Liverpool Banter Archive December 08 2014

08 Dec 2014 18:16:15
Ed001 what's your opinion Of Andre villa boas as a manager? I remember reding a story from one of his teachers saying people would come into the classroom talking about the games and who scored but he would talk about the tactics etc. Think he just needed time

{Ed001's Note - I think he is too similar to Rodgers, the exact same issue of playing the same tactics and system whether or not it suits the players at his disposal or not. I don't think he is ready personally.}

08 Dec 2014 18:38:36
Have to disagree with Ed01 a bit. AVB likes to play high press, high intensity football - completely different from Rodgers. AVB actually models his teams on Bielsa's sides, plus he's won trophies (albeit in Portugal). I think AVB is a good manager

{Ed001's Note - I didn't mean he uses the same tactics mate, I just mean he is like him, using the same tactics regardless of what suits his players best.}

08 Dec 2014 18:42:15
AVB plays a high defensive line and is very stubborn. Wont knock the ball around for whole 90 mts. That's assured.

Thanks Ed001. I don't mind a manager having a philosophy; as we saw second half of last season the pressing intensity game is great to watch and works with our players. I'd rather that philosophy than the rubbish we're seeing at the moment too.

No thank you for AVB, he is the same as BR, he fell apart after bale left.

{Ed008's Note - But when he was sacked at Spurs he was only 3pts off 2nd place before he was sacked.. Harsh don't you think!

Like using dawson, a very slow cb in a high defensive line ed001? yeah i remember us scoring plenty against that.

Either way, AVB is a no go for me. He just looks like a man who wants to prove everybody wrong even tho his tactics don`t work. Ring a bell?

08 Dec 2014 16:08:20
Hi Eds and Reds.

Martin Ordergard would be our first Signing in Jan.

09 Dec 2014 03:08:40
There's the Harry we all know and love.

Comon Harry, you can't possibly know that lol.

08 Dec 2014 15:11:30
Just wanted to defend Brendan a little bit with a remark that sterling, sturridge and suarez made him look good last year but my point is does di maria not make van gall look better or lewondowski, reus, gotze with Klopp, Messi, xavi and iniesta with pep, robben, ribery and gotze with pep, rooney, ronaldo, Scholes and gigs with ferries, henry, vibrant and Berkhamp with winger! Surely it's 70/30 with the.manager the.latter.but.would.big.Sam.of.got the better of.them players or.moves? I'm not.doubting.the.players but.surely.the.manager.does.something? Like I.don't.think.wee would.of.donew half as good.with.a 4-3-3 last year with.sterling.and.suarez.on the wings, didn't the.manager.select.the.best tactics.for.all.the.players.at.his.disposal? And. He.is.trying.to.do.the.same.this.year, the.diamond won't.work.without.the right strikers!

You made that very difficult to read.

Last season the only reason why the diamond worked for us so brilliantly was because of our pace up top.

Sterling is better centrally and a complete waste on the wing. Markovic did play as a striker for Benfica on occasion and has loads of pace and Borini may not be the quickest but he is not the slowest. There is already a reason for Rodgers to try something different instead of just continuing to play one up top. Pair Marko and Borini up top and play Sterling right behind them. Plenty of pace and mobility to cause the opposition more problems than what we currently are with Lambert up on his own.

Unfortunately we have a stubborn manager who is not willing to be as flexible as he was last season because he is too adamant that the philosophy he sold to FSG when he got the job will work.

08 Dec 2014 18:21:43
Max
With regards to your post, I don't think Its all down to BR alone, The players have been very poor through the match and has shown no desire whatsoever.

Sterling need space to run through the defense, The space created by Suarez and Sturridge last season.
There is no one to create the space, So he is ineffective.

You don't need a bloody big game plan to beat teams like Sunderland, West-ham or QPR ( No disrespect ), If you are quality, You would do it on the pitch.

Passion

Rodgers has not tried to create any space of late for Sterling with Lambert playing up top on his own so your comment quite honestly is a bit moot.

If you stick two mobile and pacey players ahead of Sterling then that will create space. Markovic has shown he has the pace and Borini well is mobile enough and has a very good engine. Sticking Sterling out wide and Lambert up on his own has done much for us. Borini and Markovic will create space for Sterling no doubt.

08 Dec 2014 19:46:57
Max

With both Sturridge and Balletolli out injured Lambert is the only option upfront and everyone here welcomed that move.
On the very beginning I did express my view on Markovic to be the Robben for Netherlands ( false 9 ).
BR wants one of Countinho/Lallana to be in the Starting eleven which rules out Markovic.

The names We mention here doesn't need any special training to deliver as they are proven players from the league.

Sterling tries to be very clever most times loosing possession many times.

BR might be wrong for so many other things, But certainly He hasn't tied the hands and legs of any players out there.

08 Dec 2014 19:48:12
Max

I can't believe When did this site became a fan of Borini?

Passion we other strikers were not playing well the reserves deserve a chance its why we gave a "big squad"

Passion, He might not have tied up their legs BUT yet he might have because he is the one not giving Borini a sniff nor playing Balo in a system that doesn`t suit him or gives him the best chance to succeed (granted he has his flaws BUT Prandelli got the best out of him with Italy because he played a system with Cassano or Di Natale close to him so he is NOT a lost cause, IMO). He is also the one that doesn`t give Can, Marko or Lallana a real chance in games yet plays the horrendous GJ and the cringworthy Skrtl. BR did ll that and might as well have tied the team, the players, the club and it`s fans in knots.

09 Dec 2014 05:15:05
Redohio

How many goals have Borini scored for us that you and rest of this page have become a fan of him.
Was he not good enough that we sent him on a loan?
Is it the first time you hear a manager fall out with a player?
I never knew this page would turn upside down for borini.

Balletolli played in a similar 4-3-3 at Milan scoring 14 in 19 games in the first half and none in the second half of last season with El-sharawaay on the left side. Similar to what we deployed Sterling and lallana on either side.

Can, lallana and Markovic, out of which lallana has been playing a lot of games for us.
You could only field 11 at a time, you want Hendo, Lucas, Gerrard, can, Marko, lallana, sturride Sterling all in the same team? Not possible.

Skretel is a poor defender, by with Sakho out injured and lovern has been terrible whom do you want us to play at the back?

I agree in johnson. But is he responsible for us not scoring goals?

BR is guilty of quiet a lot of things but certainly not for the undererforming players.

And what you think a new manager would come in and lallana and Balletolli would be firing all cylinders?

Cheers eds

{Ed001's Note - surely Johnson is partly responsible when he is not providing the width needed, plus is giving away the ball, so making it more difficult to create chances? You can't absolve any player of blame completely. This is a team game and they are not playing as a team.}

09 Dec 2014 06:22:08
Fair reply ed01, but don't you think he has a clause in his contract, " play me when I am fit"
Else he won't be played at LB? Which is very very rare.

{Ed001's Note - I don't see how that is relevant? The question should be why is the manager unable to get him to play any better, as that is the art of management, to get the best out of the tools at your disposal.}

BR is not guilty for underperforming players you say?

So how do we assess his performance then?

We can't assess his goals/assists cause I don't see BR in the team sheet.

His players performance is exactly how we should assess him. Where do you think managers like Mourinho, Ferguson etc. get their plaudits? They win. How do they win? Their players perform, and win them the games.

Are you suggesting that we should change our players and not our manager? Because there are definitely quality in our squad. Maybe not world class, but as a unit, this team is way better than most in the premier league. We have good players in almost every position. Were not winning games and he's not changing anything at all.

Our strikers are not scoring, why don't we give Borini a chance then? he's a striker after all. He gave Lambert the chance when both Balotelli and Sturridge is injured, basically he had no choice. And sarcastically comments on Borini not regretting to stay with us, how good is that for team morale? Or maybe give the chance to any of our young players? He keeps on moaning about Balotelli but keeps on playing him, will it change anything? What would our other players think? You won't know what youngsters or Borini could do until you give them the chance. Lallana, IMO one of our best performers so far, keeps on getting subbed off, or kept on the bench for Allen. Suso can do much more and has more potential than Allen. This decision he is making is so confusing.

Oh and players underperforming, you either get them to perform, or drop them. What do you think FSG hired him for? To ensure the players perform on the field and win games, nothing less.

08 Dec 2014 13:01:06
Does Rossiter and Chrivella play the same position? If they do who do you guys think has the most potential?

They can both play cm and cdm but I doubt either could play as a 10 or any other position infact. In short they can both play in the same team, rossiter has more potential but they both have potential to be 1st teamers

08 Dec 2014 18:34:10
Both are fantastic talent and Chrivella is the junior version of Alonso. He would become a top player for us.

Chirivella will probably be the better player but since Rossiter is a scouser he's going to be the one getting the chances. They're are both going to be brilliant players but Chirivella will probably be moving to Real Madrid soon. It's a shame we've got 2 young players at the same age playing the same position because only one of them is going to get the chance. On technical terms, Chirivella should get the chance.

09 Dec 2014 12:03:48
Chrivella is the most technically skilled player in the academy. But Ross will get the chances because he's scouse

08 Dec 2014 12:23:52
Having read Brendan's interview on the website this morning (and I know that's a bad idea Eds) I can't say I am overly optimistic about things changing tomorrow.

The general tone is that we need to stay calm and show patience. Whilst that in itself is not a bad thing, in the language of Brendan patience = possession. Possession = little real width, far too much time in your own half, stifled creativity and little to no attacking threat.

I think the only way to play tomorrow is just to go at them right from the beginning whilst the crowd is with them. Press high, get in their face and force errors early on. If we play the way we did against Sunderland then we will allow them to settle, get organised and quieten down the crowd.

It also annoys me enormously how much emphasis he has placed on the Sunderland clean sheet. I mean I know he puts his foot in his mouth but come on man. Sunderland ultimately came for a draw (which they were well worth) and did not show a tremendous amount of attacking intent. It wasn't like we withstood a barrage or anything.

Tomorrow may well be a turning point in popular opinion. To go out with a damp squib and with a whimper may see a lot more Liverpool fans questioning him. I sincerely hope that is not the case.

{Ed002's Note - It is a game that Liverpool should win and I can see know reason why they won't. What I can't see is why it should be a turning point for anything Wassa.}

I think it "could" be a turning point for us simply because you have to think that a player waking up on Thursday morning in the champions league has to be a slightly more confident player than one who wakes up and is in the Europa league if only slightly.
But let's face it.
Anything positive is a good thing.

08 Dec 2014 13:25:50
In regards to the game Ed002, I completely agree.

However, and with the greatest respect to Sunderland, that was a game we also should have won. What I mean is that I expect Basel to set up in a very similar way and so tactically that game was almost like a dress rehearsal for the Basel game.

Liverpool over the last so many seasons have especially struggled against teams set up defensively with the ability (and more so the intention) to hit us on the counter attack. Villa are a prime example of that tactic being used effectively.

All I was trying to say really is that if we approach the game in the same way then I expect us to struggle to break them down. If we struggle then the crowd get frustrated and it could potentially be a long night for all.

As for the change in opinion I appreciate that nothing will change internally at all as a result of this game. I just expect more of the fan base to turn on him if we go out having played something similar to what we did against Sunderland (ie without a real fight). The good feeling following last years results was only going to last for so long with the disappointing run of form we are in.

A potentially lifeless exit from the Champions league may just alter the opinion of more fans, albeit I appreciate he has already lost a large number as is evident on here.

I hope he gets it right because if we do there is no reason we can't look forward to the next round draw.

08 Dec 2014 13:35:14
Lol Ed002, a game that Liverpool should win? Have u seen the team play this season? because all i have seen this season is them playing with blindfolds and Basel are no chumps. They have a much better European pedigree in recent years than Liverpool, and certainly more experience. I am going for a 1-1 draw with Basel advancing to the knockouts.

Basle are running away with the Swiss Super League.
They are not Sunderland.

It would be a difficult match under any circumstances.

Then follows Man Utd then Arsenal.

A testing time.

If I read the table correctly, a draw or win puts Basel through. Meaning they can park the bus if they choose and still go through and it's not like we're well known for being able to pry apart stubborn defenses. I'd say Basel hold their future in their hands more than us as all they need to do is not lose while we must win.

There are no more pitiful excuses IMO. Basel may be a decent team, but we need to be winning these kind of games at home, especially considering the situation.

Johnnybarnes89-90, wish the players had awoke up in September and realised they are back in the champions league after a 5year absence, what a feeling that would of been for them.

Just can't see us beating Basle, we don't score goals and are weak at the back and Brendan had no actual ideas beyond "get the ball to Suarez", now that plan isn't available, he had been exposed.

Let's face it, we couldn't beat Sunderland at home.

Yes. I agree Wembley.
The season has been a bit of a dream.
Or a nightmare.
My view on Basel based on the first game is that they are just a bang average team.
The fact that they beat us in the first game says more about us than them.
I don't mean any disrespect.
If we don't beat them then we don't deserve to go through.

If they're average them what does that make us?

Johnnybarnes89-90, since that BANG AVERAGE team beat us, have LFC improved one bit, you would have to say no and there in lies the problem, the performance's have been consistantly poor, JB I hope your not burying your head in the sand.

Basel ain`t that good which just shows how dire we are, atm.

08 Dec 2014 06:30:36
Hi Eds and Reds

With Rodgers job seemingly on the line and De Boer being touted as a possible replacement, I'd just like a few opinions on if he should be judged on his record domestically or in Europe.

While I appreciate he is dominating a relatively weaker league with less competition, he doesn't seem to get his team to "punch above their weight" in Europe.

The point I'm getting at is with Liverpool he would need to take on clubs with better squads, and after our spending spree over the past few years, probably with significantly less funds.

Is he capable of doing this? If yes why do you think so and if not who do you think could achieve this and why? Let's be realistic with our options here, no Guardiola or Shanks reincarnated.

Thanks guys and girls.

08 Dec 2014 07:07:30
I am more worried if a big name comes in ask for money?
He might not fancy some of our players, you can't blame him.

De-boer is the most realistic one for now.

De Boer is a very smart man as he was a great player. He knew he wasn`t ready for the job when we came calling 2yrs ago and honorably declined. Now he is ready and like some on here including Ed01, there is the concern that he has dominated a poor league. In the end, he seems to fit the bill based on the framework the owners want to put in place. Can he hack it? We will have to wait and find out if in fact he is hired. I do know this, he has a lot more experience and has won more in his short career than BR has.

07 Dec 2014 20:35:15
Hi eds, it's always nice to know when an ed agrees with ones post(s), so would an update be possible for an 'agree' button for eds only? Just so the poster knows if they are making worth while opinions.

{Ed001's Note - I will add it to Ed033's to do list, though it will probably not be until after the January window closes at least. Right now he is busy with our relaunch of the www.football-news-views.co.uk site, which we have just revamped.}

08 Dec 2014 13:37:56
It would be an interesting addition as the eds are knowledge and their input is fantastic. But some opinions are still worthwhile and well made points even if the eds do disagree!