Liverpool Banter Archive April 27 2016

27 Apr 2016 21:49:34
I have to say that i am disappointed that sakho actually took the drugs knowingly, sad to say it but he knew the consequences if he got caught and he will get a hefty ban and deservedly so just for being stupid.

I do however forgive him for erring, i am no saint and i have made plenty of mistakes in my life. So i wish him all the best in his future career as i fear lfc will cut their losses.

JF96.

28 Apr 2016 04:33:47
Very disappointing and a poor example to young players out there who look up to him - my sons being two of them.

28 Apr 2016 08:12:05
He hasn't admitted he took the drugs knowingly (not that I think he didnt) - he is still apparently submitting mitigating evidence. He just accepts that it was not an error they were in his blood sample.

28 Apr 2016 09:32:05
Whilst this is a big deal. Ya have to think that football's time will come.

28 Apr 2016 09:42:40
You are contradicting yourself, if he knew they were in his system then he knew he took them, hence he knowingly too the drugs mate. Extenuating circumstances or not he refused the b sample test knowing that too would fail. It don't take much deduction to come to that conclusion. But again i am not condemning him like some because i have done worse in my life than take some diet pills but he will have to live with the consequences because dems the rules.

28 Apr 2016 12:16:49
No it's not a contradiction John.

Consider - he takes a pill that he doesn't know contains a banned substance (or doesn't know the substance is banned) . Tests then come back as positive for a banned substance. He shows doctor/ lawyer everything that he has taken in the time period, and doctor sees where the offending substance is. So now he knows that he has it in him correctly and therefore there is no point in retesting with the B sample, but he also considers himself as having mitigating evidence by virtue of having no idea he was taking it.

Just one of many circumstance where you can realise you're only guilty once you've been proven guilty, and therefore wish to explain yourself with the circumstances around being guilty rather than trying in futility to prove you never did it in the first place. Not saying any will apply for Sakho, but knowingly cheated does not immediately follow from not testing b sample.

28 Apr 2016 16:31:13
And where did you read or hear him admit to taking the drugs knowingly, John? If you have links, please share. If you don't have proof then stop projecting as he has never said that. All he has implied in his not requesting a B teat is that he admits that the dope was in his system BUT a hearing will still be arranged where he will prove his case and the tribunal will decide after all the facts and evidence is presented and considered. Till then, stop with the slating and projecting without proff or via inuaendo because it`s getting old.

27 Apr 2016 20:32:26
Did everyone forget that caulker was about and he can play in europa? Anyone think he could fit in?

27 Apr 2016 20:36:14
He hasn't been in the squad since January finished.

27 Apr 2016 20:36:53
I don't think he would mate considering his very little exposure to the first team football during his time here. Toure, Lucas and Skrtel would provide cover while Sakho is out, so I would be suprised if Caulker made the bench.

27 Apr 2016 20:39:49
I think everyone was trying to forget we signed him.

28 Apr 2016 04:40:52
Here's to hoping all that speed we have in spades at center back and the positional sense of our fullbacks can halt that incisive offense. Wait. On a positive we cannoned down the yellow wall now let's drop a couple depth charges on the yellow submarine.

27 Apr 2016 19:52:56
Hi eds

So what do u see is the likely outcome with sakho and his lfc career now he's plead guilty? Is it a case of seeing what the ban lenght is first and the substance used? Or do u think his lfc career is over?

{Ed002's Note - I don't know but it will certainly be curtailed. Other clubs have taken different approaches. Chelsea sacked both players they had that failed drug tests, Manchester City put theirs on the bench and then released him etc.. We'll see but there is no point speculating.}

27 Apr 2016 20:47:41
Thanks ed2 yeah seems like a waste of a career and rspecially if its fat burning drugs. I guess time will tell! Thanks again ed2.

28 Apr 2016 00:22:17
He will be back. No way the club will sack him. You don't throw 18 mil down the toilet

We stood by that biting manias right until the very edge.

So he gets 6/ 12/ 18 months. We release him. He signs for arsenal and plays on there for the next 10 years. Nope. We will wait for him, check he still has ut and then lock him unto a big. contract!

28 Apr 2016 04:40:23
Offer him a new contract worth 25% of his current one and lengthen it by the term of his suspension - take it or leave it.

28 Apr 2016 09:45:04
Or sack him and sue him for the value of his transfer fee.

27 Apr 2016 19:30:38
Judge a players ability but never the player. They are human and will make mistakes and if they acknowledge their wrong we should never condemn them. We can't understand why sakho would do a stupid thing like this but if he accepts his punishment and doesn't try to hide his error then we should refrain from condemning him.

Labelling him a cheat. well aren't we all? Have you never run a red light? Have you never went over the speed limit?

I am not saying it's OK to cheat, just that we shouldn't get carried away and throw stones out of our own glass houses.

27 Apr 2016 20:52:30
Are you actually trying to compare a professional sportsman, on a hideous amount of money and extremely fortunate to be able to play football at the highest level and represent a club of Liverpools stature, with going 35mph in a 30 zone?

Professional footballers have every reasource they possibly need at their beck and call. They have nutritionists, dietitians, doctors, fitness gurus etc etc etc, they know the score on illegal substances of any kind. It doesn't matter if it's cocaine to lemsip, they know what the score is when it comes to taking drugs of any kind. They can find out in an instant off an expert if they can or cannot use a substance. It's blind ignorance that they believe they can use such substances and won't be caught. He won't be the only one using such drugs, granted, but that takes nothing away from it.

He is in a position of responsibility to the young supporters of your club, the young aspiring players in the academy and grass root level, he should be leading by example. Don't try palming this off as a mistake such as speeding, it isn't. I hope the books thrown at him. His actions have bought unnecessary publicity to your club when the whole focus should be on the semi final coming up.

27 Apr 2016 21:42:32
Stand I actually think Klopptomatic was having a joke. There's no way he's being serious in the above post. You took the bait well and truly.

27 Apr 2016 22:08:47
Spot on StandUnited. Some sense from the dark side.

27 Apr 2016 22:24:09
more than anything its the timing of the charge.

28 Apr 2016 04:45:12
Have to side with Stand on this one - he has not only let himself down, he has let the club, team mates, sponsors and fans down immensely - just not good enough in my opinion.

28 Apr 2016 08:21:02
And when I get caught going 35 in a 30 zone, I don't remember professional footballers appealing to the government to give me another chance.

28 Apr 2016 09:41:39
Hmmmmm I think if you're on that amount of money them you have the weight of the world on your shoulders. We all think it's a fantastic life being a professional athlete but we haven't committed the time, made the sacrifices and / or had the luck. So why wouldn't ya try 8t on if the chances of being caught are minimal. Do ya really think those being caught are the only ones using!?
And anyways it's not like he's blood doping, or taking steroids, (although that could be revealed if in fact this is a masking agent) or hgh. Its a bloody fat man pill. he will get punished rightly, but in the big scheme of things this is small fry to the other forms of doping going on out there.

{Ed002's Note - This is an extremely embarrassing post - yet again. There is no excuse if it is proven. You try and bring others in to it and belittle the offence.}

28 Apr 2016 10:25:56
Of course there is no excuse if proven guilty and I am not belittling the offence. sakho will certainly get what's coming to him. If it is found that there is more serious doping goung on then for sure throw the book at him! What I am saying is, let's not pretend as tho the factors that lead to pro athletes using in other sports completely disappear in football. If Sakho is that way inclined, and not averse to crossing the line to curtail a problem he can't get under control. then is it that surprising he's used? I don't think so at all.

28 Apr 2016 17:25:19
Faithinworks - a really shameful view but consider all the other players out there like Rooney and Hulk who have struggled with weight problems and needed to devote most of their training towards weight management just to stay fit (whether they did it is enough story) . If they had been cheating in the same way that Sakho has, how different might their careers and their team fortunes have been? It makes no difference whether you're upping strength or lightening the load when it comes to performance enhancing drugs - it's not small fry, it's cheating in the exact same way and no points that you raise makes it any more disgusting.

27 Apr 2016 18:56:52
on the Sakho situation i don't think he done it on purpose, he has held his hand up to taking it and is hoping he does not get a big ban, it seems like we always shoot ourselves in the foot, just when sakho and lovren were becoming a great partnership this happens, BOOOM has klopp would say, i don't think skertal will be any good with lovren, its lucky we are close to the end of the season, at least we can get a very good CB in the summer to partner lovren who has shown us how good he is with some one he can trust next to him, next season we will have Matip and Gomez but i think an older CB will be needed bevcause of their experience maybe that's why we have been linked with Vermalen, which i think would be a wrong buy because of his injury record, when he was at Arsenal i think he had 1 or an half of a good season, if we get the right CB and a GK our team would have a great chance of winning the prem next season, i have said before that JK will bring us the prem title within 3 seasons, and i still stand by that, he has given the players a great bit of time to show what they can do and all of them have got better, even lovren and joe allen have improved so much so that they have won man of the matches, where as under BR they were nervous wrecks who were going backwards, JK knows what he is doing and i am so happy our owners got him as i'm sure a lot of clubs were after him, so roll on these next few seasons of winning things.

28 Apr 2016 06:29:03
"on the Sakho situation i don't think he done it on purpose, he has held his hand up to taking it"

I don't understand the above quote. So he's admitted it but you still don't think he did it on purpose🤔. So you think he's covering for someone who spiked him?

27 Apr 2016 17:30:33
I wonder what JK approach to Sakho was when he found out he failed? Would you reckon Jurgan tore him a new one?

27 Apr 2016 17:46:35
Disappointed Dad I bet, resigned sadness letting Sakho know he'd let himself and his team mates down.

27 Apr 2016 17:52:28
Sakho was becoming the main main he really was. Got a feeling we will stick by him but I'm not an expert just got a feeling.

27 Apr 2016 15:27:17
Eds are these weight loss pills a veiled way of taking performance enhancing drugs?

{Ed002's Note - They are stimulants that are potentially quite dangerous, and they have one particular side effect (dehydration) that obviously people running around kicking a ball about don't want.}

27 Apr 2016 16:28:23
The other reason they are banned is that they can potentially also be used as masking agents to make it harder to detect other abuses. If your pee is more dilute then the concentrations of banned substances would appear lower. Water loss is a crazy and dangerous way to lose "weight" as Ed002 says.
Not that I suggest that is the case here.

{Ed002's Note - I suspect that if he had been juicing then the tests would be good enough to unmask it - certainly that is the claim from the folks who do the testing of the ball players in the US now.}

27 Apr 2016 19:58:45
Juicing? Like one of those Nutribullet things?

{Ed002's Note - Not really Ron.}

27 Apr 2016 13:23:13
Regarding Hillsborough - it's important that we don't just feel now that it's job done and change will now come and the bad people will be punished. That's not how it works.

The Hillsborough Families and the Trust have done a great job - no doubt them and many more will be giving further evidence in criminal proceedings as they move forward. But it's up to us, the 1mil + individual fans plus our friends in Celtic, Dortmund etc to keep the fight going for the public so kids don't grow up actually believing the lies already established in much of society. A legal ruling isn't going to change the opinion of a regular 'always the victim' chant, and they are a lost generation - prepare yourselves for more of the same and many years of struggling, boycotting and education until public memory remembers only the incompetence, the cover ups and the truth

There isn't justice yet, we just have our first ever upper hand.

27 Apr 2016 12:12:05
In other news Benteke back that's good news.

27 Apr 2016 13:23:08
I'm glad he's going to get another chance. He's got undoubted ability and if Klopp could get him playing the way we want him to I still think he could be an asset to the club.

27 Apr 2016 13:23:34
For who? Villarreal?

27 Apr 2016 14:22:34
he's in the squad for tomorrow night, admittedly that doesn't mean he'll play but with the way Klopp's been rotating mid-week and weekend teams I imagine he'll get some game time somewhere.

27 Apr 2016 14:33:16
I for one was never particularly happy about Benteke joining because he didn't fit our system, but there's no question I'm glad we have the option to play him upfront with Ings and Origi injured.

In the first leg I think having an option of someone who can hold it up effectively if we're under intense pressure for the last 30mins will be useful. Sometimes you just need to clear to a big CF that won't just let the ball come back at you. and bentekes that man regardless of what we feel about his pressing abilities.

I hope we go one up with Sturridge, then play Benteke last 30mins and hit them with a sucker punch on the break, with Benteke knocking on in from a James Milner cross!

In the second leg I also still feel if we're pushing for a goal, a twin striker setup of Benteke and Sturridge would be a highly effective one.

27 Apr 2016 13:55:26
Muscat, his ability has never been in doubt. It`s his attitude and work ethic that stinks which is the main reason he's not playing and could well be the reason he's sold come this summer.

27 Apr 2016 12:01:45
Sakho not getting his B sample tested.

27 Apr 2016 12:08:17
At least he has the balls to own up quickly and not contest the result I suppose.

27 Apr 2016 12:14:27
Confirmed?

Shame if that's true. He was doing well for us. We're going to need another centre back, over to you Jurgen.

27 Apr 2016 12:47:59
Hummels will do haha no but in all seriousness we could do with a new goalkeeper and world class defender anyway.

27 Apr 2016 13:20:46
The issue's far from over. All that can be said from this is that Sakho admits the drug was in his system. What happens to him still depends on the circumstances of how that drug got into his system and any mitigation he can provide.

It's inevitable that he will be banned but the question is for how long and will Liverpool sack him because of it. Depending on the circumstances I do not think it sends a bad message to rehabilitate a player after he's done wrong and served his punishment.

27 Apr 2016 14:00:03
If he gets any more than a few months then the club should definitely sack him, in my opinion. It'd be ridiculous to keep a player around on 80k a week who is no longer able to make an effective contribution due to the fact that he's done something idiotic. People can make excuses like "But wait, he might have accidentally taken a banned substance because it was in these tablets he though were legit, so it's okay", but I don't buy that at all. These professional athletes have it spelled out for them; if you don't know what's in it, don't take it, or at the very least have it cleared by someone at the club who has the authorisation to do so. I mean don't get me wrong, I love Sakho; I think he's been incredible for us this season, probably our best CB in my opinion, and seems like a stand up guy, but honestly if he's cheated, and gets hammered for it, he's got to go.

27 Apr 2016 13:58:06
Spot on, Muscat. A hearing and presentation of facts and evidence from all parties including the player's own testimony will still need to be conducted at a tribunal so we still have a long way to go. Not requesting a B test means nothing more than that.

27 Apr 2016 16:32:01
He is certainly getting a ban and the only question is the length. It would still doesn't matter as the club would need to take a decision on the player. What are we defending here for the player? A dumb act should be dealt with what it's required. How could he be ignorant in taking a substance in full conscious mind?

27 Apr 2016 17:44:27
Its funny sakho does something wrong some want to bring back crucifixion but saurez he could have eaten absolutely anyone or anything and the majority was all for getting behind him I guess its just unlucky for sakho he doesn't get 25 goals a year if he did he'd have total support like saurez got.

27 Apr 2016 17:55:32
Harry, his punishment for taking the drug is his ban. Whether he has a future at Liverpool depends on whether he's in breach of contract and even then it is a judgement call. I won't give an opinion on whether he should be sacked or not without further details.

27 Apr 2016 14:57:46
Have to say I agree with you Hustle on most points there. You've spoken a lot of sense.

27 Apr 2016 20:03:18
Breach of contract or gross misconduct? He could get sacked.
On the point of Suarez, no-one condoned his antics. How can you "get behind" a drugs cheat? Sport without rules is pretty meaningless. If you don't respect the rules then you're not really a football fan IMO.

27 Apr 2016 20:56:29
Theres no way either offence can be graded as this is worse than that but saurez recieved massive support regardless of what he did sakho is getting no where near the same lvl wether he deserves it or not. But to me biting another human being not once but 3 times trying to force a way out of the club that pays your wages dragging the name of the club through the mud repeatedly ranks as worse than anything sakho has done i'm only pointing out the fickleness of fans and the rules argument means little to nothing if sturridge dives in the europa final getting the winning penalty would fans demand we gave the trophy back didn't accept the cl place start a petition to get sturridge sacked because technically he broke a rule winning the penalty ofc not ok the rules infraction is not in the same hemisphere in case of severity but both times rules have been broken or is it ok to break some rules but not others then it stinks of double standards.

27 Apr 2016 10:10:29
Danny Agger out of contract this summer. Bring him back to cover if Sakho's banned. ;)

27 Apr 2016 10:31:00
To be fair, there isn't many players I would take back but Agger is one of them. Alonso probably being the only other. Agger is still a quality player from what I've seen of him internationally. Let's not forget 3 years ago Barcelona tried to sign him. His injuries seem to have improved in recent years as well. As a back up, I'd take him in a heartbeat. I'll never forget him handing his teeth to the physio and running back onto the pitch!

27 Apr 2016 10:44:02
Danny wouldn't adapt to the league physicality at present. Loved him. A player who loved my club more than the fans.
He should have been our first ambassador.

27 Apr 2016 12:13:03
Think nostalgia is getting the better of you Adam. Lol
He's been playing in a poor league and I would rather have Klopp look at a long term solution, heartless of me to say but got to think with your head.
On another note, wouldn't he be a great option for club ambassador one day? Once michael Owen the traitor is forced out first obviously lol.

27 Apr 2016 13:59:26
If Agger couldn't cope with the demands of the PL when he left, what makes you think he can do that now when he's older and slower and more prone to injury?

28 Apr 2016 10:32:11
redohio, you seem to be making sweeping assumptions based on nothing. He was good enough when he left and most were sad to see him go. What makes you think he's slower or more prone to injury? He's only 31, what age is Toure? Agger has been a regular starter this season and finished the 90 minutes in all but 2 starts. So, I dunno, there's that.

27 Apr 2016 09:11:40
Ed001, do you think there is an outside chance of Can making the Europa final on the 18th, if of course we get past Vilareal?

{Ed001's Note - seems highly unlikely.}

27 Apr 2016 07:02:46
Im reading we have signed the youngster Lattie. Any idea why Man City let him go?

27 Apr 2016 10:37:54
Apparently Pellegrini prefers his brother, Diego Cappuccino.

27 Apr 2016 12:16:53
His second cousin macchiato is better I would say.
Expect the usual "spotted macchiato in a Starbucks in so and so a town" rumours to start popping up.

27 Apr 2016 12:44:56
Mikey let's not Mocha fool of ourselves mate. Although I wouldn't put it past the Daily Espresso to print that!

27 Apr 2016 01:38:46
Another left back linked yo the club in jonas hector of cologne. Just a thought and would like peoples opinions. we need solid fullbacks as ours have various weaknesses. Moreno for me however should be kept. as a winger. He is fast, takes on a man, gets in behind, has a mean shot and can cross. He does a lot of damage going forward. Thoughts?

27 Apr 2016 01:51:52
I'd bring in Hector and keep Moreno as competition. Hector also has versatility to play DM which would provide good backup there if required.

27 Apr 2016 02:39:53
Does he do a lot of damage going forward? I don't think he can cross very well at all. Yes he's fast but that's it. Having said this is keep him because I think potentially he could be excellent and if anyone can get the best out of him Klopp can.

27 Apr 2016 08:17:57
Wasn't Bale originally a left back? Proof that you can move a player forward successfully. Not saying Moreno is as good as Bale but I think he could be worth a run of games on the left wing.

27 Apr 2016 09:01:08
Do we play out n out left/ right wingers tho? Moreno would only be useful on the left wing. Whereas between lallana, coutinho, milner, ib etc they can switch sides and also play central around the box.

27 Apr 2016 09:04:19
Morenos big problem in attack IMO is he's too one-footed. You need someone who can get in behind but also able to cut inside and shoot to the really effective. sides just give Moreno the inside and he can't shoot with his right foot.

I'd prefer Couts, Llalana, Milner, Markovic, Ojo over him on the wing anyday.

27 Apr 2016 06:05:48
So what about Brad Smith? Cover of cover then? If you bring a LB, one of smith / Moreno should be off.

27 Apr 2016 13:46:37
I'd keep Smith over Moreno.

27 Apr 2016 14:04:06
I`ve seen Hector play and I wouldn`t mind him at all. He`s big, strong, fast can attack, decent defending a good tracking back, can shoot and is two footed. To crown it all, he said that if Klopp came for him that he would heed his call. Moreno is a liability and has a terribly inconsistent final ball, gets caught out a lot, poor header of the ball (in fact he doesn`t even jump and when he does, he docks), and can`t defend to save his life.

27 Apr 2016 00:18:09
Just to put it out there. who do you think was the best signing for us since the prem has started. Value for money wise? I would go for Gary Mac on a free what a player😂😂.

27 Apr 2016 01:44:23
Tough one. Big Sami would be my choice. Think we paid just over £2m for him from wilhem in holland if i remember. turned out to be a steal. great player!

{Ed001's Note - 3.6m wasn't he?}

27 Apr 2016 02:21:36
What did we pay for Alonso, 10m? Seemed like a fair bit at the time, but not when you look at what he added to the team and what he was later sold for.

27 Apr 2016 07:11:18
As well as Gary Mac and Sami I'd like to mention Torres, Suarez (who both were great for LFC and sold for £20m+ more than we paid for them) and Marcus Babbel.

27 Apr 2016 08:04:27
Really tough one this but I'll give it a go has to be between.

M. Babble. I think he was free when we signed and we were robbed of him playing longer due to the condition he developed but still brilliant player.

S. Finnan. Another great full back we bought, can't re member the fee but I thin it was in 3.5 million bracket.

S. Hyypia. Will always go down as a great for us and was only 3.5 million which was a steal for a player of his calibre and service.

R. Jones. Another right back who signed at start of PL era. Was an absolute bargain and again we were robbed of an excellent full back due to injuries.

P. Reina. At 6 million was a great signing for us.

A. Arbeloa. I know another full back but I'm sure he was a free when we got him and he did a job for us there.

X. Alonso. He cost 10 million, but even after watching him play for us in his first game most of us had a feeling this guy was special.

G. McAllister. Yeah on a free no one can argue with that.

I'd like to include Jari Litmanen as we somehow got him for free but he was only used sparingly but the guy was a great player in his time.

27 Apr 2016 08:11:30
Hypia for me without a doubt, Mac is a solid second place. Henchoz for 3.5 and Garcia for 6m were pretty solid deals as well.

27 Apr 2016 09:12:22
Studge, coutinho, can, origi, Lucas

In this day and age what we payed for them for what were getting returned and still will is fabulous.

Apart from Lucas there all 20mil players.

27 Apr 2016 10:21:10
Gary Mac all day long. What a signing he was. That goal in the Derby will live long in the memory and everything that happened that year seemed to revolve around him. Amazing signing. Followed by Sami and Xabi.
On another note what a classy statement from "across the park" yesterday in relation to the 96. Transcends more than football.

27 Apr 2016 10:57:33
Suarez. What we paid for him, what we got from him and what we sold him for. No one comes close in my opinion.
We got 69 goals in 110 games and received £40 million in cash. Not bad for a January deal.

27 Apr 2016 16:52:02
not only did hyppia perform well on the pitch he was also great off the pitch, one of our all time great signings, this debate just goes to show its not about how much you spend its what you spend it on, I do hope that we buy well in the summer we really need to have a good summer in that regard I would go as far and say I think its vital, we cannot afford to mess up this time.

27 Apr 2016 17:04:56
Neil Ruddock.