Liverpool Banter Archive March 05 2014

05 Mar 2014 23:51:03
With the financial fair play, what way are Liverpool situated having lost 90million over 2 seasons. Does these figures include the warrior, garuda and dunkin donut deals

When was the last time the club posted a profit?

{Ed002's Note - We are not going to get in to this - sorry.}

Warrior and Standard Chartered have been in play for a bit now and I would imagine they are included in the 12/13 fiscal year release just posted. Garuda and Dunkin are both new, so won't have been although I don't think either is sizable enough to make much difference to be honest.

Not sure when the last time the club posted a profit was, actually an interesting question. I know it hasn't happened since NESV/FSG bought the club and I would doubt we had profits during the H&G days either although to be honest I didn't follow the finances very closely back then so could well be wrong on that.

06 Mar 2014 09:57:44
How difficult is to understand, we have been loosing 50 mill an year, (Eds have been crying out from a week).

Rdl
Liverpool posted a profit in the H&G years.Around £30 million if my memory serves me right.

CL will have an effect on sponsorship as well though in terms of commercial sponsorships we can attract - was the Standard Chartered kit deal not one of those that, if we got CL football, increased?

Thanks, Irish Rover. Makes some sense as I think the year we sold Alonso we didn't spend much (relatively speaking) so I could see that helping us to a positive that year.

Seano, I do believe Standard Chartered will owe us a bit more if we are in the CL, not sure how much that is though. That + CL + new TV money will certainly help with the FY 14/15 release, but first we have to make it past this current FY of 13/14 which I can't see being overwhelmingly positive. It will be very interesting to see what UEFA does to the likes of City and PSG, if anything, come next season.

{Ed002's Note - It is £5M from Standard Chartered.}

07 Mar 2014 05:57:07
Brilliant- thanks Ed02!

05 Mar 2014 22:15:36
Really great match by a weak danish team, that had 6 starters injured!
Gerrard was pure class, and got almost every long passing right!

05 Mar 2014 22:07:37
Evening eds and reds. Good for Sturridge to score tonight and Sterling m.o.m! Even better our 5 got through with no injuries! Non Liverpool for a tick. For a while now I've been trying to think of who lallana reminds me of, technique-wise. During tonight's match he did a lil inside turn exactly the way Yossi Benayoun used to! I used to really like Yossi and thought he was very underrated! Anyone else see the comparison or am I smokin sommet over here?

Don't think he's like yossi, but a very good player .think Liverpool should try to sign him in the summer, would fit in well with our style of play £10 million and Allen maybe

Yossi was awfull, my heart always used to sink when he came on.
Great to see 5 LFC players for England tonight. A week and a half rest and we'll have the mancs.
Have to say that I've seen a lot of Lallana from when Saints were in the Championship. Initially I did not think this guy would be good enough for the premiership, and then I didn't think he'd be good enough for a top club.
The guy just gets better and better and adapts whenever he plays at a higher level. Definitely think we should try and get him in the summer. He linked up really well with the LFC lads tonight

I really liked Benayoun - crafty little player. Allen is much more valuable to our squad than Lallana in my opinion. Allen very underrated, and I believe Lallana wouldn't get a starting place in our team as it stands.

Yossi was a top player. Technically superb. He wasn't a fashionable footballer, if he was south American you would of loved him

06 Mar 2014 09:59:23
ABO.

Yossi was a good player who had 2 brilliant seasons, I don't think it would add much difference to his game or stats, If you call him, Luis alberto yossi bennayoon.
He was poor at chelsea after the spell at Liverpool.

Benayoun was an excellent player and it shows ignores when you say he was awful GO.

I personally think he was underused during the 08-09 campaign and I would argue playing him more would have helped in winning the tittle.

05 Mar 2014 21:02:49
I see Medel playing centre back for Chile v Germany, do you think he would be good enough for it in the Prem ed001? Then he would be even more interesting for us should Cardiff get relegated.

Thanks

{Ed001's Note - no, I don't think he is a Prem centre back, not tall enough to deal with the Stokes etc.}

Same, but how good is Chile? Playing some fantastic football!

Is there any interest in Isla from the Prem? I know he doesn't get a lot of game time in Juve!

{Ed002's Note - Not right now.}

05 Mar 2014 20:11:54
Blimey, I really don't want to tempt fate here but my enjoyment of this England match is severely dampened by Hodgson playing Sturridge on the wing. All I keep thinking when I see him running back is don't pull a hamstring!

My enjoyment was severely dampened by the complete lack of any sort of energy in the game. That said, it was still better than the US display against Ukraine which was just a pinch above ridiculous.

05 Mar 2014 19:49:21
Chelsea fan coming in peace. First off I have to say I appreciate the way you guys put your team together. With that said I think it's clear there's going to need to be some adjustments made to the squad for next year since unless you guys really implode. Therefore I was wondering what alterations you guys think need to be made to your squad? Personally I think you need another solid left back, another guy to put on the wing, and another centre mid. You guys keep getting linked to ashley cole which would make sense because he's reliable and will be done around the time jack Robinson is ready to be fazed in like Flanagan was this year. On the wing I imagine you'll bring suso back for more depth but you could also use another one that's ready to play big minutes. In centre mid will Hughes makes a ton of sense as he can eventually replace Steven (please don't chastise me for saying that). It would also make sense to balance out your centre half situation. Daniel agger clearly isn't one of Rodgers favorites and you could bring somebody better suited in to replace him. If Cardiff go down I could see you guys going for caulker and then ilori replacing kolo after his contract expires next year. Just wanted to hear your thoughts.

Hello mate.

Not sure that Cole is the answer as he is getting on a bit and would want a kings ransom, so I hope we pass on that one, I like to think that there is done good scouting going on and a left field(excuse the pun) target is found like a Hyypia (live in hope!), as for CM I still think that we need someone like Reges, he would be immense.

I like will hughes and could see him in CM for us as he has a lot going for him.

Also would like us to sign Konoplyanka as he is a real talent.

Would say that I hope that we do keep Allen as he is showing what he can do and proving doubters like me wrong.

Ps thanks for sturridge, if you get sick of Matic & Hazard feel free to sell em on the cheap again lol!

05 Mar 2014 18:41:36
Nemanja Vidić confirmed as going to Milan at the end of the year. Will be a big loss, been a great player for Liverpool and a wonderful servant over the years.
Thank you Nemanja, and good luck. #ynwa

I remember him letting the ball bounce, not long after that the ref decided Vidic should bounce, at the end of the game Liverpool fans were shut in at Old Trafford and they decided to bounce. :)

I used to love watching Torres destroy Vidic - every single time. Vidic must have hated facing Torres back then.It was just beautiful to watch. Great memories!

05 Mar 2014 16:55:47
What about Carles Puyol?

{Ed002's Note - Zero chance.}

Since he has the physique of Jan Molby, I'd even say - fat chance.

He'll go and sign for Beckhams now team

Thanks for the answer ed.
Just since he has said he will leave Barca he has presence and the right mentality I think. Yes old and so on but so was toure when we got him. Puyol also has show. That he is comfortable in a system like rodgers.

But again, thanks.

{Ed002's Note - He is leaving to take a rest and Barcelona has agreed to cancel his contract - he is not leaving to move to another club.}

I'm not having a go at you ed but leaving for a rest try working 12-18 hrs a day 7 days a week I need a rest.

{Ed002's Note - Take tomorrow off - tell you boss I said it was OK.}

Reusch - the poor guy has to train against Messi every day mate. Can't be easy!

Cheers ed I'll ask the boss(SWMBO).

{Ed002's Note - Tell, don't ask.}

05 Mar 2014 14:35:46
Hi eds, any interest in Eric Dier, Miroslav Stoch or Raul Jimenez?

{Ed002's Note - Not from Liverpool. These are simply random names you are throwing up.}

05 Mar 2014 12:22:04
ed 01 u need to get over to blue rubbish banter page and defend yourself mate ed 07 has the children laughing at your expense, r mate davey boy is laughing at a post on this site which stated we could go for lakuku as a possible option in the summer now i'm sure it wouldn't be a big deal as they won't be able to afford the wages never mind the fee involved but imo we could get a bit better than him for 3rd choice forward position they r scaring the market for loan deals as we speak and they have the nerve to laugh at r transfer targets whoever they r.

{Ed001's Note - defend myself? Why would I do that, it is just a joke, I thought it was funny too. As for Daveyboy, there is no point worrying about him, his knowledge of footie could be written on the back of a postage stamp with a marker pen. Still, he does know more about footie than he does about witty banter, but I do have to agree with him, it is ludicrous that anyone would want that lump Lukaku at Liverpool!}

05 Mar 2014 12:59:10
I'm glad I'm not the only person who thinks he is over rated. I honestly don't see him ever getting to the level Sturridge is already at, and Danny is still improving himself!

I will put my neck on the line now and predict that Borini goes on to become a better player than Lukaku. Better attitude, better touch, works harder, is just as clinical in front of goal and is more versatile. If you put Fabio in the middle of our front 3 (hypothetically, he won't knock Sturridge out that easily!) and he'd score 20 next year if you ask me. Sturridge is very injury prone and won't play much more than 30 games a season. Borini would be a great back-up and has a proven history of being a great impact sub for Roma. He will also not sulk about having to fight for his position in the team. He reminds me so much of a technically gifted Kuyt, hopefully when he fills out he is as strong as the Dutchman was!

It's been really hard to judge Aspas due to his limited game time and non existant game time up front. For Celta Vigo he looked every bit as effective as Lukaku (although his style is obviously compeltely different) but I think he needs to go on loan to Stoke or Swansea or something just to learn the league and get some minutes under his belt.

Will Lukaku be a good player one day? Yes. He'd suit a Mourinho team and he obviously suits Martinez's style with one powerful poacher up top. Will Lukaku be a world class forward? Not for me, and certainly not for Liverpool. He is like a young Heskey (some of you may remember Heskey scoring 15-20 goals a season in his younger days) and one day the penny will drop that he is nothing more than a good player with a bad attitude. The biggest problem with him is he is prone to long goal droughts (10 goals in 22 games as the focal point of a team playing football as good as Everton are is very average) and when he's not scoring he is usually a passenger.

YNWAdam

{Ed002's Note - Would you like to share your experiences of Lukaku's "bad attitude"? Or is this simply more nonsensical bollocks?}

05 Mar 2014 13:12:30
Lukaku is a good player, and at his age he is way ahead of Aspas and Borini, But he isn't the type Liverpool needs untill BR is here, I just can't get why people want him at Liverpool.We don't play to his strength.
Everton don't have the money to buy from chelsea (atleast a min of 20 mill required), I am still not convinced he would be leaving Chelsea.

{Ed002's Note - As it stands right now he will be out of Chelsea in the summer. There is a very significant effort being made by the ex-player who acts as his liaison with Chelsea to persuade the club to keep him - it may or may not be successful.}

05 Mar 2014 13:26:39
I had no idea about his attitude issues until yesterday when they were brought to my attention by Ed001. So if you would like to know, ask him.

Quote: "Ed001's Note - Lukaku has attitude issues, as well as a lack of real quality. What is it with people wanting big lumps with no touch to play for us, when we are playing so well with quality?"

So do I get an apology? Because I've only stated my opinions on him as a player and have never once not had a reason to believe what Ed001 has said. It's not like I've made up a story or claimed to have inside knowledge. I don't mind if you want to tell me It's wrong but questioning my entire posts intergrity based on something I was informed of on this site is a bit harsh.

YNWAdam

{Ed002's Note - Practically everything I have read of yours has been subjective nonsense about Liverpool and other clubs. You are now spreading misinformation about players without checking the facts or understanding situations at all. It is naïve to say the least.}

Don't see the point of signing a player that wouldn't fit the system, plus look at the way that Borini has come on, he deserves a chance.

06 Mar 2014 11:47:56
To be fair to YNWA Adam Ed02, I'm pretty sure Ed001 has said on a few occasions recently he's supposed to have issues, I think that's what he's referring too.

{Ed001's Note - I think I said he had off field issues once, but I wasn't meaning it the way Adam has taken it to mean. I am not talking about Ravel Morrison type of issues or anything. Not that kind of thing at all. Let's just say he is not going to go anywhere to sit on the bench.}

06 Mar 2014 11:50:52
Quote: "Ed001's Note - but, if we want to go long, we can hit balls over the top to Sturridge, who has the pace to get onto them. So why do we need some lump up front to have that option? I just don't understand the need for a plan B, Liverpool never needed a plan B under Paisley as such. All he did was reorganise his existing players to suit the situation at hand. Rodgers is currently doing the same thing, with his switches in formation to suit different opponents. So we clearly have plenty of flexibility without some full-of-attitude, over rated lump who is flavour of the month. Especially as it seems all people want is him to sit on the bench, when he is not going to do that, as he seems to think he is some kind of superstar. How do you know that Borini and Aspas couldn't have scored goals, if they had been given a run anyway? Pure guesswork that, Borini never played up front for us enough to show whether or not he could make it and Aspas has not had enough games to make that kind of judgement on. We have a very flexible team already, what we don't need is a Lukaku causing issues because he is not first choice."

I don't just make things up Ed02. I was just taking Ed001's word.

YNWAdam

{Ed001's Note - you are taking my talk about his attitude over the top. I was meaning that he expects to be first choice type of attitude, thinks he knows it all. I obviously didn't word it that well, as I wasn't meaning he gets into trouble etc. I just mean he thinks he is better than he is, more of a Zaha type attitude issue, not a Ravel Morrison type. He is not going to sit on the bench watching a match, and he isn't going to be first choice for us, so it would be an issue for us.}

06 Mar 2014 11:49:07
Ed02, If you could, Who are the clubs interested in him?. He would surerly cost some money 20-25 mill, since chelsea bought him at 17 mill.

{Ed002's Note - Right now I am not aware of any specific interest. Dortmund enquired before and a couple of clubs have enquired after loans - but I don't see that as an option. There is a chance he could be offered as part of a deal for another player.}

06 Mar 2014 11:51:31
I think you are being incredibly harsh Ed02. As far as I can see I have an opinion, one that is shared by many others including Ed001. I haven't been overly critical or said Lukaku is useless etc. I've simply expressed my opinion that he suits a certain style of football and is over hyped. Isn't that what sites like this are for? To talk about football? Now I'm sorry if Lukaku is actually a golden boy, but I still do not deserve to be on the receiving end of such sweeping statments.

YNWAdam

{Ed002's Note - I do appreciate that you make a lot of efforts with your posts but I will stand by the statement Adam. You are just digging a hole for yourself with this anti-Lukaku campaign - a player Liverpool has shown zero interest in. This speculation about the player has all come about because there is a situation right now that will see Lukaku leave Chelsea this summer for reasons that are of no importance to the Liverpool supporters. An enormous amount of effort is being made by the ex-player who acts as his liaison with his parent club to make sure everything is smoothed out. And Lukaku wants to return to Chelsea. Whether that happens or not we can only wait to see, but right now the view of the club is that they will let him move on.}

06 Mar 2014 11:52:41
Ed02 I respect you and the work you do greatly but surely that's a little harsh. I always look out for Adams posts as I enjoy reading posts from fans that give their opinions. Pretty much everything he said above was opinionated apart from the attitude part which was backed up by what another Ed had said yesterday. As Adam said, we have never had a reason to disbelieve an Ed before, and if you were to say that Lukaku doesn't have an attitude problem, I'm sure Adam would have taken that on board. Like I said at the beginning, I have a lot of respect for you and this is not in any way meant to come across as abuse, just me voicing my opinion and support for another fan.

{Ed002's Note - Thanks for leaping in to the hole with another shovel.}

06 Mar 2014 11:53:23
I maybe veering of topic, but why has the relationship between Lukaku and Chelsea broken down Ed02?

A bit harsh on Adam that Ed02. As you say, what he says is "subjective". I have enjoyed Adam's posts but he does quote Ed001 on the attitude issues of Lukaku.

Personally, I think Lukaku is a very good player but can't see him swapping regular footie (reason why he left on loan from Chelsea) to sit on our bench.

I think Borini should be bought back.

{Ed002's Note - The reason is of no relevance but critically Liverpool has shown no interest in the player.}

05 Mar 2014 11:14:43
hey eds, do you see Suso staying with us (and signing a contract) and going on a loan for a season? or do you see him leaving Liverpool in the coming transfer window?
Personally, I'd be very disappointed to see him leave but I can understand his stance should he choose to leave.

{Ed001's Note - I honestly don't know what the lad is thinking. I know he can get first team football elsewhere, that has to be a worry and the club is going to need to persuade him to stay. The only question is if he can see a future for himself with us, or if he feels that he will not get the chance to play enough with us. I think getting into Champions League qualifiers might not be such a bad thing in his case, as it will give him a chance to make a case to play. We really do need to hold on to him though, in my opinion, I absolutely love him as a player.}

Second that ed.

Completely agree ed.
bring him home, give him a game, let him hear the crowd sing his name and then if he still wants to go back to spain at the end of his contract in 2015 then so be it. ok we'll lose a transfer fee but I think this kid is the real deal and worth taking the gamble on asap

05 Mar 2014 10:08:10
Hi Ed's & Reds,

If we do finish in the top 3 this season and guarantee champions league football for next season. Do you think we will be able to get top players in earlier like Kroos, gaitan, konoplyanka etc etc.
because if we finish 4th then players won't want to sign until we have been through pre-qualifying.

Thanks in advance


Ynwa

05 Mar 2014 09:34:50
So were guaranteed European football next season should we qualify, regardless of whether we have fallen foul of the FFP rules or not.
According to reports, a loophole has been found that regardless of the amount of debt a club has posted for the previous two seasons, which should aggregate £37.2 mill per season, this will not apply to Liverpool because UEFA are only investigating teams "who have been involved in European competition this season".
As this does not include us, if we do fall foul of the FFP rules, which I have read we won't because we can negate certain losses which would reduce our level to below £37.2 mill, but even if we cannot get below this figure, our finances won't be investigated because we have not been involved in European competitions this season.
Clear as mud in my eyes. LOL!
vrcomp
Y.N.W.A.

05 Mar 2014 10:07:04
But a Loss is still a Loss.!!!

Don't compare Chelsea buying to Liverpool, mate. Chelsea bought the league when Mouinho first arrived; they bought anything that moved or were you sleep then? Now City are doing the same with Chelsea still a close 2nd. Our success is due to the way we play, not who we buy. Chelsea bought Salah not to play him but keep him out of Liverpool. Just look at the money you've spent over the years. FFS! But still, we will beat Chelsea to the title and Mourinho will moan his butt off and secretly swear at Ferguson not recommending him for the ManU job! Watch this space.

{Ed002's Note - Vrcomp has completely misunderstood the FFP rules and the financial aspects - and this is why we don't discuss it. Chelsea did not buy Salah to keep him from Liverpool - if Liverpool wanted the player all they needed to do was offer a decent amount and (a) not suggest an entirely unacceptable amount of money so there could not even be negotiation, (b) get the manager to shut the hell up and not offend the player as he did. A really embarrassing post.}

05 Mar 2014 12:27:35
Ed02, thers no point in discussing this salah over and over again. you have mentioned this more than 1 occassions here.
salah wanted to move to chelsea, and he got the move, its nothing as chelsea pipped Liverpool for world beater salah

Did my reply not get through the editing stage?
vrcomp
Y.N.W.A.

{Ed002's Note - I have not seen a reply.}

06 Mar 2014 11:52:10
Firstly. IranRed in London. Where did I mention Chelsea in my post above? I am at a complete loss.
Second. Ed02. What I have posted is from a report from a footballing financial expert that was asked to do some investigating by The Independent.
I wasn't trying to make any sense out of the FFP rules. As my last comment said. It is as clear as mud.
The understanding from his reporting is that we would not qualify under the FFP rules because we have posted a loss over and above the £37.2 mill aggregate.
But certain losses can be deducted because of other rules that could in theory take us below that figure.
However none of this matters because UEFA are only looking at teams finances that are in this seasons European competitions. Therefor our finances will not be looked into and therefor we will not be looking at any sanctions this year.
Its all a load of b*lls**t anyways as there are IMO teams that are in a worse position than us and get away with it.
My simple point was that it looks like we will be in Europe even though we are outside the accepted norms and parameters set for the FFP rules.
You would need to be a mathematical genius to work out the rules (and exceptions) that are involved and I was not trying to be clever. Just pointing out its a minefield and needs looking at and in some way simplifying.
vrcomp
Y.N.W.A.

{Ed002's Note - So this expert says there is a loophole that excludes Liverpool from being considered in respect of the FFPR then? Interesting? Either you have misunderstood this "expert" or what he has said is nonsense. I have explained the rules and what all of the possible exceptions are repeatedly in the past. I really don't wish to try and explain it all again. Liverpool are one of two English sides that have failed on all three seasons the FFPR tests. The other is Manchester City. PSG are also in a very poor position. One club has opted out altogether. One club has said they will go to court if sanctions are imposed against it. It really is not worthy of further discussion.}

05 Mar 2014 06:37:24
Ed02 AND Ed001,

What are your takes on the financial figures that the club has released? Is the club moving in the right direction?

Cheers

{Ed002's Note - Very slowly.}

Surely things will speed up if we qualify for CL? And with new TV money so long as salaries are kept under control that will help even more. Sponsor deals are more valuable with CL. It's the lack of European football coupled with disastrous transfer dealings that he's stalled our financial progress.

{Ed002's Note - It will "speed up" as you say if Liverpool stop buying players or perhaps "cash in" where they can.}

I agree that Liverpool need to move on players if they are not having an impact on the first 11 team or as rated possibly not good enough to make the breakthru to the first 11. We need to try and generate cash in other ways to try and become a bit more self sufficient. Off course Champions League football, the extra tv revenue and the extra £5 million from Standard Charter for being in the CL will help greatly.

As someone who probably spends far more time looking at financial statements then is healthy for a sane person, my take is pretty simple.

If I had to pick one single item where LFC are absolutely getting killed (at least for the last two released financial statements of 11/12 and now 12/13) it is on player sales. We're losing an awful lot of money on these and it has a massive impact on the club.

Unfortunately, this fiscal year of 13/4 is shaping up no better with us having somewhere around a £4M loss on the sale of Carroll and another £2M loss on the sale of Downing. Moving forward it is imperative for the financial health of the club that when we sell a player that sale adds to the finances, not takes away from it as it what has been happening the last 2 fiscal years as well as this one.

In addition to this, we need to quit adding players to the wage bill and the player amortization amount who aren't playing. We've added > £10M annually to our player amortization and another > £5M annually (being very generous to both, it's likely a fair amount more than both of those) to the wage bill for 5 players and only one of them is playing regularly (Mignolet).

05 Mar 2014 08:02:09
Just Read Johnsosn's remarks about BR and Jose, Is he crying loud for a new contract?

05 Mar 2014 06:12:36
Banter please gents
We all know three main positions are going to be addressed in the summer LB, CM, LW
now if you could take any three players from any team in the EPL then who would u pick
My choices would be Shaw, Ramsey, Hazard
Would also love the eds opinion

{Ed023's Note - Shaw, Yaya Toure, Hazard}

Good one. I will go for Shaw, schneiderlin and hazard (or lallana)

04 Mar 2014 22:48:17
Quick question Eds. I understand what I've seen you explain about Suarez's previous release clause (not legally binding and all). Just wondered, if it doesn't force us to sell, what's the point in having it in there? Was it literally just so he could talk to the club at that price? (which we still seemed to refuse). Just slightly confused as to why we would bother putting it in the contract if it has no actual value.

Thanks as always

{Ed002's Note - I have explained over and over there is no point going down this road.}