Liverpool Banter Archive September 29 2017

29 Sep 2017 18:47:43
For those who do not understand Klopp's tactics, I do not claim to be a genius but our defending starts from the front.

It is called "the press".

We have time and time again forced the opposition to make mistakes in their own half. Hence the amount of chances we create.

Our defensive issues are down to individual errors.

Get two CB's which are on the same planet and we will be much better, along with dropping Mignolet from the first team squad for once and for all.

Many go on about our midfield, that is not where we are dominated by opposition teams. It is the brain farts at the back when it comes to in swinging corners and free kicks where we go absolutely balls up. If we can eliminate 50% of those problems then we will be taking a step into the right direction.

Matip is an absolute tower yet he does not seem to know how to use his height?

29 Sep 2017 19:09:25
Disagree about midfield, that's where the main problem is.
The defence gets no protection.

29 Sep 2017 19:18:08
Ron, are we actually dominated by the opposition?

The only match I can think of was when mane was sent off vs City.

None CB's simply have any understanding between each other, no communication either.

If we had to swop Matip and Lovren for Vertonghen and Alderweireld then I can promise you we will be mountains ahead of where we are at the moment. Only thorn would be Mignolet.

29 Sep 2017 19:46:26
It's no secret that I'd love us to sign VVD but I agree with Max, I think we need a new partnership with Matip as a back up.

I'm not saying we should sign this player right now but he's certainly catching peoples attention early in the season and I'm looking forward to see how he copes with our attack this weekend.

Jamaal Lascelles! I'm not basing this on how comfortable on the ball he is but his leadership skills. At 23 he is very vocal for Newcastle and so far I've been very impressed with him.

That said, I hope he doesn't have a MOTM performance against us contributing to keeping a clean sheet for the magpies!

Vvd, Lascelles, Gomez and Matip as our CB options for next season sound good though.

{Ed025's Note - i like the look of him as well mate..

29 Sep 2017 20:12:24
Max, as a defender, if you have 3 midfielders running st you unchallenged with the ball, wingers running unmarked in the channels and strikers running in behind you, even Franco Baresi would look clueless.

I'm not saying our defenders are fine, I'm saying they've got no chance without any protection from midfield.
A team doesn't have to dominate you to score past you. Watford didn't dominate us, Burnley didn't dominate us.

Man Utd bought Matic from the champions. He plays in front of the defence. This allows Pogba, Mata, Mikhytarian to bomb forward. We bomb forward without a Matic, that's why we're so vulnerable at the back.

{Ed025's Note - fair point ron..

29 Sep 2017 20:33:28
Ron, it is a game of numbers in our team.

We have not been dominated by any team except for City. The Watford game was a calamity of individual defensive errors. We drew the game by the way and could have easily won it.

Our CB's, none of them, would make it into any top team. That is a fact unless you can suggest otherwise.

Look at the first half vs Leicester in the League Cup. We were totally dominant without our strongest starting eleven.

Our midfield might be haphazard at times but does not help when you have a CB pair having absolutely no understanding or communication and Mignolet adding to the pain.

Sort out our defence and we will be a force to be reckoned with.

29 Sep 2017 20:52:48
Neither does the chopping and changing of GK's help the situation any further, Max.

29 Sep 2017 21:20:48
Well max, I've been watching this game long enough and I've never seen our defenders so exposed on a regular basis.
You seem to be focused on the team being dominated. That's not the issue mate, the issue is we need 30 chances to score 2 goals and opponents only need 3. That's because their chances are much better because they overwhelm our 2 man defence whereas we're creating chances against a back 9. So our "chances" are 20 yard shots through a crowd whilst being closed down.

29 Sep 2017 22:56:35
Spot on Ron. I'd like to see just how the backline would perform in open play with any sort of protection. Still think our set pieces are a separate worry but everyone seems to put everything down to the players. Don't get me wrong, I don't have any great faith in matip or lovren but I wonder with a different set up would we be looking a little better looking to January.

30 Sep 2017 09:10:25
Ron and Max are both correct as the issues are separate, IMO. The opposition does not dominate us as we concede the 2nd fewest shots in the PL currently. The issue is that our midfield roles need to be defined more clearly as it seems that right now, the 3 in midfield do not seem to be working well in unison. This is where Ron is correct. I watched the LC game a few times over and at no point were we ever dominated in midfield and defensively, I think we handled them very well. The chances we conceded and the goals are due to Migs' brain farts and nothing more. This is where Max is correct.

The solutions are there as both Max and Ron have alluded to as in using a DM to protect the CB's (Ed has said it is being looked at by Klopp as he played with DM's before at BVB) as well as taking our chances while Max proposed personnel changes at CB. The question now is which one do we employ. For me, both your solutions can be implemented at the same time.

{Ed001's Note - it is not as simple as that though, we do not have the money to fling at it to buy all the things we need, so we have to pick and choose.}

30 Sep 2017 15:03:33
A proper good old fashioned CDM will change a lot for our midfield. It allows players like Coutinho, Gini, Can and Henderson to move forwards for attacks without having to look over their shoulders for a team mate to cover the defense. You will be surprised by how better our midfielders will perform if they had a CDM protecting the defense and a solid platform for the midfield to do its job.

Klopp seems obsessed with every player knowing how to do everything.
The likes of Jose and Pep are not stupid when they try to sign specialists for important positions on the pitch.

Klopp seems to be in love with the "jack of all trades but a master of none" kind of players. Its going to be his downfall if he persists with this nonsense.

30 Sep 2017 22:37:58
A quality DM would make a difference Cahill and Luiz at Chelsea are not the best individually and Utd are currently playing with Valencia Jones and Young in their back four but they all get help from in front of them.

30 Sep 2017 21:25:53
IB, you are correct and Klopp per Ed01, is looking into it as he used DM's in the past at BVB. Now your projection that Klopp likes a "jack of all trades" type player and what will be his downfall or not, is just projection and nothing more as we don't know what the future holds.

Ed, I agree with you there and yes, we cannot just be switching CB personnel at will as we don't have 300m to splurge every summer and I commend what Klopp is doing by picking and choosing our spots.

29 Sep 2017 11:03:49
10 pages and posters say, attacking wise we are the best team to watch?
I beg your pardon people, but i think attacking wise we are the most frustrating team to watch atm.

29 Sep 2017 18:41:38
We can be attractive and at the same time, frustrating to watch, Akshit. That much I can say.

29 Sep 2017 02:46:40
Hi eds, when Pep and Jose come intontheit respective teams, it appears they have much more problems than Liverpool to fix. How did they fix their problems in such a short time while we are still grappling with ours?

{Ed001's Note - not sure how you figure that out, they stepped into two of the most expensively assembled teams in the world and then proceeded to spend ever larger sums, but neither had more problems than the Liverpool Klopp inherited.}

29 Sep 2017 06:18:36
Klopp has spent big and not solved the derisive issues. Brought in his own players but just can't set the team up defensively.

Personally think that is difference.

We should set up to counter attack. Invite the opposition on to us and hit on the break.

{Ed001's Note - why would you want to do that when your team has defensive issues? That would just be asking for trouble!}

29 Sep 2017 07:36:50
Maybe bcos defending with 8 behind the ball is easier than defending with just 2 or 3 when other team counter.

29 Sep 2017 10:04:09
We are not conceding on the counter so you have no point here, we concede due to individual errors. Blind passes, missed tackles, not clear the ball far enough away, goalkeeper missing the ball from crosses, saves that should have been made. Take a look at all the goals we have conceded this season and then tell me it anything to with counterattacking against us.

29 Sep 2017 10:58:28
Juts coz we haven’t conceded so far doesn’t make us fool proof! We will always face danger on counter due the way we are set up! But there are far easier way for the opposition to score against us! Get a corner! Lol
We play very high and send the entire army high up! So counter is always on the verge!

29 Sep 2017 11:17:55
Lets put 11 men behind the ball and try to win 1-0 every game, we will still make the same mistakes as before and concede but won't score either. Brilliant.

29 Sep 2017 11:21:53
We have only conceded 1 league goal at Anfield. I'm quietly confident about this Sunday.

29 Sep 2017 11:41:40
We put 11 men in our own box during set pieces so when the ball is cleared there is no one to clear to and it keeps coming back untill its out of play again.
should put mane and salah on half way line that way at least they will have to mark them with at least two players and if we just hoof it into their half wouldn't fancy many players matching mane's pace to get to the ball.

29 Sep 2017 11:41:57
Agreed MK Scouser.

29 Sep 2017 13:48:27
Although I'm confident to MK, you have to take that stat with a pinch of salt.

We've faced a palace side who hasn't scored, possibly the worst Arsenal line up I've seen in years and Burnley.

29 Sep 2017 18:21:11
@ Beddoerocks

"We should set up to counter attack. Invite the opposition on to us and hit on the break"

Have you actually watched our defence? Ha ha. So you want to take the pressing and movement from the front away and shift it to or defence?

We will leak even more goals. Get a grip.

29 Sep 2017 18:46:35
Bedd, you can only do that if your defense is very good. Ours is clearly not at least not yet so that plan won't work, mate. Spot on, Piffmunda. Almost every goal we concede can be traced back to one or a collection of individual errors. That is the frustrating thing defensively for me. Teams don't cut us open in fact, we have conceded the 2nd or 3rd least amount of shots in the PL this season (41, I think) YET we have the 4th worst defence. There you go.

29 Sep 2017 19:13:36
I thought the game was at Newcastle mk.

29 Sep 2017 19:29:27
Game's at St. James' Park and Rafa Benitez, who's made his name by meticulously analysing his opponents and setting up to exploit their weaknesses, is in the opposition dugout. And our weaknesses don't exactly require meticulous analysis to identify. I'm not ultra-confident.

He'll sit his defenders on Elliot's toes to deny space to Mane and Salah and have Joselu or Gayle constantly try and run our left hand channel to exploit the space left by whichever combination of attacking left back and slow center back we pick there. And it could cause us problems.

The gulf in quality between our squad and Newcastle's might be enough for us to win, but it won't be comfortable.

{Ed025's Note - liverpool will win 4-0..the barcodes are awful mate..

29 Sep 2017 19:37:02
Newcastle do not have the attack to beat any team unfortunately.

Rafa is Rafa. He will set his team up to not concede a goal or keep it at a draw.

Mane and Salah might just be his undoing.

29 Sep 2017 19:43:10
Bingored. We rarely concede from quality play by the opponents, frustrating. But then I suppose, all teams will target our weaknesses.

29 Sep 2017 19:38:02
On paper I'd agree 100% Ed, Newcastle have about 4 Premier League players in their squad and we should ruin them. But Benitez is all about tailoring his teams to the opposition, and we've not exactly been difficult to set up against. Just drop deep and wait for us to hand you a goal on the break.

I think we will win it, but it'll probably be something more like 4-2 with lots of uneasy periods for us.

{Ed025's Note - i rate rafa but his hands are tied at newcastle SR, all their players are championship quality and wont live with the speed of the reds attack, there are not many certs in football mate....but this is one of them..

29 Sep 2017 20:13:27
Look, I am not here to bash Rafa as he is a humble and good man.

The EPL is too much for him. It was proven in his time at LFC. His dictatorship has not worked at any club he has managed. Yes he won the La liga but it is not like he took over the worst team at Valencia.

He has been like a jack in the box since leaving LFC. FSG and Rafa would be like pouring ice cold water into a pot of boiling hot oil.

Rafa will probably keep Newcastle up but that is as good as it is going to get for him.

At least Klopp is not revolting or turning fans and supporters against the club. Rafa is known to cause trouble wherever he manages. Lost his job at clubs on many occasions because of that.

We will beat Newcastle :-) and I will be the first one to eat my words on here should it be any different.

29 Sep 2017 22:09:29
Tactically Rafa is 1000 times better than Klopp’s klopp has charisma which connects him with fans something Rafa doesn’t have. But Rafa has footballing brains!