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20 Dec 2017 22:21:34
Hi Ed's.
I'm sure it's been said that de vrig has signed a new contract with Lazio a couple of weeks back.
Now I'm reading that maybe he hasn't.
Do you have any info on this either way please?
Thanks in advance.
{Ed002's Note - No there is no agreement. I don’t know why you think there is.}
20 Dec 2017 20:38:07
Still think it makes no sense to sell coutinho in Jan if the rumours are true that a fee has been agreed (been reading that nonsense months now) . More reports saying lemar favours us over Chelsea and arsenal (why wouldn't he) in Jan but in my opinion we should be buying lemar and keeping coutinho for the simple reason lemar is cup tied in champions league and to sell coutinho would damage our hopes in my opinion of going far in the tournament or possibly doing another miracle like 2005.
20 Dec 2017 20:51:15
Why keep him when he doesn't want to be here? and don't give me because he's under contract still, contracts mean bugger all in today's world. The players have a lot of power and he wants out, we need to accept it, get rid and move on.
20 Dec 2017 20:46:54
Monaco got knocked out didn't they?
I think I'm right in saying you can register one new player to your Champions league squad, even if they've appeared for another team. The catch is, the team they played for must have been knocked out in the group stages.
I'm sure that's right anyway. Though i could be wrong.
20 Dec 2017 21:32:33
Ir89. He wants to go mate. We need to sell and move on from him. Lemar will be a hard one to get done going by other interested parties and as ed said other clubs already chasing him so have an advantage. Couts won't leave in Jan anyhow.
20 Dec 2017 21:53:49
Id only let him leave if we can get a replacement in. For me we need to keep his quality around until the summer, he hasn't been busting a gut but his immense quality is there for all to see.
20 Dec 2017 22:09:18
Cou will leave and not much can be done to stop that. It is only a matter of when, Jan or the summer.
20 Dec 2017 22:23:29
The point is. even a 80% coutinho is still more creative than anyone else in our midfield.
World cup year. the club need to sit down with him and tell him it will happen in the summer. even get a deal struck like we have with kieta. happy coutinho. no disruption. and plenty of time to replace.
20 Dec 2017 22:31:21
redphil - That's right mate, I agree with that.
20 Dec 2017 22:58:34
Except you can tell he’s trying not to get himself injured. No tracking back or tackling.
21 Dec 2017 07:12:11
I think if we can get the Lemar deal over the line in Jan, he’ll probably go, otherwise I’m not sure Couts will leave in Jan, it will probably be in the summer.
21 Dec 2017 07:32:55
To all those with short memories, we were doing perfectly well without Coutinho at the start of the season when he was feigning injury as he didn’t want to play for us. Why on earth would you, as fans of this club, want to keep a player that will not give his all for it? The sooner he goes the better. He should have gone in the summer.
21 Dec 2017 08:16:09
I'd prefer him to leave in January. Does he even get into our team if everyone if fit? Offensively he's still been top class, but defensively we're playing with 10 men. Can anyone remember the last time he made a tackle? I'm struggling. I'd have Mane, Firmino, Salah, Chamberlain, Lallana and Henderson as out front 6 once Lallana is fully fit. Coutinho is a passenger who offsets every Bournemouth performance, with a West Brom performance. You can't carry a player who picks and chooses when they want to try.
Move him along and go and blow everyone out the water for Lemar! They want €90m? Just slap €100m on the table and be done with it (as we'll have more like €150m from the Coutinho sale)
I know its not that simple but I'm speaking metaphorically! Monies will be there, Lemar is interested in us, we are interested in him. Just pay the asking price so everyone can move on! Liverpool FC need to stop complicating matters by over pricing their own players, and under valuing everyone else's.
21 Dec 2017 08:54:30
The difference it MK, largely due to his shop-windowing antics, you can at least be guarenteed he will be bringing it in games like Arsenal where the world watches. And if we get further then the next round in the Champions League, we will be needing every player who will do that.
21 Dec 2017 09:00:16
I agree hjikle, but surely Brandt or Lemar will also bring it in the big games?
I hope Coutinho knuckles down and starts putting in effort off the ball, and being less selfish on it, but i can't see it myself. He will get his move and a WC place regardless of his form in the second half of the season. He just needs to put in one performance in May just to remind everyone he is still world class, and he'll get everything his own way.
21 Dec 2017 10:08:48
I'm sure they will but but wouldn't they be cup tied in the Champions League?
21 Dec 2017 10:28:16
No mate. You can register one cup tied player from another CL team, as long as the club the club you sign them from have been knocked out.
So for example we could register Lemar because Monaco went out, but Barcelona couldn't register Coutinho because we went through.
{Ed002's Note - No.}
21 Dec 2017 12:30:37
MK, does Couts get into our team when everyone's fit? He's the second name on the team sheet. If we sell Couts in Jan and replace him with Lemar we are making the team worse. Couts is here till the summer.
21 Dec 2017 11:26:54
Could you explain it please Ed002? 😂 sorry mate, but these Uefa rules are not worded in laymans terms and I'm just a poor boy from a poor family (scaramoush, scaramoush)
{Ed002's Note - A player may not play in UEFA Champions League and Europa League for more than one club in the same season except where they played for one club in the qualifying competition (pre-Group stage) and then moved. And I dispise Queen more than any other group.}
21 Dec 2017 11:52:39
I think that's only if they were in the Europa League (and possibly qualifiers), once you've played in the CL you're cup tied in the CL.
{Ed002's Note - No.}
21 Dec 2017 16:06:59
Cheers Ed! Thanks for clarifying.
But despising Queen? 😮 i thought you were perfect until now. Ed025 is my new favourite blue!
{Ed025's Note - and i thought freddy was one of if not THE best front man ever MK..
21 Dec 2017 20:31:16
Adam, just checked out the rules for registering new players, and quoted below. Unfortunately, I think Lemar has played in the group stage for Monaco, hence in ineligible. But Ed002 in particular is probably best place to clarify:
"Adding players in the knockout rounds
For games in the knockout stages of either the Champions League or Europa League, a club can register up to three new players.
The new players must be communicated to UEFA by 11pm UK time on February 1. Squad lists are then locked in for all remaining games in the competition.
There are several guidelines clubs must follow when looking to add players.
A maximum of one player who has already played for another club in UEFA competition in the same season can be registered.
But they must not have played in the group stage of the competition a new club is trying to register them for, nor can they be registered if their previous club is still in the same competition.
Any of the three players added can have played in the qualifying rounds or play-off stage for another club. This isn't a barrier to being registered by a new club. "
20 dec 2017 19:10:03
ed001. are you around tonight?
{Ed002's Note - I am afraid not.}
20 Dec 2017 19:14:06
Is there anyway I can contact him? Im landing in Dubai on Friday morning so was just wondering
Thanks for your time 002.
{Ed002's Note - He is asleep.
20 Dec 2017 18:12:10
Just wondered what people's thoughts were?
If klopp continues with his rotation policy who's turn is it to get a rest and who can we expect to start given it's a tough away game v arsenal?
20 Dec 2017 20:48:23
I think the team should be same back four as the last game with Henderson Ox, Coutinho in midfield and a front three of Sarah, Firmino, Mane Ox offers so much more in midfield than Gini or Can seems to have more bite and drive in his game.
20 Dec 2017 21:22:51
Thanks slippers
I think that is probably the best team available I can see him resting one of the 'fab four'though and maybe starting Milner in midfield.
Not my choice!
20 Dec 2017 22:13:43
Disagree, RDP. Milner should be nowhere near midfield in a game where we need CM's who can press, harry and put pressure on Arsenal's mid's with relentless passion. Milner does not fit that bill and never has. He does a lot of aimless running which anyone could see by watching the Spurs and Chelsea game where he was bang awful.
As for the lineup, play that CM with Hendo and Ox who can do the above functions to perfection with maybe Can in for Wiji. The back 5 should be intact from the B'mouth game and the front line should stay the same as well with Mane fresh to come on and finish them off on the counter provided we are leading.
21 Dec 2017 01:19:12
Almost all the games where we have played poorly have been the ones when milner has played centre mid. I admire his effort and professionalism but every action he takes on a football pitch looks like he is running in treacle.
21 Dec 2017 08:55:51
I think the back 4 will be the same, but TAA for Gomez is possible. Fab 4 all start with Can and Wiji. Not what I'd go for but I suspect it will be klopps line-up.
21 Dec 2017 09:15:11
It'll be the same team that smashed Bournemouth i would hope. They've had 5 days rest. That's more than some Arsenal players have had. Maybe Mane in for Coutinho and Karius in for Mignolet. I could stomach that i guess.
Play the best team against Arsenal, and we can rotate for the Swansea game on Boxing day. Manager-less Swansea is a much more sensible game for resting people than Arsenal away from home.
20 Dec 2017 17:29:29
Eds, any idea what the club have planned for young Brewster? Be nice to see him on the bench perhaps at some point or are we liklely to lose him to another club soon?
{Ed002's Note - He is just a kiddie who still attends school and cannot be loaned out. There are clubs interested in taking him when he turns 18. The club will want to keep him.}
20 Dec 2017 17:56:30
Thanks Ed002. Just thinking how Fowler and Owen were first team regulars at a similar age and wondering if Brewster may end up making a career elsewhere if we don't give him a first team opportunity soon.
{Ed002's Note - You think Liverpool should start playing a 17 year old so he doesn't leave for a career elsewhere? Other clubs play kids when they see that they are ready to step up - I would be surprised if Liverpool started to play them just to keep them happy.}
20 Dec 2017 18:47:39
Very good player but miles away from being ready, u23's are his level for now. let him get used to that level first. He might be ready for a few appearances in the cups next season but he looks the part. great group the u18's this year.
20 Dec 2017 20:02:47
Bit harsh Ed002, was only pointing out that we never used to be afraid of using a young player - if he's really not ready for the 1st team yet then fair enough but if other clubs are sniffing around then perhaps they do think he's ready and if that's the case it would be stupid of Liverpool to let him walk away without having given him a chance.
{Ed002's Note - As long as the club are happy to take a risk over results they can play who ever they want.}
20 Dec 2017 20:31:51
What clubs? he's 17.he would struggle for game time in the Championship never mind the Premier League. Juventus have been mentioned on here but does anyone think with the forwards they have that Brewster would be any better off there?
{Ed002's Note - And Dortmund - try the search engine.}
20 Dec 2017 20:49:21
Same applies to them as Juve, would be well down the pecking order. Young Sancho isn't exactly getting much gametime there is he.
{Ed002's Note - You don’t understand.}
20 Dec 2017 21:01:30
Same as Juve at Dortmund. just look at Sancho.
20 Dec 2017 21:14:24
Enlighten me.
{Ed002's Note - Clubs look around to find the young talent - Dortmund have approach sera English sides about play. Whilst the Liverpool fans think just about all of theiir players are rubbish, other clubs don’t and both are able to provide players with a planned development path something Liverpool Dre unable to do.}
20 Dec 2017 21:20:02
Surely it comes down to the lads attitude. If he has a good head on his shoulders and realises that he needs to learn his trade and wait for his opportunity when it comes, then he'll be fine at Liverpool for a while yet. If he gets to an age where he feels ready for the next step but doesn't see himself getting at here, then he has a decision to make. That decision is surely a few years down the track.
{Ed002's Note - He’s already moved once to because the opportunities might be better. Why do you think he left Chelsea after 7 years or whatever.}
20 Dec 2017 21:35:39
World of differene between Liverpool and Chelsea. young players just don't get a chance there whereas Klopp has proved himself to be a great manager for young players to be around. just look at Solanke, highly rated by everyone in football yet going nowhere at Chelsea, a couple of months at Liverpool he's starting merseyside derbies and getting in England squads.
21 Dec 2017 07:18:37
I’m not a Chelsea fan but some they have the best youth set up imo you just need to look at some other the growing coming through.
I agree with you Big Emre regarding their futures. Mourinho was the biggest culprit for not promoting the youth.
21 Dec 2017 08:59:21
It's also worth pointing out that when the likes of Owen and Fowler were coming through, anyone could choose to leave school the second they hit 16 in principal. Now they have to remain in education at least part time until they are 18. Together with the UEFA (FIFA? ) rules about the contracts young players are allowed, it is pointless comparing today with the start of the PL era, it's just too different legally to matter.
20 Dec 2017 15:59:02
Hi ed002, I was reading your comments below about work permits and was curious to your thoughts.
I am a Yankee across the pond and work permits are never an issue in sports here. If you can play, then Uncle Sam wants you more than the working man/ woman. Which is a shame at times but it does make for entertaining sports.
What is your take on the English work permit system? It seems to be very difficult to get one for foreign players (especially youngsters) . What changes, if any, would you make?
{Ed002's Note - It has varied over the years and is very different for sport than it is for, say, people like me. The system for football used to be based an a number of criteria but has been replaced by a points based system. The player needs a minimum of four points and summary goes something like this:
- The value of the transfer fee (alone) that is to be paid is between the top 75% and 100% of all transfers to Premier League clubs in the previous 2 windows - 3 points
- The value of the transfer fee being paid for the player is between 50% and 75% of all transfers to Premier League clubs in the previous 2 windows - 2 points
- The basic wage (excluding bonuses) being paid to the player by the new club is in the top 25% of the top 30 earners at the club - 3 points
- The basic wage (excluding bonuses) being paid to the player by the new club is between 50% and 75% of all the top 30 earners at the club - 2 points
- Subjectively, the player’s current club is in a recognised "top" league and the player has played in 30% or more of the available domestic league minutes - 1 point
- The player’s existing club has played in the group stages or onwards of the Champions League, Europa League or the Copa Libertadores within the last 12 months and the player has played in 30% or more of the available domestic league minutes - 1 point
}
20 Dec 2017 18:17:39
It’s kinda a shame there’s so much emphasis on costs. Seems to me it keeps the league from people like Rickie Lambert (who aren’t British) .
Thank you for the response ed.
{Ed002's Note - I don't understand - Lambert is English as far as I know.}
20 Dec 2017 20:05:11
Rickie Lambert is definitely English, he scored the winner against Scotland on his debut if I remember correctly.
20 Dec 2017 20:23:29
THAts my point. Unless you’re an English person like Rickie Lambert it’s going to b hard to work your way from the bottom through England.
{Ed002's Note - so you would rather give a chance to a Peruvian fourth division player over Englishman Lambert?}
20 Dec 2017 23:20:12
No I’m not saying that ed. I get the national pride of having your own people in your own league more than others. But making it simply about costs means players who don’t have that sort of footballing environment to grow up in have little chance of getting in a good one. I’m quite ignorant of how a lot of it works, it just seems like things are a bit strict.
{Ed002's Note - I would love le to answer you but just don’t know the quit.}
21 Dec 2017 03:24:15
You lost me there ed lol.
{Ed002's Note - It was my iPAd keyboard playing up. What it said was I would love to be able to help but I don't understand your question.}
21 Dec 2017 16:08:53
Ah there’s no question ed I just wanted your thoughts on the whole matter and you provided them. I didn’t realize work permit criteria is as diverse as it is. Seems though they are usually money related, there are various ways to get a permit at least.
{Ed002's Note - There is still an exceptions route - that was used for Grujic for example.}
20 Dec 2017 15:34:26
Bit of ridiculous trivial information for anyone who cares! Liverpool have won more games 7-0 this season, than they have won 1-0 😂.
20 Dec 2017 17:33:33
We have actually won 7-0 home and away this season. Even City can't match that.
{Ed025's Note - you have also drew and been beaten by some dreadful teams brover...city cant match that either mate..
20 Dec 2017 17:35:38
Really?
Thought it was one of each?
20 Dec 2017 18:07:27
Drew dreadful teams certainly, but not lost to any yet.
20 Dec 2017 19:03:31
I think Liverpool have won 7-0 twice Ron, against Maribor and Moscow.
20 Dec 2017 17:44:03
They can Ed, they drew at home to you too. ;)
{Ed025's Note - yeah but we are the mighty everton smp.. :)
20 Dec 2017 18:43:42
I think Ed 025 was a bit hasty with that reply, only 2 losses mate Spurs and City.
{Ed025's Note - i was hoping it was more den..
20 Dec 2017 19:04:42
you know ed25 he said this season we lost 3 games city, spurs and leicester in the cup really dreadful teams like you said.
{Ed025's Note - throw me a bone will you I2TM, im trying to make myself feel better about this season, wheres your compassion man!!!?.. :)
20 Dec 2017 20:31:15
Fairly sure we have only lost to city and spurs this season ed025, unless you think they are awful. Only really awful teams we have drawn to are everton and west brom.
{Ed025's Note - dont forget leicester AW....i know...im clutching at straws mate..
20 Dec 2017 21:23:35
Good banter as usual Ed025. If only Ed002 had your sense of humour :)
{Ed002's Note - do have his sense of humour, by he is far more tolerant of the ididiod and, what I would call, the Ordinaries.}
20 Dec 2017 23:53:54
You’re right Rover, for some reason I had it in my head that we conceded against Maribor. ðŸ¤.
20 Dec 2017 21:59:36
Ay i forgot about leicester ed025,although i suppose the only way to stay unbeaten in the cups is to win every single one of them! Even the mighty reds have to get beat some time mate.
While you're around ed025, was wondering if you could tell us of the everton perspective on rooneys season? didn't realise he was on 10 goals til today.
{Ed025's Note - i suppose it could be marked as a B+ AW, i was one who did not want him back and up until recently i believe i was right, he was trying too hard and popping up everywhere disrupting things all over the pitch, he seems to have found a niche now as a deeper lying midfielder and has scored goals so it looks like i may have been a bit hasty with my views, it could be that i dont like him as a person so my judgement on him will always be clouded mate..
20 Dec 2017 22:19:13
Which dreadful team did we lose to Ed25? City? Spurs? Now I agree we did draw some dreadful teams. One in particular across the park. What's that club's name again, Ed25?
{Ed025's Note - its everton brover who are very poor side your right, we will win the same as liverpool this season though mate..
20 Dec 2017 22:33:46
Fair enough. u.
21 Dec 2017 00:09:28
sorry ed25 your right i should have shown some compassion, i think your team has been listening to D'ream lately. things can only get better
inspiration found where needed hey.
OH and a BIG well done to bristol city made my week.
{Ed025's Note - yeah i enjoyed that mate..
20 Dec 2017 15:12:57
Hi Ed01, considering the role Chamberlain played against Bournemouth last weekend. Do you think Klopp will eventually replace Wijnaldum with him. He certainly offered a lot from the central midfield that day. Never seen Gini being influential like that.
{Ed001's Note - I hope so, I do think he would like to use him more centrally, that was what was intimated when he signed him. So it would make sense.}
20 Dec 2017 15:25:44
Thanks a lot Ed01.
{Ed001's Note - very welcome.}
20 Dec 2017 15:32:14
I was a massive advocate of signing Chamberlain. But i wanted him because he could cover numerous positions and provide pace if Mane/ Salah was absent (Or even just as an impact player off the bench) .
I was absolutely gobsmacked by his performance at the weekend. It looks like in the last 3 months Klopp has worked with him and unearthed abilities Wenger had completely stifled. Some of the tackles and interceptions he made were fantastic. His passing was very incisive and creative too, but most importantly, he drove us forward at every opportunity. No standing still taking excess touches, no playing it safe etc. Just pure, relentless attacking intent. Something we've not had in midfield since (dare i say it) Gerrard lost his legs. Chamberlain needs to add goals and consistency if he ever wants to achieve his aim of replicating the career of his idol though. He's got a hell of a long way to go yet.
Long may it continue though. It wouldn't be his first false dawn of his career. Hopefully this time is different. The prospect of having him and Keita running at the opposition and snapping into tackles next season is frightening. He has to make that performance his usual standard though. Touch wood!
{Ed001's Note - to be fair, when he was bought by Arsenal he was seen as a centre mid, at times he played there and played well but was never given the chance to hold down a place because the golden child Jack Wheelchair had to play on those two days he was fit and Arsenal lacked width. I am still not convinced it was worth paying all that for a player in the last year of his contract when we needed a centre back though. If he had been an add on after getting one, then fine, but he wasn't.}
20 Dec 2017 15:55:36
But he’s just been so much more efficient in forward positions ed. And lord knows that’s a dangerous thing to add to our midfield at the moment: more forward play.
I think he starts against arsenal though.
{Ed001's Note - he will chase back though and is happy to put in the work so why not? When you consider just how bad Wijnaldum has been this season, it has to be worth a go.}
20 Dec 2017 17:36:58
Early days for him.
20 Dec 2017 17:58:41
Jack Wheelchair lol.
20 Dec 2017 18:42:32
Love this convo Ed and MK. I was not a Chambo fan when he was being signed and really, I did not want him here. However, I was willing to surppot him as he was one of ours now and he has been solid on the whole tho a lot more needs to be done. Klopp knows what he is doing and he has or may have unearthed a very good player in the Ox. We shall see.
20 Dec 2017 20:24:52
Hard to argue with that 001. I’ve been one of Gini’s Biggest supporters but he’s been poor lately.
{Ed001's Note - I have been trying to avoid criticising him in my match reviews because I never rated him before we bought him, so thought I might be just trying to see the 'I was right' in him. However he just isn't performing and it is the same week after week.}
21 Dec 2017 07:34:06
Oh don’t get me wrong I didn’t understand the need I sign him either, it’s just prior to this season he had his moments. This season he’s had one good game that I can think of. I am not Emre can’s biggest fan, but I realize he’s got a lot of potential still. I think he’s definitely worth keeping over Gini. Whether we could convince him or not is another matter.
20 Dec 2017 15:07:26
just a shout out for the team and defence we conceded 16 goals in our first 9 premiership matches and only 4 in our last 9 matches well done lads.
20 Dec 2017 15:15:27
The definition of improvement.
20 Dec 2017 18:44:13
But the media will definitely not focus on that as that would mean they were wrong to slate Klopp after Spurs.
20 Dec 2017 20:45:31
THAt is really good too read and know whatever he has done we do seem bit more secure which is really good news, although I hope and suspect not that we don’t stop at purchasing CB or two though.
20 Dec 2017 13:21:11
Reading a reply from ED02 that Salah is already pushing for a move to Real Madrid. He's not here a wet week for goodness sake.
20 Dec 2017 13:27:36
Relax he's going nowhere.
20 Dec 2017 14:36:05
I'm not budging don't you worry.
20 Dec 2017 09:00:32
Ed02 thanks for that fascinating insight into the business side of the club, something that I guess most fans know little about. Just a couple of follow up questions if that's ok?
Your para on wresting power back from the players - I'm guessing that these are not specifically LFC issues but rather a wider issue in football? In particular, image rights and non sponsored flimsy boots. Would a 'marquee' signing like Julian Brandt want to join a club that added such addenda to contracts?
Loan liaison - this seems to me to the easiest to fix if LFC wants to. The club has many ex players acting as ambassadors who could fulfil this role. Chelsea seem to have this in place whereas we don't which seems shocking. Does it need to be initiated by a manager or the club?
{Ed002's Note - Thanks. (a) Right, it is a much larger issue than just Liverpool. Young players want immediate success at the highest level and make outrageous wage demands. PLayers arrive with endorsements from businesses that are often at odds with club sponsors. PLayers do make demands about playing time and in some cases make demands about as diverse subjects as religion and the need to be respected. Others have refused to play when they are looking to leave, some approach other clubs - and so it goes. (b) Yes many ex-players fulfil such a role but these are typically not the "ambassadors" who don't actually work for the club on that sort of basis. It needs a structure and it needs a plan. It also needs each player and prospective player to be given a development plan. It is something a proper DoF would put in place.}
20 Dec 2017 10:47:50
totally not related to the post, but man that o is so small when a capital D and F is used that i often only see DF.
20 Dec 2017 08:53:10
It is interesting to read about our interest in right back, Sime Vrsaljko. He sounds very similar to Joe Gomez in that he can comfortably play at both centre back, and right back. Gomez is more of a centre back though.
With the way Klopp has our back 4 morphing into a back 3 at times (by utilising this trait from Gomez) he has made us much more solid at the back. I wonder if that is the logic behind the interest in Vrsaljko? As he is a right back who can play centre back, unlike Gomez who is a centre back who can play right back, Vrsaljko could be an ideal foil to allow Gomez to move more centrally. Vrsaljko would (on paper) be capable of playing a right/ centre back hybrid role.
I will be honest, I've never seen Vrsaljko play. I've read some reviews and watched highlights, but never seen a full 90 minutes. According to reviews though he is a very good defender, and i can't imagine a more difficult job than trying to break into the Atletico Madrid team! Juanfran, Giminez, Godin are all world class defenders who have built up a real strong unit over the last 5 years. Breaking that apart would take someone truly special!
It might be a more realistic option to sign a right back and move Gomez into the centre to be honest. Top centre backs are at a Premium right now and January is a very tough time to buy. Vrsaljko is not first choice at his current side though so could be a very realistic option for January. If we could get Vrsaljko AND De Vrij, that would be fantastic in my opinion, but that's a big ask for January window though.
20 Dec 2017 09:04:23
I agree with that MK good post mate.
20 Dec 2017 09:09:44
why De Vrij? is he not injury prone? . i would like us to go for Koubaly.
20 Dec 2017 08:59:47
Vrsaljko - I also have never seen him play but it does sound like a wise move going for him with your reasons MK, if he is highly rated I'm happy with it. This rumour, I'm guessing is legit and that we are looking at bringing him in or? Does any of the Eds see this as a realistic move?
{Ed002's Note - Try the search engine please - it has been addressed.}
20 Dec 2017 09:18:10
Koubaly would also be my preferred preference over De Vrij.
20 Dec 2017 09:22:45
I think you make a good point about signing De Vrij and Vrsaljko, since playing Gomez alongside De Vrij would balance our his lack of pace, but De Vrij has top level experience and is widely accepted as a decent centre back. Certainly if those two can be brought in for less than the price quoted for van Dijk then that’s a result of sorts. Still leaves the problem of our weak centre midfield and what to do about Can.
20 Dec 2017 09:43:21
Ok apologies Ed2, will do mate.
20 Dec 2017 09:48:36
De Vrij hasn't been injury prone for a couple of years now. Plus he is a calm head, and a leader.
Koulibaly is a loose cannon, in that he will make rash decisions that don't always come off. He is a monster defensively on a good day; the sort of player strikers fear. He is also useless on the ball though. His style of play reminds me very much of Sakho. Sakho was better on the ball, and Koulibaly has more pace to make up for getting caught on the wrong side of play when a rash decision doesn't pay off. I paid close attention to him against Manchester City and i wasn't that impressed to be honest.
De Vrij suits our needs better in my opinion. As does Howedes, even. Our recruitment team has clearly identified that we need a steady leader at the back, who is good in the air and can organise us at set pieces. Koulibaly, VVD etc are not that. They're individuals, rather than players who knit the defence together as a unit. Honestly, i think if Lovren was playing next to Raul Albiol he'd probably look as good a Koulibaly!
It's just my opinion though mate. I just think that if you are going to have a player like Lovren who will always try to nip in ahead of the striker, the other defender needs to be intelligent enough to drop just in case it goes wrong. VVD and Koulibaly won't do that. They'll probably be doing the exact same thing as Lovren!
Klavan (whilst doing a commendable job alongside Lovren right now) is 32 years old and will still struggle against serious pace. Matip is just a passenger at times who offers nothing defensively and is purely a ball playing centre back. He deliberately avoids defensive work and is our worst defender in my views. He doesn't even care enough to track back or help out an 19 year old right back.
Gomez and De Vrij would be a good partnership. Gomez at 20 years old won't play every game, and i have faith that De Vrij has the leadership qualities to seamlessly partner either of Klavan or Lovren when Joe is rested or rotated.
VVD just got dropped for Southampton because he's so poor, and Koulibaly is profiting from playing in a very good team who don't have to defend a lot. Against Man City when he had to defend, he was exposed. I'd steer well clear to be honest. On paper he looks like the ideal man. Quick, strong, tall, solid tackler etc. He just lacks composure.
20 Dec 2017 10:03:20
That's a great point Dennis. If Gomez was at centre back with Vrsaljko and De Vrij, he'd have two very organised and experienced players alongside him. In various places i researched Vrsaljko, a lot of them highlighted he rarely makes errors and that in terms of positioning, concentration and tracking runners he is on point. The only worry is most places also highlighted he is a no nonsense player who just looks to get rid. Maybe that's what we need at times? A player who isn't afraid to just put their foot through the ball rather than try and play it out in silly situations.
As well as Gomez being quick, so is Vrsaljko from the highlights i found. Between them, I'm sure they could cover De Vrij's lack of pace. Though that is over exaggerated a lot. He's not exactly slow. I'd say he's as quick as Lovren is and definitely quicker than Klavan.
20 Dec 2017 10:36:52
De Vrij has missed 63 games injured from 15/ 16 season good defender but maybe risky in a more physical league.
Howedes was Matips partner at Schalke and whilst I haven't checked I believe it was a reasonable partnership. A full German international traditionally solid at the back would be my shout.
20 Dec 2017 11:25:30
NWred, those numbers are skewed buddy. De Vrij missed the entire 15/ 16 season with a knee ligament injury. Since returning to fitness he's only had one muscle/ joint related injury. He tore his abductor muscle and missed 2 games about a month ago. Last season he did miss 7 games with a broken metatarsal, but that is not really a concern. A broken foot can happen to anyone, and impact injuries are more luck related, than they are down to general strength of the body. As far as i can find, that is the only major bone break in his career. So there is no real concerns over his bone strength either.
In contrast, Howedes has missed 16 games this season already, with a re-occurring thigh muscle injury. His body is deteriorating. Whilst he would be a great option if he is fully fit, i am concerned that it could be another year before he gets over his current troubles. Even then, how long before another muscle goes? He's into his 30's now and recovery time is much longer. Whilst resting one muscle, the others weaken. It's a vicious circle.
Just be careful with injury stats. If you take a sample of the last 3 seasons, Howedes is statistically less injury prone than De Vrij. However in more recent times Howedes has seen his body fail him, and De Vrij is getting fitter and missing less games every season.
20 Dec 2017 11:56:42
I'll give you that MK, your knowledge is impressive mate :)
20 Dec 2017 13:03:33
I wish my fiancée was that appreciative, Salah. I quote, "All you ever do is watch football, go on that bloody Liverpool site, or try and talk to me about football".
If it gets any worse, I'll have to start cutting down on the time i spend with her.
20 Dec 2017 13:26:55
Adam - just explain hiw good she has got it, and you have decided not to start playing golf after all. That’s at least 2 full days a week when you aren’t out on the course. I used that one and it worked a treat.
20 Dec 2017 14:01:43
Cheers Nick 😂 I'll I've it a shot!
20 Dec 2017 14:12:59
I get what you say but it is 2 abductor muscle injuries for De Vrij.
Quality centre backs are rare unless they are injury prone if you want a suggestion for an organizer I would go for Ben Mee to be honest. He has made Keane look like a worldie, he is currently doing the same with Tarkowski, he is English rarely injured and I know he plays in a defensive setup, he has played left back in the season went 23 matches unbeaten to win promotion as champions. Sold my City with Trippier to Burnley he is a very good defender.
20 Dec 2017 14:24:30
I will agree with you there. Mee is so under rated it's criminal!
20 Dec 2017 18:49:04
I would take Ben Mee over De Vrij, any day. De Vrij is experienced BUT he lacks pace and has only come back from injury, a very devastating one at that. Before that, he was still injury prone and lacked pace so none of that will change post injury. I would take Mee or Koulibaly BUT definitely Mee as he is PL proven.