Liverpool Banter Archive September 24 2015

24 Sep 2015 23:15:54
After considered deliberation upon his most recent purchase , Nathaniel clyne. has decided to knock the 2 houses into one.

YNWA

24 Sep 2015 22:57:34
I am amazed by how br constantly refers to the character of his players when he single handedly ripped any characters out of there as he doesn't have the balls to stand up to strong personalities. Pepe Reina for one, Gerrard, Agger. As rodgers CV is nothing but average he knew he had no proven success to back himself up with so brings in the likes of the welsh xavi and milner (who has been tripe by the way) to replace genuine characters.
Get him out of our club asap - he should never have been given the job in the first place

24 Sep 2015 23:16:36
Nearly all the strikers BR bought but then found them useless and shipped them out are performing better than the lots we have. Apas scoring twice against Barcelona. Mario scored too. That shows that the players are good enough to play for LFC. It is the system. Clueless tactics and a manager who was sitting on the bench yesterday rather than help or guide his team.

25 Sep 2015 00:42:56
Balo is still a lazy player who does nothing on the field, even at Milan. He only plays when he has the ball and the goal he scored was a free kick. The boy is still the same

24 Sep 2015 21:36:21
If possible could I get both Eds 001&002 view on Ancelotti as a manager/coach? Please.

I respect the fact his cv is littered with trophies and sucess in three of the top leagues in European football.

However, similar to Mourinho, hasn't he just been a tad lucky with appointments? I mean he obviously did something fantastic to get the teams he has. Like Jose who did wonders with Porto, he then landed a bottomless pit of cash and could buy a world class side at Chelsea, then he took a top Italian side with very little competition in Italy (hadn't Juve just been kicked out of A for fixing?), They had also won back to back titles hadn't they? Then Madrid who of course have everything already in place, back to Chelsea once Fergie departs inheriting a top side again who had won the CL. Not suggesting he isn't great, but he's had a lot in his corner to start with.

Back to Carlo, he has also had Madrid and Chelsea aside from mighty Milan. So to take over our current position, is he the right person, does his previous work suggest he can take a fallen side rather then a side constantly in the mix for titles, with a squad used to winning and competing in CL and other top competitors?

My concern is he, like Jose, has often walked into a ready made squad fit to compete and have either just won or recently won a major honour. We are not that side.

Eds if you would give your assessment please

{Ed002's Note - I have given mine.}

24 Sep 2015 22:09:25
very good post mate, also if it is Carlo is it going to be a short term solution or not as FSG wanted a younger manager.

24 Sep 2015 22:12:32
Whatever the level of existing squad, there is a huge amount of skill involved in helping that squad reach its potential. LFC is not reaching its potential at the moment.
You don't walk into top clubs without being a top manager. He gets those ready made squads because he is capable of getting them to reach their potential.

24 Sep 2015 23:01:57
I am not saying i want or don't want Carlo, but even if he was short term, a couple of years, and it brought some success, i would take it. We can then use this time to put a plan in place for the longer term. Right now, we need to be winners again and quickly.

24 Sep 2015 23:05:05
Rodgers walked into a top club.

24 Sep 2015 23:33:57
Clubs plural mate

25 Sep 2015 00:31:35
Well its completely wrong to suggest he's been lucky with appointments. Obviously he has worked his way up to the level of walking into top jobs.

In brief:
Started at Reggiana got them promoted to seria A

Moved to Parma finished second in the league which was an achievement

Moved to Juventus was sacked on last day of the season at half time when they still had a chance to win the league.

Moved to milan who had had a trophyless season previously and went on to win multiple titles including 2 european cups.

Surely we can't seriously be questioning the appointment of the only other manager to win 3 European cups other than Bob Paisleys credentials?

25 Sep 2015 01:03:37
{Ed002's Note - It is not so much a style thing but he has an ability to demand respect - people listen and don' screw around. They don't talk back, they don't cause issues. I really don't know how he does it. But a good guy, a great coach, not the most cheerful. key is that he doesn't fall out with players. Language may look to be an issue, but trust me it isn't. He adapts to clubs but critically does not often assume responsibility for transfers. This doesn't mean he would want to be working with the likes of Damien Comolli but he could certainly build a relationship with the major players in transfers at Liverpool. But, to some extent, there remains a paradigm shift for the club that would need to be taken account of. It is not how they have worked before - one way or another, if CA were to arrive, he or the club would need to adapt. At the end of the season I would worry less about this - part way through, my keys jangle.

25 Sep 2015 03:24:47
The average PL manager lasts about 15 months. A couple of years would make them pretty senior, as BR is now, not 'short term'.

25 Sep 2015 06:59:39
Isn't Rodgers the 2nd or 3rd longest serving premiership manager out of all the current managers

Hasnt Rodgers had the best part of a £300m transfer kitty
(Prob more than Mourinho during his first stint at Chelsea)

Didn't Rodgers sack his coaching staff

Think he is running out of excuses

Judging him after 3 years - are we any better
Simple answer - No

FSG need to act asap

25 Sep 2015 07:10:19
Ancelotti is 57. Age shouldn't be a factor for him, especially when we are not sure FSG will be around for more than another 2 years.

25 Sep 2015 07:50:54
Thanks for posting Ed002s reply.

Cmac, Ron and others. I'm not questioning his credentials at all, his cv is without doubt the best out there. I'm also not saying he won't be great at Liverpool either.

My point was where we are at right now, has Carlo had that appointment? Parma to 2nd as you say is fantastic. Juve had won three titles in a row when he took over, Milan had won plenty a couple of seasons before his appointment and when they didn't win they came close, same with Madrid and Chelsea, if they hadn't just won the league it was a season before and I think Chelsea won the CL. PSG as with the last two mentioned, pots of money and French league with that spending power again doesn't suggest works of wonder.

Yes he has had to still motivate and win these trophies, but is anyone suggesting we are in a similar state to any of those clubs at the time of his appointment? Won CL 10ys ago, patchy appearances since. No title for 25 yrs. 1 or 2 potentially star world players but an average squad which if all fit could be a top 4 side.

So my question was really to gauge if he is right for our situation, has he really had to deal with similar and as great as his cv is, a bit like Jose, he had a fantastic start to managerial life and landed a top job off the back of it. Which happens all the time, that Juve job that team won 3 in a row he continued its success, etc etc. He hasn't since Parma taken a 'sleeping giant' to the top, not that Parma were that at all. they've been ready made challengers with current success, not had to rebuild or start from scratch and that's what I'm interested to know from people who know, is he capable? The last almost 30yrs they've kind of been ready made haven't they

25 Sep 2015 08:25:52
I hear you, but I think it's about leadership and Ancelotti seems to be a good leader of different teams, in different cultures, in different competitions and with various individuals (Zlatan springs to mind).
It may be him, it may not, but he's definitely a great candidate.

25 Sep 2015 08:43:41
I hate all the BR bashing on a daily basis although understand some of the comments made but just look at it like this,

Your a liverpool player and your playing for BR,

Or

Your a liverpool player and your playing for Ancelotti - A guy who has pretty much won everything hasn't he - Instant respect and think I've got to work hard here as this guy demands success nothing less

24 Sep 2015 21:11:06
Eds you say Liverpool have shown no interest in Klopp, could you hazard a guess at why?
Is there a reason they haven't/won't speak to him?
The only reason I can think is that he has already rejected our approach.
Don't buy into this that one person who has worked with Klopp has advised against him, unless of course that person is Brendan Rodgers.
Also is it normal practice to talk to potential replacements while the manager is still in the role, obviously Rodgers can't be too happy about it, if I knew my boss was interviewing my replacement while I was still there I would quit anyway

{Ed002's Note - There are lots of managers they have shown no interest in - there doesn't need to be any justification. They have not approached Sam Allardyce, Robby Di Matteo or Filippo Inzaghi either.

I have already answered the second question.}

24 Sep 2015 22:02:20
Except unlike the others you mentioned there is wide consensus that Klopp did an amazing work with Dortmund and is one of the talented managers in Europe especially for clubs who don't have the money of the top European club. Looks strange they are so uninterested.

24 Sep 2015 22:14:43
err thanks ed002. Must have. Missed the answers.
There needs to be an FAQ with ed answer so your not bothered by repeat questions and those of us who missed it can see? Like a scrolling banner or page segment with whatever the flavour of the week is rather than a dedicated page

24 Sep 2015 23:47:06
Or maybe read the posts or use the search function

25 Sep 2015 07:04:34
Klopp is not a yes man

He is too much of a maverick for FSG

Who prefer more docile and easy going and easy to influence characters
- Ayre / Rodgers / Pascoe / macca / o'driscoll / marsh etc

24 Sep 2015 19:32:24
Ed's a bit of a different question.

In a case like this where seemingly talks are being held with LFC and Ancelotti and possible other managers. How,if a Rooney rule was introduced would these types of talks be affected? Would the club have to go and actively seek a minority manager to talk to,If it's all behind closed doors and hush hush,between simply 1 manager and the club to be the replacement,would that club possibly face a fine for not talking to a minority manager? Or does the rule only affect the process if the manager has been sacked then invitations opened to other managers?

I know this rule isn't in effect I was just wondering your thoughts on the situation. Cheers as always,I know it's not exactly LFC related,so if you want it on another page just tell me where to ask for it

{Ed002's Note - It would be entirely irrelevant and is not going to happen.}

25 Sep 2015 10:13:11
Sweet cheers as always ed002

24 Sep 2015 20:43:50
I don't post very often but catch up on posts 2 or 3 times a day. Been watching LFC for over 30 years and been passing on the passion to my kids. I may go in to a rant but I will try and stay on track!

Our club in my opinion is lacking true leadership throughout the club, from top to bottom. We over pay for a player (sometimes you need to to get the right ones I appreciate that) but on the other hand we squabble over a couple of million for others that we need.

Our manager seems to be a out of his depth (I hope he proves me wrong and goes on a fantastic run of result), there is no clear plan for players he buys or the style of football he wants to play. Now this is a problem that FSG created, he was not ready to take over on his own. I also don't want to slag the guy, there are plenty of others doing that. I think he has got ability to manage but this is defiantly a job too soon. I think ed 2 has stated this previously.

I have experience of building businesses and turning business's around, I left school with basically no qualifications but always had the ability to learn, something our club seems to fail to do. In my opinion our club needs leadership, taking by the balls and dragging up.

Leadership comes from the top, I do to want a corporate fool trying to bamboozle the media and supporters with corporate jargon, I want an honest management structure from top to bottom.

This starts with the MD and CE, who have both put themselves under pressure backing BR. I think they need replacing personally (I am an outsider looking in, so I will apologise if someone can make a case for them) along with BR, but, replacing all is too much to change in one go.

My point is, our problems are deeper than just BR, although I think replacing him initially is the first step.

I don't know if I have made my point (sat in a bar on a business trip, had a few!) but at least I feel better for getting it off my chest!!

Frustrating times but keep the faith, we will one day rise again!

GGK

24 Sep 2015 21:09:15
I hate to bring up the whole director of football thing again but I believe the club would benefit massively from someone running the whole football side of things, how we will play, recruiting etc.

It seam as tho everybody is pulling in different directions at the present time!

I guess this Michael Gorden fella is kind of doing this at the minute to a certain degree but he seams to be just as clueless as fsg.

24 Sep 2015 21:18:12
Completely agree with GGK.

24 Sep 2015 21:23:19
That would make some sense as Gordon is 12% of FSG.

24 Sep 2015 21:35:51
I meant to write as the rest of fsg

24 Sep 2015 22:23:38
I wouldn't be too critical of FSG, they have backed the club and for that I am grateful.

I would just question their appointments, the next few months will give us an indication if they have learnt anything.

Being calm and getting thing right is paramount. Otherwise we will be having the same conversations/debates again in another 2 to 3 years.

GGK

24 Sep 2015 19:17:34
Stop the press.

You thought that smokescreens were only during silly season? Well think again!

Ancelloti is only a smokescreen*, for the real choice of Gary Monk!!

You heard it hear first!





* this may or may not be true

24 Sep 2015 19:29:23
Wrong. its Gary's older more experienced brother "HARRY "

24 Sep 2015 19:59:40
That was a hoot, Zed.

24 Sep 2015 19:46:34
Going off recent behaviour it's most probably Koeman!

24 Sep 2015 19:48:35
As long as it's not cousin Barry

24 Sep 2015 21:11:17
I think the only reason for the wait with sacking BR is the wait for his replacement to relieved of his duties in Newcastle.

24 Sep 2015 21:03:12
Ken Augero was spotted with Fabio Capello and John. w. Henry talking formations, loan deals and the January transfer window, over pizzas. .gospel!!

24 Sep 2015 21:52:55
Why ye lyin for hahaha I really how it isn't monk he's just another brenda ancelotti with carra would be good we are liverpool we deserve a top man not a baboon man u sacked moyes for a lot less yet are up stairs stand by a man who couldn't even manage his marriage I never wanted him never will am fed up of backing him we need a change klopp is passion but ancelotti is pure champion but we will see

24 Sep 2015 17:29:49
At the risk of an RTFP response. could I clarify? Macca didn't mention Ancelloti by name did he ? Just someone who had previously managed a large Spanish club?

{Ed002's Note - He is talking about Ancelotti.}

24 Sep 2015 19:33:16
Who else is on sabbatical and recently managed a big Spanish team?

24 Sep 2015 20:00:27
It is Ancelloti. it`s all over the media.

24 Sep 2015 18:18:21
Hi ED'S,just hope the owners have got the balls to interview both KLOPP and ANCELLOTTI and show some ambition both are ready and available and come as trophy winners,please no more bright young things. . also ED'S how confident are you that FSG will get this next appointment right because my patience with them is very low and I think the finger of suspicion will be pointed at them once RODGERS has gone,the structure they have in place is all wrong,they have been here since 2010 and we haven't moved any further,were still a yo-yo team.

{Ed002's Note - Liverpool has shown no interest in Klopp - move on.}

24 Sep 2015 16:40:32
hi edo2 this one is more for you I think us simpletons just need it told to us slowly ha is it if or when Rodgers gos? also I sense your not so sure on anceloti as macca is so if you belive Rodgers is on borrowed time do you no of any mangers that Liverpool have sounded out? thanks in advance obviously I understand lot of this similar talk may be doing your head in (understatement) think we all need clarification cheers

{Ed002's Note - All I know of in terms of managers is what Macca has shared regarding Ancelotti. They were recommended another manager in the summer but a decision was made not to pursue that person and to stick with Rodgers.}

24 Sep 2015 17:54:39
cheers ed02 so do you belive he is with us for the foreseeable future.

{Ed002's Note - We'll see, but as they are talking to someone else I would assume not if CA is interested in the job.}

24 Sep 2015 20:02:14
Dumb decision! What`s the use keeping him and supporting him with funds only to sack him 7 games in instead of sacking him in the summer and give the new guy a full preseason to evaluate the players?

24 Sep 2015 16:23:55
Eds, not necessarily Liverpool related, but has a wage cap been explored as an alternative to FFP, by FIFA or any other body? Would it "level the playing field" in terms of allowing greater and fairer competition between teams when it comes to transfers and attracting talent? Is it even a viable option or would it never be considered?

{Ed002's Note - No. Firstly it is well beyond the remit of FIFA or UEFA and secondly how would you apply it to nations which have a significantly different economic profile (Romania, China, England, Uganda, etc.). Where salary caps have been applied it is by local FAs and is generally works on the basis of the salaries not exceeding x% of the income each club has. That helps the wealthy clubs and does not give any sort of level playing field. FFP has a restriction on salary growth and is perhaps fairer.}

24 Sep 2015 15:50:01
I love how people read between the lines all the time.

There are no quotes in the news story, just speculation. Klopp will not be the Liverpool manager any time soon. As disappointing as that is, it's also true.

24 Sep 2015 15:32:07
Liverpool based journalist Graham Beecroft thinks BR will be sacked. He claims to have inside information which suggests FSG actually decided to sack him before last nights win. It seems the power base in Boston made the decision. The club board were split. He thinks the change wil not happen until after the Villa game. It seems Klopp is not under consideration. a lot depends on whether Ancelloti takes the job. If he says no, BR may well be there for the short term. YNWA

24 Sep 2015 15:53:37
Beecroft is not highly regarded to put it mildly

24 Sep 2015 17:19:42
Beecroft is experienced and has acquired many contacts on Merseyside Wool.

Look beyond talk sport mate and you will see.

To his credit he's very careful with his words. Maybe he's old school.

24 Sep 2015 18:02:22
Think you will find he has quite a few inside contacts so listen very carefully to what he says red wool !!!

24 Sep 2015 15:16:16
Ray Houghton said that Carlisle turned up and played without any fear. . that is exactly our problem no teams fear playing us anymore.
In fact they probably look forward to it because we seem to play with no ideas.
Shocking!

24 Sep 2015 15:34:50
Exactly! Teams won`t fear you because they know you yourselves, have no idea what you are doing which leads to lack of confidence. It`s like sharks smelling blood in the water and teams will always take advantage. Let`s see if Villa will do that on Sat.

24 Sep 2015 15:48:20
I think it's a little like the UTD fear factor when Ferguson went, They didn't have that fear factor, and I believe that when we lost Suarez, Sterling and Sturridge we lost our fear factor! Those 3 people could turn a game in a second.

24 Sep 2015 16:14:40
Why would they fear us? We're not particularly good at the moment.

24 Sep 2015 14:57:38
I'm not sticking up for Rodgers but last night he can't be solely to blame. The players should have completely thrashed Carlisle, there is no excuse no matter how much you don't respect the manager. It was embarrassing and I think it's short sighted to just blame Rodgers. He obviously doesn't have them playing well but seriously, the players should have stepped up. They should be ashamed.

24 Sep 2015 15:14:12
I would agree with you there. The coach has very little control over these things. On the other hand if he`s responsible for them not playing well, then it means there is a lack of confidence which leads to them being unable to perform because they are scared to make a mistak so on that front, he is to blame.

24 Sep 2015 15:18:41
The buck stops with Rodgers
See what I did there?

24 Sep 2015 15:27:38
He played 5 defensive players,we lacked any one sitting on the edge of the 18. From being to narrow,we've gone almost the complete opposite now on insistingthe ball go wide and to the by line before being crossed in,he isn't finding a middle ground,THAT was clearly tactical. I don't think it helped using a sub at half time. Milner needs to take himself of corner duties ASAP.
Insisting on playing Lovren and Skrtel(2 big contributors to the goal)
These were all things the manager had control over

24 Sep 2015 15:21:30
This would make sense, but the goal scoring and defensive problems are consistent with what Rodgers has produced over the past season or so. With a huge amount of changes in the squad and a large amount of money spent. Think of the centre backs/right backs/left backs we have gone through trying to fix our defence, or the sheer number of different strikers (or in Sterlings case non-strikers) we have played in an effort to score more goals.

24 Sep 2015 15:41:36
Yes but regardless of tactics we are talking about the equivalent of a Ford Focus ST verses a Formula 1 car. The Liverpool players have world class training facilities, expert fitness coaches, diet specialists, you name it. A much better quality of life and pretty much everything they will ever need to be a their best. They are first class machines and they should completely destroy lower league opposition 65 places apart regardless of whether they're all defensive players or not.

I don't think the players should get off scot free here. They need to take responsibility and we mustn't let them get away with it.

24 Sep 2015 16:05:58
Spot on, Bob!

24 Sep 2015 16:16:43
You can't sack all the players. They seem to have little motivation, desire, or interest at the moment and there is really only one way to fix that.

24 Sep 2015 16:23:08
The players should do better but there's just such an air of low confidence breeding within the club and i do believe its as a result of the management that nothing is going right. The team selection alone last night was evidence of this, Rodgers put as close to his first choice team out against Carlisle. I was giving the match much creedance,figured we'd play the youths and concentrate more on the important Villa game,as soon as i saw the team it was evident he was scared to lose and so dumped a whole lot more pressure on himself.
So the manager has no confidence in anyone but practically his first team in getting a result against Carlisle. what's that doing for team moral?
I mean its evident then within the first team that everyones sapped of confidence,players out of position,no set shape,no set game plan,no leaders on the pitch. This is inherant from last year and its only worsening.
And what's it saying to the youths. rossiter and chiravella both had good games against bordeaux,but don't merit starting against carlisle in the league cup? Its a confidence killer. (Also if we're playing a full team against Carlisle and not against Bordeaux but play the kids in Uefa,is this Rodgers showing the same disdain for Europe as last year?)Regardless
The whole club is suffering from a cancer of confidence that's been slowly eating away and right now we look so bereft of any,or any remedy that its clearly affecting everyone.
I can't see how Rodgers still has the dressing room when the players perform like this and for that alone he has to be replaced sooner rather than later before this season is unsalvagable.

24 Sep 2015 14:45:42
Odd question I know . but how do clubs normally sack managers? Do they ever sound out options before the deed? Do managers have agents in the same way as players? Who negotiates payoffs etc? Just wondering if there is any 'best practice' that a well run club should follow.

{Ed002's Note - There is no "normally" per se as managers depart clubs for various reasons and sometimes with little or no notice. It is unusual for discussions to have taken place directly with a replacement, but certainly not unusual to speak to an agent or other representative of a manager. It is also not unusual for a club to use a third party to make an approach to sound out possible replacements. Most managers do indeed have agents and it is those agents who will negotiate terms.}

24 Sep 2015 15:11:26
Seeing as you're about 002. Has Liverpool/third party, been sounding out any managers ? In your factual opinion, do you think Rodgers is facing the boot any time soon?

{Ed002's Note - I understand from Macca that Liverpool has spoken with Ancelotti.}

24 Sep 2015 16:14:10
Benny I know your probably trying but try get edd 001 or possibly 002 if he/she has the time get this manager situation out in the open and discussed if at all possible (without legal implications obviously) in a new podcast 😉

24 Sep 2015 14:42:30
My view Rodgers will be kept in place by FSG for numerous reasons the earliest he could go is Christmas but that is unlikely.

Ancelloti might have taken the job 15 years ago but not now. He would not take a job outside London anyway, for his families sake FSG have been warned off Klopp for some reason , so that leaves us with the usual suspects so or up and coming chaps we have never heard of. My money is on the Bournemouth manager but I don't think he will come either. We need someone with a real raging desire to win. Someone gets really angry when we lose and has done his apprenticeship elsewhere and please has won at least one trophy. In short someone with passion. Simone is the only one for me that would fit the bill.

24 Sep 2015 14:57:33
So we have no chance with 2 top managers who are out of work but we can get a top manager who has work with a Champions League club. Odd. And if we can't get those 3, the next step is to get Eddie Howe. :)

24 Sep 2015 14:57:58
Sorry, we can't even get Eddie Howe :)

24 Sep 2015 15:17:29
We are tired of unproven managers. We don`t need an apprentice. We need a manager with a more than decent CV and they are out there. Stop with this Eddie Howe, BR, Martinez stuff. LFC is not a club where you learn on the job. We have seen how far back that approach has set us currently.

24 Sep 2015 15:52:49
Spot on redohio! We need a manager with a proven record including Champions League experience). We also need a manager who can attract players of real quality. Ancelloti and Klopp both fit the bill. Personally I would prefer Klopp.

24 Sep 2015 13:43:54
Hi Eds,

Excellent job on this site. Can you speculate as to why a club like Liverpool might have been warned of Klopp?

{Ed002's Note - I have no idea what you are talking about.}

24 Sep 2015 14:22:36
There was a report in the telegraph or independent that FSG had been warned off Klopp by someone who had worked closely with him.

{Ed002's Note - I can't help with that. The only name given to Liverpool in the summer as an option was not Klopp as I have explained.}

24 Sep 2015 14:44:48
Could only guess that if true it would be that he may easily leave for another job. His record doesn't suggest this, but maybe it's well known he wants Bayern or Germany and if either came up he'd go? Just a guess

24 Sep 2015 14:56:55
Is it well known? Or just supposition?

Perhaps Klopp wasn't suggested to Gordon because the advisor knew he was going on sabbatical.

{Ed002's Note - No, that wasn't the reason.}

24 Sep 2015 15:13:28
It's a shame Liverpool didn't sound him out, I personally believe he'd like the opportunity

24 Sep 2015 15:13:40
Sorry if youve already said ed but who was suggested in the summer and is he still possible?

{Ed002's Note - It is unimportant, Liverpool decided not to pursue him.}

24 Sep 2015 15:42:01
Jorge Jesus.

24 Sep 2015 11:57:37
I keep watching the goal we conceded last night an to me there are 3 players at fault for it.

Firstly Joe Allen. He is so far forward he leaves a massive hole in the middle of the pitch. the Carlisle player just wanders into to pick up the ball. What really compounds this mistake is that he doesn't actually close the ball down, he is simply out of position. If he raced up to close the player down and got right in his face then it's the high press working, but all he does is charge forward and then stand off him by about 5 yards. He essentially takes himself out of the game completely.

The next is Lovren. Same as Allen he is wildly out of position, he leaves the defensive line but doesn't close the ball down, he just watches the player come towards him then let's him pass when he takes a step, once again taking himself out of the game completely. Skrtel is now up against two attackers, with none of our players having tried to make a single tackle or close the ball down.

However the final nail in the coffin is Skrtel himself, he starts by tracking the run of the attacker, which is not terrible I guess (although he would've been offside if he had held his defensive line), but then suddenly turns his back on the ball, stops tracking the attacker and heads for the player with the ball having no wplayed the second forward onside, Can was closing the ball down by this stage and Skrtel should have stuck to his man. He let's the player have acres of space in the area while accomplishing nothing, he doesn't get near the player with the ball and he isn't tight against the other forward. Once again he takes himself out of the game.

At one point Skrtel ends up standing almost directly behind Lovren, neither of them near the ball or a Carlisle player.

The two of them are an utter shambles. And having the defensive ineptitude of Joe Allen in front of them was just a recipe for disaster.

This was not skill by the Carlisle players, it was 3 of our players effectively removing themselves from the game through poor decision making. There are some players in the world who can take Defenders out of the game through unbelievable skill, but they do not play for Carlisle.

For me, the only back five that has any chance of being a success is Moreno, Sakho, Gomes, Clyne with Lucas or Can in front.

Would love to hear what Ed001 and you guys think?

Have a great day

{Ed001's Note - spot on with the reading of the situation for me, though I would say a big part of the problem was playing a back 3 meant that Joe Allen should not have needed to be back, as we had two spare men in defence. The problem was that the two spare men were not doing what they should have been doing. It would have made far more sense to use one to man mark their forward, one to cover that and the third centre back should have been free to pick up a runner. Instead we just had 3 men with no actual idea who was doing what. As usual there was no communication at the back, which compounds the problem.

It was a ludicrous and frankly idiotic plan to play a back 3 as we did. It showed a complete lack of any tactical understanding of the game to not change things up at any point, but to stick with the three against only one man. The advantage of having a player like Can at the back should be that he can simply step into midfield if we only have one man to mark. Instead he would stride forwards on the ball, then drop straight back into his position. There was a complete lack of any kind of tactical flexibility or intelligence on display from the players and coaching staff.}

24 Sep 2015 13:28:57
Brilliant assessnment of a problem which has been over our head from 6 games atleast, and everyone were so busy in bashing the manager.

Allen is not skilled perfromer to put in a timely decent tackle, He could just try. (Xavi wasnt either)
We cannot afford to play without someone who would stop the opposition coming to us with pace.

The tackle should have come at the half way line rather than running back towards our goal.
When you play with Allen in the team ( Just like Gerrard 2 season ago ) someone should be alongside to stop the opposition.

Now this leaves BR in a delamma to play Two CM in the middle pretty much like two holding players. Else he would need to drop one of Henderson/Milner on to the bench to accomodate other attackers in the side.

3 at the back was only to get the best out of Moreno and Clyne from the flanks, Moreno is a natural offensive full back while Clyne needs to be brought into the game with your sheer passing. We did nothing from two games and only Moreno had any sort of influence.

Contraditcs when people bash BR to play 3 at the back and then want Moreno to start as well ( who has been dog abused in this page for his defensive vulnerability )

Fantastic Red dawn, Someone actually interested in how the goal came rather than a go at the manager and all other players out there.

24 Sep 2015 14:29:50
EG It was a good analysis. But I have no idea what your last 2 paragraphs allude to before congratulating Red Dawn.

24 Sep 2015 14:46:40
Spot on, was shocked when I saw how easy that goal was conceded. Well done by Carlisle but the havoc they created simply by counter attacking at pace and one forward making a decent run was amateurish. Skrtel and Lovren looked completely unsure of what the other was doing, much as they've done for the last 18 months.

24 Sep 2015 15:01:38
Bob

That was more to BR's decision to play 3 at the back.

24 Sep 2015 15:29:09
EG, I can understand almost everyone's opinion and allegiance on this site but yours.
Are you a BR fan or do you want him sacked as you seem to change your allegiance and thinking every other day.
Where do you stand on the current mess that is LFC?

24 Sep 2015 15:32:55
Brilliant post, Red dawn! EG, don`t iknow what you are rambling about blaming players that every man and his dog knows are the poorest defenders in the league. If BR is not to blame for picking a hapless Lovren and Skrtel and playing a suystem that makes no sense and hampers us in terms of team balance, as well as picking Allen who can`t tackle, then tell us who should the blame go to because the players nor the systems nor tactics don`t pick themselves? Why do you need 3 CB`s to mark one striker hence, unbalancing the team structure? Why play a 5 at the back when your mids don`t track runners and the CB`s do not comunicate? Who`s in charge of fixing the defence which hasn`t been fixed since he`s been here and regardless of almost 100m spent on defenders? I await your answers, EG.

24 Sep 2015 19:40:29
Xavi And iniesta were so impressive at winning the ball back, and so underrated in that department. Yes they were great players but they never gave other centre mids a second on the ball. It helped having busquets sitting in behind, although I don't rate him that highly, he must be doing something right

24 Sep 2015 10:48:26
Hi Ed1 if your about, can i ask why Ancelotti would be interested in coming to Liverpool? I am a Liverpool fan and have been for many years, but let's face it we are falling behind the likes of Chelsea man city etc in recent years who are winning trophy every season, why would he be interested in us? we have a top 4 team yes but we are not going to be winning the league we are struggling to get in the champs league never mind winning it? it would be great if he came, he's a winner at the top level and is well respected etc, but i just want your thoughts on why he would consider us?

{Ed001's Note - the only reason I can think of is if he remembered the Champions League record we have, especially against him, and so wanted the job of returning success. It is a challenge.}

24 Sep 2015 13:16:06
I don't completely agree with the argument that you need to be a UCL club winning trophies to attract a big manager. Fair enough if you're not a big club, but Liverpool are.

Any knowledgeable guy can see that Liverpool already have a good team to work with to make the top 4. It's more than capable of beating United and Spurs to 4th, even 3rd if Arsenal fall into their usual habits. You hear guys like Aly Moreno on EPSNFC completely shut down the possibility because we're an 'average, mid-table team'. I see where he's coming from, but it's rather because Rodgers makes us a mid-table team. Carlo will know this, I'm sure.

Managers like Carlo also want money to spend. FSG have spent a truckload during their ownership, I can't see how they'd buck that trend with a successful manager.

It also helps when the manager in question wants to return to England, and is a self-proclaimed 'follower' of Liverpool. He is not a fan like we are but his admiration is there to be seen.

I don't mean to say he'd definitely accept the job, but I doubt it's as impossible as some people think.

{Ed002's Note - Ancelotti is not someone who would typically be over involved in the transfer process. For most of the jobs he has had, the coaches of those sides have little involvement.}

24 Sep 2015 13:18:07
And adding to my point, LVG agreed to manage a team out of the UCL, and who were effectively 'mid-table'. But he accepted the role because of who they are and the money they have. Do Liverpool have as much money as United? No, but we clearly have enough.

24 Sep 2015 13:38:00
Thanks Ed 1 i think he's a great coach he's had success everywere he has been but is he a team builder? its a major challenge since were probably about level squad wise with Arsenal, Totthenam and Man u (or maybe slightly ahead of them actually!)

Hopefully if he decides to come then he is a winner as i think he's got a massive challenge ahead of him but at least he has a good back room staff to utilize!

24 Sep 2015 12:02:17
Has there been any conformations on your end Ed001 about these talks and Rodgers sacking close?

{Ed001's Note - not with Ancelotti, but in terms of making plans for a near future without Rodgers, yes.}

24 Sep 2015 14:31:59
I'd still think Liverpool is a big enough name for CA, like Milan, Marselle and us will always be giants even if they're not at the top.
Apparently we have owners who want the best and to win titles, we have money and the prem has the biggest income and global following.

You'd think a coach with Carlo's or Klopps pedigree would see a squad of internationals that should be with their input easily in the top 4, top coaches have a singled mindedness that they're the best.

We are and have been used to mediocre performances and results, this has led us to think we're not good enough for these two guys, but I bet they're still in awe of a job like Liverpool

24 Sep 2015 14:43:15
I doubt there is a manager in this world who truly believes in himself who can easily turn down a chance to manage an iconic club like Liverpool fc when such a manager is unemployed. Am sure even an unemployed mourihno would jump at the chance of managing this great club. Why? Because lfc is a club with all the resources to be one of the best in world but just poorly managed. I even think a jurgen klopp is salivating now on what he would do with all the silly money we always throw away.

{Ed001's Note - if only that were true.}

24 Sep 2015 14:54:56
Would go so far as to say in awe, but I reckon someone must be at least tempted by the challenge to return the club to greatness. At least one good thing Rogers has done is to show it's not impossible with a 2nd place finish that had everyone rocking. I'm sure most top coaches would be tempted by the dream of leading Liverpool back to winning the PL.

24 Sep 2015 15:02:06
Ed1, what would you define as 'near future'?

Ed002, that's true, but at the end of the day he still wants a squad that will be invested in and strengthened with better players. Assuming that FSG still envision a Director/Head Coach arrangement, I think that would be in line with what he wants.

{Ed002's Note - I have no idea what you are talking about with Director/HC.}

24 Sep 2015 16:10:50
Well based on what you said some time ago, most clubs in continental Europe have a person appointed in some kind of football director role looking after transfers, which I assume is what Ancelotti has always worked with. From what ed001 has said a few times, that's the arrangement FSG prefer too.

24 Sep 2015 10:59:55
We just can't score goals. The last time we got more than one goal was against QPR last season. That's like 6 months ago.

In the 2013/14 season we leaked goals at the back but could outscore most teams.

But now our opponents probably think "score 1, we draw or win - score 2 and we win for sure".

Football is simple. Stop them scoring and we try to score. Right now we're bad at both.

Something is not right with the training.

24 Sep 2015 12:19:22
I think last time was againt Newcastle

24 Sep 2015 14:40:14
This is why I questioned our new coaching staff as well as Rodgers, as they too coach, drill, train and help put the side together. Even if Rodgers just picks 11 players and the formation, these guys must train them to defend, take corners, free kicks etc. We're bad at everything, how is it just all Rodgers? May as well not have O'Driscoll or McAllister if it's only Rodgers for everything

24 Sep 2015 10:34:39
Obviously we have had rumours about ancellotti and I'm happy if we've approached him. With klopp and Fabre, they have both turned teams, from mid table or lower to European challenging teams, but both struggled in their last season in charge and resigned. I know the love affair of klopp on here, but ancellotti may not have as much as immediate impact as the other two, but he will demand respect due to his reputation and in my opinion will be less likely to have an off season.

24 Sep 2015 12:55:03
I think ancelotti experience would mean he would be able to get the best out of the team and play the best style of football that suits the team rather than a system that suits him or the coaching staff. I think under Rogers we have forgot to do a lot of basic stuff and tried to make things a lot more complicated whilst the person in charge does not know how to properly execute it. And whilst he doesn't know how to execute it, he doesn't know how to fix it so that the team can at least be a solid team. Rogers just has a lot missing from his managerial skills. He has years to go before he should even be close to a job like Liverpool. ancelotti would be the candidate with less risk attached to it but klopp fits the 'model' more. A risk is certainly not was is needed now, another young manager that has decent background will be the worst thing that can happen to this club right now.

24 Sep 2015 09:35:43
They are already reports about who Liverpool are going to buy in the January Transfer Window. I personally think that the first consideration is Liverpool selling players. The club has a large squad but several of the players should not be there. We all know who they are and it really is time for someone with influence at Anfield to tell them that they have to go. There is a place for sentiment in football but only for those who deserve it. Allen, Enrique, Lallana, Lovren, Skrtel, and Lucas are obviously good players but that is not enough any more. They should be sold and their places taken (as backup) by some of the promising young players who are getting only a handful (if that) of chances each season.

24 Sep 2015 09:58:45
Selling Lovren and Skrtel in January would be a terrible idea, as would selling Lucas. You think it's just that simple that the replacements will come in and solve all our problems

24 Sep 2015 10:30:37
You obviously don't think that Skrtel and Lovren are two of the team's main problems. Lucas has been a great (and extremely underrated and reviled) player but he is now past his 'Best by' date. Of course nothing is simple - that is why you and I and others are sitting here making these comments and not making any real contribution to solving the problems at the club.

24 Sep 2015 11:18:58
They're one of many problems but letting them go would cause more problems. Lucas may be past his best but still has an important role to play imo

24 Sep 2015 00:41:58
Whilst I have nothing but total respect for Ed002, I cannot see past why he would see a change in the current management asap as a key jangling situation. LFC in my opinion are in danger total collapse. BR has done nothing to show any competence in this position. Whilst I agree fully that the time to do it was at the end of last season, the current trend is actually worse now given another 100+ million spent.
When KK took over from the hog, he bolstered and rallied the team, probably because of his “legend” status. We are worse off now than when KK took over and bringing in a manager with the status that CA has in my opinion could only serve to do the same.
I would really love to know from Ed002 why he sees this differently. I will never know what he knows but I have supported LFC both financially and in true red spirit for nearly 50 years. What I saw tonight and so far this season is literally light years away from the ideal I began supporting all those years ago.

24 Sep 2015 08:59:26
We miss Jordan hendrson, a leader on the pitch, someone who can give someone a B0$$king Talk to people and sort out issues on the pitch.

24 Sep 2015 09:07:58
Yes We do miss him the most.

24 Sep 2015 09:47:24
You should change your name to 99ProblemsWithMyTeamAlone

24 Sep 2015 10:31:45
Shanek_LFC. .it could be getting changed to 100problems very soon if things don't change!!

24 Sep 2015 08:41:42
Are any of my fellow Liverpool supporters also sick of constantly being told by Journalists, media pundits and the like that Brendan NEEDS more time. he's been here for more than three and quarter years and we're always in transition.

24 Sep 2015 09:06:38
He's a charming guy Reynard. When he was here for the Tour, he comes across as a guy who has a clear idea of what needs to be done and how it needs to happen. If you never met him, you'll not fall under his spell. You see the football, you see the results minus the BS.

24 Sep 2015 09:25:12
I suspect you're right melwood with all the time he's had. Some people are naturally better at communicating a vision than executing on it it seems.

24 Sep 2015 00:11:48
Hi all.
When asked about Ancelotti, ed02 explained Carlo s approach to transfers.(thanks) If a Change was made ide think whoever comes in has a good squad to inherit. Would be great to have someone who can identify and address squad issues. I wouldn't be confidant with others deciding for the manager with our current setup. Just a manager who knows what he wants player wise and gets the team playing his way. I'm sure there are managers who could get more from our current squad than we are seeing.

24 Sep 2015 06:45:22
We have a non existent midfield. A midfield which has contributed nothing going forward nor defending back.
A midfield who hasn't scored a goal or an assist.
A new manager would face the same problem.

24 Sep 2015 07:27:22
A new manager would organise and motivate the midfield to deliver of that I am sure. BR seems inept at getting the best out of his players, he has lost their respect by the way he constantly breaks promises and the way he treats people.

24 Sep 2015 07:29:35
Good to see people disagree to my point and very pleased to see people think we got an outstanding midfield.
Carlo would need them for sure.

24 Sep 2015 08:21:21
Where do you get this lunacy from Harry?

Coutinho and Lallana both have scored a goal each, and Lallana has assisted once. We have only scored 6, so that's a relatively decent return so far. The right manager would free up one one of Henderson or Milner or have them take turn going forward, and then they would score goals too.

24 Sep 2015 09:21:30
AG

How would you free up Milner and Henderson when you don't play with a natural DM. What are you talking mate.

How did we conceed yeserday? where were our midfidlers positioned then they ran past half length of the pitch through the middle?

{Ed001's Note - they should be able to take it in turns to get forward.}

24 Sep 2015 09:48:50
ED01, Exactly what we don't have it atm. I have been just assessing our midfidlers and only midfilders and we simply don't have that quality with us.

Can - Will run half way through the pitch but doenst know what to do with the ball. Lack of intellegence

Milner - Catches the camera more than any other player, Work hard but its so easy to Nutmugg him. He simply cannot control the game from the midfiled, nor dictate it.

Lucas - You are asking too much from a player whose primary duty is to break up the play,. Expecting him to dictate the play is stupid.

Allen - VIce versa of Lucas, Good on the ball but would be only effective if played alongside a top class DM.

Henderson - What exactly his role is still a mystry just like Gerrard, Played at no of positions. At times he looks like VIdal, But Vidal is just a B2B player.

Rossitter - My only hope among the midfilders. Good on the ball, calm and composed. Except his physique he is the only player a good manager would play in our midfield.

{Ed001's Note - the problem is not the lack of quality of the players, it is the way they are being used.}

24 Sep 2015 11:17:52
What are you talking about. Lucas is the starting DM and when Lucas, Milner and Henderson play together in the centre (and I feel they shouldn't) they the two more attack minded players - Milner and Henderson should be allowed the license to go and influence the play higher up the pitch instead of asking the two wide players (Coutinho and Lallana let's say) to come in all the time.

The personnel are not the major issue here but the manager whose tactics are not having an influence on our own players and as a result is not translating onto the pitch in performances. This constant BS about LFC NOT having this player or that player is nonsensical and tedious. What the F makes you think Schneiderlin would have come to LFC over Man Utd as an example constant bleating we hear from you?

23 Sep 2015 23:56:21
I'm completely done with BR lads. I cannot stick him as manager for another day. I've been a big supporter of FSG, but they really dropped the ball in not parting with Rodgers over the summer, and they should rectify that by calling Rodgers to negotiate the pay off right now.

I made no secret of the fact that I wanted Rodgers out and Klopp or Rafa in over the summer, but I was prepared to let him prove me wrong. More than that, once it was clear he was going to be in charge for this season, I desperately wanted to be proven wrong because it would've meant a successful season for us. You think I want to watch us serve up that garbage just so I can say "See? I was right, we should've gotten Rafa!"? because I don't. No one does.

But there's been no improvement from last season, it's actually getting worse. The team is tactically & structurally flawed going into every game. We're too slow, too static and create almost nothing in terms of chances every game, no matter who we play and what formation we play them in. Most of our players look like they haven't a clue what they're meant to be doing. We are as bad as we were under Roy Hodgson at this stage, and if it continues, we're looking at finishing in the bottom half. He has to bloody go.

Ed002's a sensible person and has probably forgotten more about football than most people will ever know in the first place, and wisely cautions against us wanting a knee-jerk sacking with no follow up plan in place. But how long can we sustain these farcical performances in the hope that something will fall into place for a few games?

I never believed that coming to within 2 points of the league was all down to Suarez because I just don't think stuff like that is possible, but everything Rodgers has done since then is making me seriously rethink that.

24 Sep 2015 06:28:30
Fair enough. I knew the start of the season could be tough considering the fixture list, but home performances against supposedly "lesser" teams have been woeful. Could you imagine how we'd be laughing if Manutd or Chelski or even Everton were taken to penalties against a fourth tier outfit? Mental.

24 Sep 2015 06:47:12
We had 47 attempts on goal and 16 on target.

24 Sep 2015 06:54:47
Liverpool benefitted massively that season. No Europe. United were clinically dead. Chelsea were good but had no worthy striker.

If Rodgers didn't ask Bielsa for help, would we have made that title run? No. the tactic was wonderful while it lasted, but only had temporary effect because it almost solely banked on Suarez' firepower.

We could go on about the impressive start to the season, but those first 3 games were eerily similar to this season. Not many goals, clean sheets, and ugly. Ugly wins. No one was blown off the park.

24 Sep 2015 07:56:08
the wonder season counted on a few linked things.
1. Having a PAIR of attacking players who equally scared people. Meaning they couldn't mark one out of the game.
2. Having a PAIR of goal scorers who can play off quick longer possession with pace and skill and finishing.
3. Being able to score more than the opposition so not having to change our defence.
4. Having one other player who could score double figures.

We now have just 1 up front. That main player isn't either of 1 or 2. Our defence hasn't been improved. It foundered that season (Palace was just the point where the Keegan style philosophy was finally exposed beyond doubt). And we don't have anyone reaching double figures at all.

I've been a supporter of Rogers, don't like the name calling of the guy on here and think he can be a really good manager. BUT he has shown he isn't going to learn about the fact he needs to have more than one threat up front (last season showed that). Isn't going to learn that the defence needs a stronger make up. Isn't going to learn that our formations don't work against teams and we need to mix it up.

The squad, that he has put together, bar the need for either top class centre backs or giving Sakho/Gomez more of a run, is a top 4 squad. The tactics aren't working and form isn't what players are being selected on. That is the sign of someone who has reached the end of the road. I honestly think a top level new manager, who has been watching the squad and brings a change of approach would pay dividends. However long term we still need to sort out the centre of defence and midfield.

24 Sep 2015 08:40:02
I personally couldn't believe we didn't make a change during the summer.

Now we have put ourselves in a more difficult position.

You really have to wonder what FSG are doing.

The people running the club are apparently Gordon and Ayres? Who, exactly, are these people? What do they know about football?

This is one of the most famous clubs in the history of football. This is the best we can do?

Very little our club does makes sense anymore.

24 Sep 2015 08:43:19
We had 47 attempts but has many chances did we create. Most were just hopeful shots from the edge of the area, coutinho must of had about 10