2, Scottish Divisions 1-3, League of Wales will not get the funding needed to continue on any sort of professional basis.}
09 Feb 2013 11:34:29
Wow. I would hate to see you go into detail
Frank {Ed002's Note - There is a much longer version I did.}
Thanks for that ED002, really interesting. This definately gives me some great input for footy debates at work!
Fowler99
Why can't domestic leagues and panEuropean leagues (including European Super League) co-exist?
My solution:
1. Teams wanting to join the European Super League (or Atlantic League etc) field TWO teams. They have an Elite Euro squad but remain in their domestic league fielding a team selected from their A squad.
2. The squads must be separate and players cannot be inter-changed with perhaps two players allowed to swap between the squads in a transfer window.
3. The only teams likely to want to join elite leagues have huge squads and stockpile the best talent anyway so paying for two squads should not be an issue.
4. By ensuring a high proportion of the domestic squads are home-grown and under a certain age it should help countries develop more talent.
5. If the pan Euro league ever fell apart each club is able to change the name of its domestic team back to its original, amalgamate the squads and they pick up in whatever division their A team is ( ensures big clubs take domestic competition seriously)
6. Fans are not denied seeing their club every week in domestic action but those who can afford to can also watch the elite team in action around Europe.
Seems a much less messy way of making pan Euro leagues work than any other suggestion I've seen.
Could this ever work Ed02?
PieInTheSkyMan {Ed001's Note - you suggest having a reserve team basically playing in the domestic league. That is ludicrous, talk about demeaning to the league.}
But the league will be demeaned anyway without historic clubs and teams like Chelsea have top players out on loan at other clubs when they could be playing in the PL team. It requires a change of mindset - you can call it a reserve team if you like but why not think of it as a PL Liverpool squad and a Euro Liverpool squad. You maintain the connection between the two and maintain the integrity of the domestic league shortly? Otherwise Swansea will be he champions and in the record books there'll be an asterix saying * won it when Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal and Spurs weren't competing.
I say again- most teams in the Euro Super League will have enough players to field two competitive squads.
And if LFC join a Euro Super League why not allow those fans who can't afford to traipse around Europe a team to continue supporting at Anfield in domestic competition? {Ed002's Note - I am afraid to say that if the clubs split away both the clubs and the players will be excluded from all UEFA and FIFA competition.}
09 Feb 2013 01:17:43
I thinks its a bit daft, to be honest I think Suarez is being dry, like why would there be talk of contracts, he has only just signed one until 2018, five years. lol five years peeps, contracts dnt mean too much these days neway its not often a club will force a player to see it out so if he's going or not his contract will not affect that decision. rant over.
Truth is Suarez is in a really strong position for negotiations over a new contract, they could include criteria which must be met for example: Minimum fee release, Champions League ambitions met, or just a bumper pay increase, loyalty bonus if he stays etcetera.
BCDI.
Messi has renegotiated his contract with Barcelona 6 times in the last 8 years.
So it wouln't suprrise me that Saurez does this with Liverpool this or next summer.
The Red Indian.
09 Feb 2013 00:51:50
Villa are quoted as saying they'll want double the £7M they paid for Benteke should he leave in the summer.
With 14 goals in a poor Villa team he's surely worth a punt for £15M -£20M, he's only 22 and, from what I saw of him at Anfield when they beat us, he looks a proper striker.
The last opposition striker who caught my attention that way was Drogba when he tore Sami and Stefan new ones when we played Marseille before Chelsea picked him up.
We shouldn't make the same mistake again.
Wow another big 21 year old target man striker tore us a new one as well. his name Andy Carroll. I really don't think we should make the same mistake again.
derryred
20m? Worth a punt? Are you serious?
Derryred, I'm clueless as to why yourself and others are making comparisons to Carroll. Ok, he's tall with a big presence up front, but his speed, first touch and shooting are far better. I wouldn't ever pay that amount for him, but to compare him to Carroll I'd say was unrealistic, if anything he's more in the same cut as Balotelli, just not as crazy. To be fair I don't really see the forward department as our main concern. I'd say defence would be top of the agenda, although if we were to make reinforcements up front I'd love to see Mertens. An interchangeable front of Suarez, Sturridge, Coutinho, Sterling, Borini, Downing and Mertens would be great.
JFT 96
JP
09 Feb 2013 00:32:25
Signings that need to be made:
1) Prority - a replacement for Carragher, also possibly Skrtel and probably Coates.
Suggestions: Amorebieta, Ogbonna, Williams, Mirin, Albiol, Kjaer, Sakho, Dede, Rami, Godin, Diakite.
Verdict: Williams would seem most likely as Rodgers knows the player well, but would he offer the same quality as an Amorebieta or Ogbonna who have also been linked. More than one defender may even arrive should Coates leave which looks likely - possibly Diakite on a free.
2) If we sell Reina, which is a strong possibility, who would replace him?
Suggestions: Ter Stegen, Begovic, Vorm, Valdes, Ochoa, Alves, Mandanda, Krul, Al Habsi, Mingolet, Trapp, Forster.
Verdict: I'm still not certain Reina will leave, but if he does I'd like to see Vorm or Krul come in. Ter Stegen would be ideal.
3) Carragher's retirement is also a reminder that Gerrard will follow suit in a couple of years. Yes Henderson is improving but I still feel we need another midfielder, someone who can boss a game like Mascherano and Alonso used to. Someone with class.
Suggestions: Alonso, Eriksen, Diame, Tiote, Strootman, Capoue, Honda, Moutinho, Wanayama.
I would've liked Sneijder in January but since that didn't materialise I'd love to see Eriksen arrive. Alonso has also spoken in the past about a possible return.
4) Downing's improved, but is he good enough to break into the top four? I still think no, not as a starting player anyway. I'd like to see another wideman come in.
Suggestions: Ben Arfa, Turan, Muniain, Sinclair, Sanchez, Ince, Navas, James Rodriguez, Isco, Mertens.
Verdict: Ince is probably the best bet, but I don't think he's any improvement on Downing - not at the moment. Turan would be nice, but perhaps too ambitious a signing - I'd be happy with the touted Ben Arfa-Carroll swap.
5) John Barnes has said he thinks Liverpool still need another forward to compete at the top level, and I'd have to agree.
Suggestions: Torres, Villa, Bony, Soldado, Benteke, Michu, Negredo, Gomis, Jovetic, De Jong.
Verdict: If Borni doesn't improve then I could see another forward coming in this summer - I'd take Torres back, but would the rest of the fans and would Rodgers?
6) Finally perhaps we need back up for Enrique - Robinson still seems unready.
Suggestions: N. Taylor, Shaw.
Verdict: a bid for the currently injured Taylor shouldn't be ruled out.
In conclusion it seems Rodgers will be bcaked this summer as we push closer to the top of the table. Perhaps we won't strengthen in all these positions, but there will be several big departures this summer such as Carragher, Coates, Carroll and possibly Reina, Skrtel, Assaidi and maybe Downing. Our main priotity this summer will be to retain the services of Suarez and a top four finish this season would make that all the more easier - as would attracting the players I mentioned at the top end of the market - e. g. Turan, Alonso etc.
Irishdom15
Sorry decent post until you said you'd take Torres back! Why would anyone want that.
You forget that alonso is only a year younger than gerrard so he would be retiring soon after gerrard
So what reason would you take Torres back for. His hair styles? Surely not on footballing ability at the moment.
Mighty reds
One potential play that could boost us up front would be to use the Carroll money to bid for Jovetic with Borini going to Fiorentina. Then get in Di Santo on a free. Jovetic for the starting XI at a cost of c12m + Borini and Di Santo as a back up striker. Still have c5m to spend elsewhere on attackers - that would almost pay for Ince.
08 Feb 2013 23:56:16
Ed please tell me the pictures people are putting up aren't actually the ones for next season?! Warrior will get nowhere if they think people will buy these jerseys haha! Are they real?
Cheers Ed,
LS7. {Ed001's Note - I have seen far worse!}
Just seen it on the Liverpool sightings page, not impressed personally. I know it's subjective and pleasing all it always tricky, but really?
If I see a fan wearing it then I know they are hardcore supporters, I think it's gash from the lower half down. Shame it's not a Geordie top because their fans can't see the lower half of their bellies. Just playing. XD
BCDI.
I thought each kit had to be used for two seasons to stop the shirt makers ripping everyone off for a new design each season. The posted away one is horrible nothingness, not fit to be used by LFC. Nothing wrong with current home shirt, best since 05 in my opinion, just red with minimal trimmings.
ND
It looks like rain falling on a field of magic mushrooms. I'd be surprised if we sold more than 10 of these worldwide
Home kit isn't to bad but the others are awful
The white one is scientifically designed to confuse and bewilder opponents.
Roysterbaby
08 Feb 2013 23:48:28
If anyone could help me with this I would be extremely grateful, my son is 14 and going to anfield with his mates on his own for the first time. On the Lfc site it says juniors £5 each is this true or are there any hidden terms and conditions because when I take him the leauge matches I just get 1 adult and 1 child and its simple as that also will I be able to get him 3 tickets next to each other as £5 each seems to good to be true any help would be very helpfull.
Lfc Liam
Think you'll find it's £5 if accompanied by an adult?
There's info on the official LFC site buried under the tickets section somewhere.
You might have to dig a bit
08 Feb 2013 23:42:32
How are the eds supposed to know who we will sign in the summer? Surely the types of player we look at will depend on where we finish and how well we do in the EL? The season is closed for a good few weeks before the transfer window even opens, surely BR will decide who we are looking at when the season is done and dusted and we can evaluate each players performance?