Liverpool Banter Archive July 01 2017

01 Jul 2017 22:36:56
Eds 002 if you have a second can you give me your opinion on FSG's attitude towards football transfers in English football. I don't understand their blatant disregard to transfers which is bordering on arrogance or worse ignorance. The perception from many is that they can do what they want and not have any accountability for their actions. It's tarnishing the reputation of our club which used to be so classy and proper when doing business. I live in the States and believe me they treat their beloved Boston Red Sox like a newborn baby. They have the 4th largest payroll in the MLB and spend perverse amounts on transfers but the distinction is they do their business in the MLB with decorum and no fuss. So why do they think that have no problem sullying the heritage, prestige, reputation of LFC? They seem to have this poisonous swagger that we as the fans have to pay the price for and suffer the consequences. Your feedback would be appreciated Eds 002.

{Ed002's Note - I would not blame FSG for this. They are the ones digging out the apo9logies.}

02 Jul 2017 00:04:33
I love our manager, but as I said before he arrived, and let's be honest, he is a bit of a clown, and he need to appreciate that this is not Germany, and that EVERY move is monitored closely by the gutter press who feed our insatiable demand for football news.

Ultimately, if we had the finances it wouldn't be a problem.

02 Jul 2017 00:17:41
Thanks for your reply 002. Are you inferring that this debacle is down to just one man? I'm incredulous that Klopp would be so naive and stupid to jeopardize our future?

{Ed002's Note - No. The owners do not do these things. I am not saying it is Klopp alone. Why do you want to keep bring this up.}

02 Jul 2017 10:05:50
Well said Ed002, this got boring weeks ago. Just move on.

01 Jul 2017 19:16:33
Hi ed001 if you're about. I was wondering what way you would line up next season in relation to the wingers with both Salah and Mane being RW. Would you play Mane at LW and Salah RW? I believe he has previously been played there?

Thanks.

{Ed001's Note - players move about on the pitch, I would give both of them freedom to roam personally.}

01 Jul 2017 19:55:25
2 players freedom to roam? surely that would disrupt the teams formation especially defensively. we would be slaughtered by the strong teams.

01 Jul 2017 22:03:31
desk - We have always had a fluid system under klopp. It's what he wants.

01 Jul 2017 23:17:02
We keep a formation when we haven't got the ball then as soon as we get it the front 3 especially are interchangeable.

01 Jul 2017 22:15:34
By roam I think ed means interchange as clever players will instinctively cover another players position when said player changes position. i. e. The front 3 move across the pitch creating space yet if we loose the ball they defend the area they are nearest ultimately changing positions whilst retaining the team shape.

02 Jul 2017 00:43:24
What's wrong with left footers playing left wing? Yes interchange and be fluid, but a decent left footed cross when teams park the bus is sometimes what's needed.
Don't tell me it's old fashioned, it's common sense.

02 Jul 2017 04:36:03
Interchange every so often, pulling the opponents defence all over the shop, causing confusion which will create space for the strikers.

I just hope we can strengthen the defence or we will be found out very quick in Europe, concede a messy goal at home gu2ves the opponent a huge boost with the away goal rule.

Time to wise up and man up back there .

03 Jul 2017 01:15:25
Burke in our and a lot of modern systems the responsibility of crossing seems to fall to the fullbacks on the overlap after wingers cut inside.

01 Jul 2017 15:54:48
Just a question ed's, if these reported rumours are true about naby keita agreeing terms which as a Liverpool fan myself I don't believe they are because of the amount of crap I read and nothing ever happens, what is the difference in this report to the way we delt with the VVD deal? Cause from what I have read we have not approached RBL atall yet so surely this is quite simular.

Another thing that is quite annoying is how can Chelsea sign players such as the German centre half they have just signed before it's even been published on the papers! It's absolutely ridiculous and embarrassing as a fan and for us to see the manner they deal with it its just continues and continues for months then 9/ 10 never happens.

{Ed001's Note - I am struggling to find any differences myself.}

01 Jul 2017 16:24:13
Am I right in thinking that if Jurgen Klopp decides he would like to sign a certain player. the first point of contact would be that players agent, in order to ascertain if the player would actually be open to a move.
If the player is keen on a move, is it ok for his agent to talk contracts and money with Liverpool without the knowledge of the players current club.

{Ed002's Note - No, that is not allowed. You are wasting your time if you are scratching around looking to try and justify the actions lof Liverpool and Klopp.}

01 Jul 2017 18:06:44
Not trying to justify anything. Just trying to understand how these transfer deals work.

{Ed002's Note - The process should be along the lines of: Clubs will typically informally ask an agent (a) if the player is going to be available, and (b) would the player consider a move to the club. There may be some broad discussion on the sort of deal that would be offered but no more than that. If the answer is yes, it is then necessary for the club to approach the player's club to ask if they would be willing to sell and if they would grant permission to speak to a player's agent formally about a transfer and possibly even the player about actually making a move. This will typically involve either broadly (through an offer) or actually agreeing a fee and responsibility for any significant costs (agents fees etc.). Once this has happened the club will be able to speak to the player's agent and perhaps the player himself to look at the package that will be involved. Many players are looked at and discussed at a high-level with agents and clubs; a subset of those have an offer placed; a subset of those involve discussions with the player's club; a subset of those involve discussions over terms, and; a subset of those go ahead.

Agents will often try and get more specific details of wages and other financials before they should - but most clubs are happy to follow this process. Players will often talk to other players about moves but, whilst wrong, is tolerated as it would be impossible to manage.}

01 Jul 2017 23:51:06
Thank you for explaining things. Much appreciated.

02 Jul 2017 00:35:19
Ed002's thanks for explaining things. it's much appreciated.

01 Jul 2017 12:52:47
Is the transfer window open today, or is it Monday?

💰💰💰.

{Ed002's Note - Today.}

01 Jul 2017 14:37:28
You mean it's open now and we haven't signed anyone!
What the hell.

01 Jul 2017 14:46:26
Bleedin joke this. I expected 3 signings by half ten this morning. What the funk?

01 Jul 2017 14:46:41
We have signed someone laughin2.

01 Jul 2017 13:50:16
Great news 😎
Thanks Ed 😘.

01 Jul 2017 18:59:14
Ron, you'll have to change your default post to 'the window doesn't close till September'

01 Jul 2017 18:12:47
I don't understand how transfer window is open today yet about 20+ deals have already been done involving premier league clubs in June.

{Ed002's Note - It is not possible to complete across border transfers before today.}

02 Jul 2017 00:25:21
Jk82, the transfers that have happened before today haven't been formally completed (despite being signed off by the players and clubs involved) . Salah and Solanke technically weren't Liverpool players until this morning.

02 Jul 2017 08:09:08
Cheers ed 002 and PutneyRed.

01 Jul 2017 12:36:05
Heard michael beale has resigned from sao Paulo. Do you reckon he could come back? Still has a house in the city and very well respected within the club.

{Ed002's Note - No idea I am afraid.}

01 Jul 2017 12:20:46
Very true Ed002. The statement did include that line. Maybe it's just me and I should stop taking any heed of Twitter rumours and ex players and journalists etc continously saying the Vvd deal could still happen. thanks for your reply👍.

{Ed002's Note - Of course it can still happen. If the club were will to make a humiliating U-turn and go back to Southampton with an offer of at least £70M and be willing to except any consequences.}

01 Jul 2017 14:02:14
Or maybe it will just happen as both the club and player want the move, and Pellegrino won't want to start the season with an unsettled cash cow who can be sold and the money reinvested to targets he wants.

{Ed002's Note - But Liverpool has withdrawn interest.}

01 Jul 2017 18:14:07
I understand that, but given LFCs behavior in regards to tapping up, I believe it has been shown that being up front and honest isn't exactly a virtue we're a paragon of.

I don't think it'd be out of the question for the club to attempt to negotiate despite the public withdrawal.

{Ed002's Note - Of corse they can. If the d it without the consent of the club then there will be yet another complaint.}

01 Jul 2017 11:09:17
I find it amazing we was going to pay however much for van dijk when the likes of rudiger and Manila's are available for half the price.

01 Jul 2017 11:41:20
But would they want to join us though? VVD did. Ludicrous price though I agree.

01 Jul 2017 11:42:49
Rüdiger is really injury prone. He was injured a total of 226 days in the last 2 years and he picked these up in a league that is far less physical then the PL.

{Ed002's Note - Cruciate Ligament injuries happen in many leagues.}

01 Jul 2017 11:45:46
Rudiger isn't actually very good, I'm presuming you've actually seen him?

01 Jul 2017 11:51:09
Mate, are they "available to Liverpool" for half the price?
Selling clubs adjust their asking price based on the customers. This fundamental concept is ignored by too many.
A premier league club with champions league participation is one of the richest customers and the asking price is adjusted accordingly.
Last time we were in the champions league, we tried to upgrade our squad by buying lots of decent players - Lallana, lambert, Lovren etc. We sold a world class player and bought a load of decent players who were not good enough for the champions league.
This time we are targeting quality over quantity. It costs more but ultimately will prove good value.

01 Jul 2017 12:58:37
He's playing on the Confederate cup over tah who most on here want.

01 Jul 2017 14:28:14
He went down with a hand to the chest by Hernandez faking injury when his team were already 3 up. Not what I want in a cb. Plus his hair is just watched too normal. No thanks.

01 Jul 2017 19:50:18
So a CB that is time-wasting is now a way to judge the talent of a player, Davey? Good grief! People saying Ruddiger had an injury. Sorry, VVD did not play the last 5 months of a season but he is not injury prone? Come on, these arguments don't make sense. The idea that a more polished and better CB, a current German international (VVD wouldn't make Germany's bench at CB) should cost 2 times less than an overrated and VVD, is flat out madness and is just illogical. If I was to pick btw the two, I know who I am not picking and that is VVD. People say "there are no better CB's out there than VVD so just pay the money". Well, Chelsea just lay waste to that argument by signing Ruddiger.

01 Jul 2017 20:30:42
Well said Brussels I'm afraid it's hard to say anything on his page anymore without being slated unless you encourage us to spend vast sums on average players. Keita yes vvd no thanks. I wouldn't give them 30 mil for him.

01 Jul 2017 09:54:24
Eds,

When we hear reports of someone agreeing personal terms before an official offer has been made. I'd that even possible? That would be tapping up surely wouldn't it? Is it just more tabloid rhetoric like 'preparing a bid'?

{Ed002's Note - It is not allowed to speak with a player without the permission of his club - that would be "tapping up". It is also not allowed to talk to an agent about that level of detail without the permissionh of his club - again "tapping up". It is morally abhorrent for a club to deliberately use the press to unsettle players in order to try and force the move - particularly "on the cheap".}

01 Jul 2017 10:21:46
Cheers Ed.

01 Jul 2017 10:27:47
I guess when it rains, it pours regarding this tapping up nonsense then, Ed.

{Ed002's Note - There is nothing new.}

01 Jul 2017 10:46:00
Before the hysteria kicks in, we don't know if the club has talked to Keita without RBL permission. You don't necessarily have to have a bid accepted to have permission to speak to a player, as far as I'm aware.

{Ed002's Note - If Liverpool has spoken with Keita it is WITHOUT THE PERMISSION OF HIS CLUB Ron.}

01 Jul 2017 11:07:09
Guaranga ed how do you do it? This page has been the same for the last 3 weeks just different people asking the same questions a different way. Take a break.

01 Jul 2017 11:27:21
i have been ignoring most reports since VVD, bt i must say the reports written about keita is looking exactly like VVD.

i just hope its journalists guessing. this shouldn't happen twice in a row.

01 Jul 2017 15:31:23
I also remember that salah had agreed personal terms before a fee was a gread and now reports saying kieta agred personeol terms and a fee has not BEEN submited yet sound foRmilia dosent it YNWA sorry about spelling.

01 Jul 2017 19:58:10
Regardless of wether or not Roma had accepted a bit for salah, doesn't mean the club hadn't given Liverpool permission to have talks with the player. Maybe they were confident of getting more money out of Liverpool and saw it as a way of prompting the higher offer after Liverpool knew the player wanted the move?

01 Jul 2017 19:52:23
It seemed like Salah was believed to have been tapped up as well but it seems we just paid what they wanted and the issue died or something like that. Can Ed02 pls, shed more light on this?

{Ed002's Note - Salah's agent used social media when negotiations were going on an Roma kicked his ass. He apologised and remarkably someone up their bid accordingly.}

01 Jul 2017 05:58:06
{Ed's Note - We have posted a new player profile about, Christian Benteke

01 Jul 2017 08:59:31
Good read and quite accurate.

{Ed001's Note - cheers. I think.}

01 Jul 2017 09:13:59
Lol sorry, genuinely mate great article. Do you do these often?

{Ed001's Note - as often as I can. If you look on the site there are a couple on there I have done recently. I do them as often as time allows.}

01 Jul 2017 09:26:42
Always felt it's a shame it didn't work out. Also felt he could be very useful when we have 80% possession at home and unable to score!

01 Jul 2017 09:54:15
Will have a look later on today, Cheers ed1.

01 Jul 2017 02:51:24
Eds, regardless of who we sign with obvious outgoing sharpening aswell, is it not worrying the fact that we struggled so much last season without champions league? For how taxing our style of play is on the players and adding champions league do you there being much room for improvement if any?

{Ed001's Note - I don't remember seeing our style of play as a problem, we went through a bad patch, but that was all it was. No team plays well every game.}

01 Jul 2017 06:22:45
Thanks for reply Ed. don't get me wrong I love the football we play with and without the ball, it just seemed to me that the players got a little tired in that bad patch but it obviously could of been for a number of reasons.

{Ed001's Note - they were covering plenty of distance still, I didn't see any tiredness personally, just a lot of players not playing well.}

01 Jul 2017 07:59:37
There a lot of attitude problems as well as we lacked the drive and belief to break teams down and step up to the plate. See Hull and LC defeats for evidence yet we were up for the fight after either of these losses when we went against Spurs and Arsenal respectively. It has nothing to do with physical tiredness. Mental fatigue due to the bad patch we were having? Maybe as that can take a toll on your confidence.

01 Jul 2017 09:25:31
I honestly didn't see it has a tiredness thing, more of a drop of form by certain players and the players who came in to replace missing players not being as good.
Teams started to play narrow with 10 men behind the ball, without Mane we had nobody who could get around this tactic especially at Anfield.
Gini and Can huffed and puffed but neither had the quality to find a way through teams that just parked the bus and let us play the final pass to MIlner or Clyne, who justs hopelessly crossed the ball into the box.
I believe our Aquisition of Salah and our pursuit of Keita will improve us greatly this season especially at home.
Can and Gini both had inconsistencies in their performances last season especially against teams at Anfield who parked the bus.
Clyne and MIlner were also poor against that tactic. I think TAA and a new left back will eventually replace them by October.
That's the way I saw it and i think we will see off teams at home much better this season, just my opinion.

30 Jun 2017 23:54:07
One thing is for sure. It will take a quality left back to come in and be as consistent so Milner was last season. He is just the kind of full back successful teams of the past, not just Liverpool had. Bit like Denis Irwin for me. Understated but quality, gives 100 per cent and has bags of experience. No drama if we don't spend big on a left back. definitely need cover tho which is why robertson would be a good signing.

The lad has plenty of potential and is Young enough to be eased into playing for a huge club like us. I hope VVD happens as him and Matip together would be immense but can't see us going back after our embarrassing public statement.

01 Jul 2017 04:11:23
I see what you're saying. I think Milner produced more going forward than Clyne did. Neither was bad defending and I know Milner cut back onto his right a lot (let's remember he played their out of duty not desire), but he was at least creative and solid taking pens. What exactly did Clyne produce? I can use my left foot better than he can, and I'm an old hack 😀.

01 Jul 2017 07:58:42
I think I have it right that Milner scored seven goals and one assist, Clyne no goals and one assist. Even taking into consideration penalties that speaks for itself. In defence, Clyne is reasonable when the ball is on the ground IMO but poor in the air.

I think that RB is as key as LB next year. Also think with a left footed winger in the squad then Milner at LB isn't as problematic as it was last season, where both Coutinho and Milners lacked pace and both their natural instinct was to cut in rather than get in behind.

01 Jul 2017 09:40:25
All of Milner's goals were penalties Zimbo, ridiculous comment.

01 Jul 2017 09:50:30
The ideal situation would be to get a LB, RB, CB, CM. This won't happen and we all know it. I think more important in this order is CB, LB, CM, RB. I believe we can be fine with Clyne for another season, yes he's not exactly incredible but if needs be we have Milner who could step in and TAA. I think splashing money out on a RB this window would be a mistake and TAA would be probably history.