Liverpool Banter Archive October 11 2012
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11 Oct 2012 23:32:39
CAN THE ENGLISH FA EVER DO THIS?
Referee Mateu Lahoz has been punished by the Spanish Football Association (RFEF) for the"technical error" made during the recent La Liga match between Sevilla and Barcelona .
Barca came from behind to win 3-2 after Gary Medel was controversially given his marching orders for appearing to headbutt Cesc Fabregas, while Sevilla boss Michel was sent to the stands for protesting.
Lahoz also missed a handball by Thiago in the build-up to David Villa's winning goal.
The RFEF have deemed the expulsion of Medel unwarranted, given what took place during the player's confrontation with Fabregas.
"On one hand, there is no aggression in the strictest sense. It was a struggle between two rival players, who brought together their heads and it did not lead to a clearly violent event," the RFEF said in a statement.
"On the other side, the rival player has clearly exaggerated the effect of the struggle, feigning to have received a violent headbutt. Yet, Gary Medel was sent off as if he were guilty of a violent act. Consequently, a clear technical error is apparent as the facts of the case do not warrant the punishment given."
Lahoz will now serve a one-match suspension...
Bas!cs.
11 Oct 2012 23:18:18
Huge blow for us. Time for FSG to step it up and let us bring in at least 3 players this January. 2 forwards, a defender and I'm still keen on a young goalkeeper
11 Oct 2012 23:11:36
I know one thing..the team plays better when gerrards not in it,when he is,everything has to go threw him,which is not working out of late,one of the best players ever for liverpool fc,BUT no player is bigger than the club,To move forward,which i think we slowly are,we can't be sentimental with our local players..
11 Oct 2012 23:00:43
Hey eds,
Considering we play a similar brand of football to Barca, Ajax and even Athletic Bilbao do you know if our scouts or BR specifically looks at talents to poach from these teams? because all of these have some great young players and you would think that they would adapt to our style seamlessly.
BTW great news about Suso's comments {Ed001's Note - we certainly have interest in players from those 3 clubs, yes.}
Care to let us know who? {Ed001's Note - it is well known we maintain an interest in Tello, Fischer and Llorente.}
Llf,play like barca llf.in between laughing the answer is yes,whenever it comes out arsenal or spurs are interested in a player,lfc jump on the bandwagon,employ some scouts ffs llf
If we look at the summer transfer window: we were interested in Sigurdson, then Spurs went after him, then we were after Dempsey, and then Spurs signed him! So I don't think it's us copying them somehow!
JammyRed
11 Oct 2012 22:45:02
Question for ed001 if he is about.
I was cruising through the archives last night reading old posts from April, in one of those you referred to Suarez as 'a striker who cannot score' and said you would not be bothered if he left. Just wondered if your opinion had changed?
Nevada {Ed001's Note - well he has started scoring, but he is still wasting far too many chances and causing far too much controversy. He needs to keep his head down and concentrate on playing footie. We don't have much option but to keep him right now, though I still believe he is bad for the club.}
Thanksfor the reply ed,
Nevada {Ed001's Note - you're welcome mate.}
Luis Suarez is an absolute godsend to Liverpool Football Club, as any fan who actually attends Liverpool matches could easily tell you. What is bad for the club are those armchair experts who are incapable of understanding the importance of a world class player who gives absolutely everything for every minute of every match and who is wholly committed to the club.
Red Owl
11 Oct 2012 22:35:24
Just heard Liverpool are going to groundshare at Goodison for two seasons while Anfield is demolished and rebuilt.
Will Everton reciprocate
Highly, highly unlikely to happen mate, but hypothetically speaking if it were to happen I'd rather we ground shared at Prenton Park than Goodison.
Cuchulainn's Hounds
11 Oct 2012 22:10:03
Esq your a ****in bully. person
11 Oct 2012 21:54:52
So Borini has has fractured the scaphoid bone in his right foot. Does anybody know how long this type of fracture takes to heal?
Simsimo
7+ weeks, then a period to get fit again. January, maybe he will score before the end of March?
Testing times for the manager, owners and team. Sods law says that Suarez will get injured.
Beware Beancounters running the shop !
Well thats one player who we now know had his name written in one of brendan "mystic meg" rodgers envelopes llf
Very much doubt this is true the scaphoid bone is in your hand not foot. Good job it's not though as the scaphoid has a really crap blood supply and is notoriously a poor healer. The navicular in the foot is a little similar and is very susceptible to bone bruising. Players can fail medicals on this. I know Keith Gillespie failed a medical to Middlesbrough on this. Anyway a December return could be a possibility, def new year.
Cheers
Greggers
11 Oct 2012 21:54:24
Still can't believe there are FSG out posts.
Is it not perfectly clear the only thing they are doing wrong is keeping Ian ayre in employment?
He is the go between for the manager and the owners, communication breakdowns and the gaping holes in our team are down to him.
Any sign on a replacement anytime soon eds?
MIKEY
11 Oct 2012 21:40:44
My wishlist for January:
1. Someone
2. Anyone
Judging from our summer activity, I suspect we will only get weaker in January, not stronger. Perhaps finally rid ourselves of Joe Cole, Downing and Carroll, and replace with three 14 year olds from youth academy.
We will be great in 2020!
Awe diddums
Would you consider Sahin/Allen/Borini 14 year olds from the academy? I'd suggest they were good additions, particularly the first two. Cole and Downing don't really improve the squad anyway.
ChrisMiz
11 Oct 2012 21:38:52
Spot on about fergie ed001.
He shows no loyalty to his players at all. Therefore they need to suck up and play for there lives to stay in the team. As it should be. He was never scared to sell a player too big for his boots. Beckham, ronaldo etc well until he bent over to rooneys wage demands.
We need Brendan to be as ruthless.
Same with wenger he Has never been afraid to sell his best players/biggest egos.
MIKEY
11 Oct 2012 21:26:21
If Brendan sells gerrard then he will be the bravest manager we have had in my lifetime, but also the most hated.
At least until we find another hero.
I don't think he has it in him to drop mr Liverpool let alone sell him.
What happened to the days when the manager ruled the club and the players shut up and put up.
I personally believe gerrard needs to be dropped and then made to earn his place, new manager, clean slate. Every player starts off as equal.
He is not good enough to start every game now.
We are playing so many youngsters, what example is Brendan showing to them in that no matter how good they are, committed or deserving of a place. An ageing legend who's only claim to a place is past achievements will always be picked ahead of them. The youngsters need to learn (I'm talking about shelvey, suso and Henderson the most here) that if they really fight then they will get a chance in the team. Right now what incentive do they have? A run in a cup or playing second fiddle to gerrard? Those 3 have it in them to replace gerrard this season given the chance. Shelvey for me. Then maybe suso will steal his place eventually.
MIKEY
Why sell Gerrard when were so short on goals?
I didn't say sell him I said drop him unless he earns his place.
MIKEY
I would rather not sell gerrard. He provides depth and I agree that he should be used for the big games and as an impact sub. Rotation is key for the midfield especially as its out strongest place. Sahin Lucas shelvey Allen and gerrard should all be rotated in the first team.
We are down there with the poor teams and people tailk about letting gerrard go , please look at why we are bottom and work out what do sterling , allen etc actually do as i don't see them doing any thing except get support from fans wanting them to be good .
we are down at the bottom not due to gerrard but a manager who has made mistakes in allen and borini and fsg have let him down , but 26 million on is two favourites looks to me as being similar to kk mistakes. no matter what any one thinks about the bad things remember who ever has the red shirt on even if he is rubbish and we do not want him in the team we have to support them and cheer them , and we have to back fsg even though i for one do not see them as being involved enough in a positive way.
11 Oct 2012 20:56:04
Wishlist for January: tello - isco - rodrigo spain u21:)
LFCopenhagen
Not a chance
11 Oct 2012 20:33:15
ed, my posts arent appearing again?
Nevada {Ed001's Note - are you sure? I was off the comp for a while, it might simply be no one covering.}
Yeah, I posted a response to your gerrard debate from earlier and it never appeared. Doesn't matter, it was just agreeing with what you were saying.
Nevada {Ed001's Note - I am sure I posted up one from you on there mate.}
Right you are ed. My humble apologies, I should never doubt your mad moderating skills. Is there an official Ed appreciation day? There should be.
Nevada {Ed001's Note - every day should be!!}
Well I'm sure you'll find most of us regulars do appreciate your efforts every day.
Nevada {Ed001's Note - you just appreciate 002 stopping the rest of us from banning you!}
11 Oct 2012 20:23:14
Uh Oh! Borini's injured with a fractured foot...let's just hope Suarez doesn't get injured.
Well, that's just great. Could someone please end whatever curse is hanging over the club already?
11 Oct 2012 20:07:18
i was just wondering what the liverpool fans think of BR disbanding all of your expirenced players and playing alot of youth recently, imo i aint working as u are not really picking up enough points atm.
Sterling looks decent but he is going to fade soon as most youngsters do at that age, so when that happens are u happy with the prospect of downing in the team.
I mean a front 4 of Downing, Henderson, Saurez ans Carrol is laughable
Chris the REDman(Baiting up his hook)
=)
Personally I think its a good thing, not only does it give the youth a chance and encourage them to take their chances it also reminds the regular first teamers that they have to earn their spot, regardless of status.
Nevada
Keep diggin lad.
derryred
Don't feed the trolls.
As the poster is not a Liverpool fan we can forgive him for knowing very little about our squad.
MIKEY
Think he is dropping the experienced players who deserve it. Carragher has been a squad player since last season anyway and Downing has never justified a place in the team.
Enrique has been injured and the majority of the experienced players who left in the summer were at the age to leave anyway.
The only senior players who are escaping this treatment at the moment are Gerrard and Reina.
I do think we need to give Sterling a break at some point in the future though as his performances will drop soon and he will tire (naturally).
I think Cole will have a prominent role now he is back from injury and Yesil, Morgan and Pacheco might get more of a look in.
Jay
Listen to MIKEY people - sometimes posts are so ill-informed thats its better not to respond at all - this guy is clearly not a Liverpool fan.
Biscanifyoucan
Cole is never going to have a prominent role at LFC - he talks a good game but thats about it.
Biscanifyoucan
11 Oct 2012 19:53:56
To Ed001,
I know you have talked a lot about Gerrard to day and I completely agree with you. I have a few questions, if you have the time:-
1) Can you ever see Gerrard being sold?
2) Who realistically would want to sign him?
3) Could we get a reasonable price for him?
4) Who would like to see replace him, or would you be happy with Shelvy?
Thanks for yor time.
Crooky
YNWA {Ed001's Note - 1) No, his wages are too high for anyone that would be interested in signing him at this moment in time.
2) Most of the Prem clubs would love to sign him, he can still offer a lot to the right club.
3) Personally I would be happy to just find him the right move on a free, one that enables him to continue his career as long as possible. It is too late to look at getting top dollar for him.
4) I personally think Suso will be the future attacking pivot of the team.}
U wanna get rid of the legend that carried us through so many big games?
WHY?!
I agree, I've watched suso closely in reserves etc....he's always impressed me more than sterling
Do you see gerrard going to America, china or the middle east for a big final pay day ed001? I don't see him going to another club in England for some reason.
Selling him for a small fortune 2 years ago would have been the best option in hindsight IMO.
MIKEY {Ed001's Note - I think that is the only real option for him, if he does leave, not sure he will though.}
What a polite young man. Kudos to you Crooky for being so well mannered, a lot of folks on here simply demand attention.
Nevada
I think luckily for him ed the club are not as ruthless as you or I may be.
Nevada {Ed001's Note - they would have been if the great man Sir Bob was still in charge.}
I think this is ridiculous his form has dropped no doubt, watch the man utd game again if he was doing that every week he would be worth loads again.
As much as I think we shouldn't run everything through him any more and play him in a more holding role to say that you want to move him on for a free is ridiculous.
11 Oct 2012 18:51:03
I would personally welcome Walcott as a January signing as I have long believed he is a striker and not a winger
Chris in Tamworth
However, Arsenal chairman Peter Hill-Wood has said: We have got our general overall wage structure and we are not prepared to break it for anybody.
We have made an offer which he didn't think was acceptable and that is the end of it. We think it is a very reasonable offer.
For the moment his people are still talking to us and we hope it will be resolved. But don't ask me when, because I haven't a clue.
I hope that he will eventually come round and sign." --
Hands up who thinks FSG will pay him the wages that Arsenal won't.
You know what Chris, I fully agree and believe that if played as a striker he would show what he can do. He can't cross a ball very well but he can certainly hit a shot and with his pace he is another Owen in my opinion.
Bazzaa
I dot think he will come chris he seems to only be in it for the money. Unfortunately. I think he is turning into a fairly decent player.
MIKEY
Think he would click as our central attacker/poacher
Paisley's genius
I agree chris , hes a inside forward finishes well, great pace everything we need fingers crossed steviep62
11 Oct 2012 16:29:25
Heres one for you all
Carroll to be recalled in Jan and be given till the end of the season to prove he has a future at the club, as FSG we not be paying over the odds for a striker in Jan as they want Carroll to justify his £35m price tag.
Downing & Henderson also to be given till the end of the season to prove there worth to the club.
Sahin will move permanently for a fee of £12m(£16m in total as we payed £4m for the loan deal).
Walcott will arrive in Jan for £12m as Zaha will join Arsenal for £10m subject to appearances etc..
ps i have no contacts or info just what i personally think will happen.
BigD
If you are right about that headless chicken Walcott signing in January then what's the point in bringing Carroll back? Think before you post ...... Someone has been playing on championship manager or FIFA lol
I never understand the idea of comparing Carroll ( six foot five ) with Walcott ( five foot seven ) , perhaps the second poster can explain .......
Carrol will never justify his price tag as he wasnt worth that anyway all k,k signings were 50 percent over the odds
Carroll is a good player he played really well towards the end of last season when he was given a run in the team, so i hope he gets given the chance to prove everyone wrong, and also we desperately need a plan B.
As for the 2nd poster i agree with the comments from the 3rd poster how can you compare those two ? ? ? Walcott will play as a striker but will also be used to play as a front 3.
BigD
Only 50 percent over?
- Logic
If Cahill was worth 7m last January with six months left on his contract, then Walcott should be 7m-8m max this January.
11 Oct 2012 14:47:32
Hey Ed Ed001's
You say that Liverpool would be better off when Gerrard and Carra go, and i have to say that i agree. I think we need to move on from the fact that like you said Gerrard has only had a few good games in a few years. He has been a great servant but would we not be better off with trying to move him on for a fee, and the fact he is 32 on 100,000 plus a week just adds to me feeling this way. Jonjo Shelvey is a ready made replacement so i hope brenden and Liverpool have the balls to move Gerrard on not because i dislike him i just think it will be for the good of the club and a fresh start for all. no doubt i will get slated but hey.
Thatracoonstolemybacon {Ed001's Note - I think we have to look to move him on, he is still good enough to be a regular elsewhere and play every week. It is time we moved on though, we need to build for the future, not hang on to the past.}
11 Oct 2012 16:59:10
I can't see why we'd move on a great player like Stevie, let him wind down his career at the club he loves, he doesn't have to start every game.
What annoys me the most about sg is can anyone say when he last had a bad game for england he is like a one man team for them because he will lose his place but for us he knows he will start all day so he dont try i hope when br gets more comfortable in the job he drops him a few games thought the season
No player at the club will be better than Gerrard. He will not be sold, he is at LFC for life, and will be moved to another important role in the club. aklfc
Not saying I agree (or disagree either), but I'd have to say that I don't think anyone would want him on the wages he's on though... Just my opinion, anyway, as players of that age on high wages are notoriously difficult to do much with. We should have let him go to Chelsea back in the day I think.
In a way I do agree with you, it's time for Us to build for the future now, get rid of carragher n maybe give him a coaching role or the toilet cleaning job lol, Gerrard is a tough one at the moment, can you really get rid of mr. Liverpool ? I see your point but maybe keep hold of him n put him on bench as an impact sub, he needs to take a pay cut for sure! No one at our club should be on over £100,000 per week! Get rid of joe cole, glen Johnson too
He's 32. He'll pick up an injury sooner or later and we'll play Shelvey as CAM. Simples.
Im sick of everyone whining about how much a player is on especially our best players i.e glen he is one of our better defenders, definitely better than robinson and kelly yet people keep on moaning about how much he is on. I earn more than my fellow workers, that is just the way it is
At this present time, SG has created most of LFC's chances this year. You tv pundits make me laugh.
Evers...... {Ed001's Note - and given the ball away more often than any other player.}
I think Gerrard would prefer to retire than move on at this point. He is a one-club man and will be remembered as the greatest midfielder to play at Anfield.
Andrew
Ed001, when did you say that about SG and JC? Are they really that orchestrating inside LFC?
With the younger players slotting in nicely their days were already numbered. If SG is on the £100k p/w then he should take a pay cut if asked to prolong his career with LFC.
Would be a brave move by BR if and when he does drop SG.
Lee73 {Ed001's Note - they do have a lot of pull inside the club, evidenced by Gerrard's comments regarding the appointment of Rodgers and how he was 'kept in the loop' the whole time. It really does remind me of the way United was when Fergie took over, except then it was Bryan Robson and a couple of others running the club. They struggled at first because those players fought Fergie all the way, until the chairman spoke to the players, explaining that they would back the board over them. That broke the back of it and I have been trying to forget what happened after ever since!}
What is wrong with people, hes a legend and quite possibly the greatest ever player this club has ever produced, him or kenny anyway, yes hes been injured and hardly played much last few seasons, im not at all suprised the poor bloke is probably burnt out after carrying the team for the last decade, hes been increadibly loyal to this club dont u think we should show the same loyalty, its also no suprise that hes hardly played the last few seasons and thats how long we have been struggling since, careful what u wish for redmen
He was pretty bad in the euro's, ok he put in a few good crosses but England lost the midfield battle because we kept losing the ball far too easily, a lot of that down to SG.
We were loyal to gerrard we have paid him several millions of pounds and given him a starting place for a decade.
How loyal do you want the club to be?
Far too much influence for far too long.
MIKEY
JC will be done at the end of this season and I think Stevie has another one in him. He isnt the player he once was but that is aging for you. I dont think he is as bad as people make him out to be although he does need to adapt quicker to the new style and stop giving the ball away. In regards to looking to the future, I agree and believe that we are heading this way but we cant afford to get rid of all of our experience, especially in midfield where we are very young overall. I can see peoples views both ways on Stevie but I think some are blinded on both extremes to being seen as untouchable by some and hopeless by others. His time will come soon but lets hope for a return to form for now.
Andy K
Loyalty means nothing in today's game. It is a business not a family game anymore. Look at Torres, Tevez, Hazard, etc. The fans might still be sentimental about their favourite players but if the size of their wages are out-weighing their productivity, they are not good for the company.
Fans are fickle too - some of the same ones who want to sell Spearing because he isn't up to scratch ....want to keep Gerrard. Both players are loyal to the club but at present not good enough.
Unfortunately, the balance sheet rules the heart these days, and the accountant's objectives are superior to the fan's desires.
For the record, I hope we keep Stevie G and play him when needed purely based on his loyalty and legendary status.....and sod the businessmen at the top :)
cozinoz
11 Oct 2012 16:09:57
Striker - Right Forward; Son Heung-Min, 20 years old - £9m
Forward - Left Wing/SS; Dries Mertens, 25 years old - £11m
Striker - Center Forward; David Villa - loan until end of the season
= £22m
We will get £10-12m from the owners and all money from selling players.
being Downing, Cole, Pacheco and we're looking to get 10-12m from selling all three.
I don't really see us being able to offload Cole anytime soon. Maybe a loan spell or situation similar to Aqualani with us supplying a healthy chunk of his wages for many years, but otherwise I don't see him going anywhere as none of the clubs who could afford to pay his wages will want him...
And who the hell will buy those 3, nobody wanted them in last window
Think mertens could be on his way to Spurs along with NM shed from alkmhar
11 Oct 2012 15:55:09
I don't often post, but when i do, i write essays..
I'm ging to try to explain to some of you why our team currently is not workign as it should.
Tiki Taka football relies the most heavily on 3 things. Penetration in the final third, Wingbacks pushing forward, and a tactically exceptional holding midfielder.
Basically when we go forward, the three front men should all be looking at getting into the box (Messi, Villa, Sanchez etc.) However this can cause the team to become narrow. Therefore the wingbacks must push forward to provide width (Abidal, Alves etc.) This leaves us narrow at the back though, so the centre backs push out into the fullback positions to provide an outlet to the wingbacks should they be under pressure (Puyol, Pique etc.) However this leaves a whopping great whole in the heart of the defence which we have had horribly exploited time and time agin this year. Who fills that? The holding midfielder does of cause. He must drop into a sweeper type role in between the centre backs. The whole formation hinges on a players ability to do this final piece. Hence why Barceloan always have a glut of holding midfielders (Song, Busquets, Mascherano, Keita, Toure etc.) The fianl 2 outfield positions are a playmaker who sits outside the box (iniesta etc.) who must provide the majority of the penetrating passes, and a midfielder who acts as an outlet to the forwards around the box, so as to retain possession until a chance arises (Xavi etc.) Without these two players, the attacks break down, or lack penetration.
How does this relate to Liverpool?
Lucas being injured means nobody is dropping between the centre backs, which means they cannot go out to support the fullbacks, which means the fullbacks are caught out of position. Also, with Allen being forced to cover Lucas, we are lacking the outlet in attack. This is why so many of our forward moves are brekaing down, resulting in us being hit on the counter. Allen should be where Xavi normally is. He doesn't drop in between ther centre halves ever, because its not his natural position. Lucas does though. Lucas being missing is making Allen look tactically weak, making the centre halves look poor at marking, making the wingbacks look positionally awful, and making our attacks look uncomposed, rushed and ineffective. If we sign two players in January, by god i hope it is adequate cover for Lucas, and a proper poacher. Because when our disjointed attacks do break into the box, we don't have a poacher.
Brendans philosophy is coming together slowly, and it will work wonders. Just you doomers and gloomers wait until Lucas is back. We will be stronger at the back, more fluent in attack, and the team will start to come together.
Sorry for the usual essay, but i feel that the majority of you, don't understand how our formation works, and how much it hinges on the three midfield players; the holder, the retainer, and the penetrator.
YNWA! (Adam)
Is that you Brendan?
Adam i think you will find that these tactics we should employ are much better than tiki taka , very simply
WHEN WE HAVE THE BALL WE ALL ATTACK
WHEN WE DONT HAVE THE BALL WE ALL DEFEND
BILL SHANKLY 1963
the great liverpool teams all played to above
alan waddle
We dont get paid to understand tactics or formations, we pay to see them in action and our team win! BR should play to the teams strengths and not try make 4-3-3 work with a squad that cant adapt. 3 attackers and yet never more than 1 in the box? either FSG should get a small debt for BR to build a team or BR should try a diff tactic til he has built a team
You lost me at wing backs.
do you even watch liverpool,
we dont play with wing backs
red jay
That's our problems in a nutshell Adam thanks.
I was screaming Lucas,Lucas,Lucas until you mentioned him. He is the most important part of the puzzle and he's not here.
I would start Allen in his natural position and get sahin or someone to fill in for Lucas, no point in playing 2 players out of position.
MIKEY
11 Oct 2012 15:35:44
cant believe why anyone would question the signing of joe allen.Brendan Rodgers main tactic is keeping the ball,this guy never gives the ball away.In my opinion hes an absolute steal for 15m,not only is he an outstanding passer but he wins the ball a lot without giving away needless free kicks.He is going to be a very big player for us for years to come,could even be a future club captain imo.Lets get rid of all this negativity and get behind our players,the mixture of youth and experience we have at our great club its only a matter of time before we start climbing the table.Rodgers is the man,make no mistake about that,hes not even 4 months in the job,his tactics are only starting to work,the players seem happy with the way things are going and even they feel its only a matter of time before we start climbing the league table.Negativity is never a good thing to have around a great club like ours,so id like see ALL the liverpool fans get behind rodgers and the players rather than moaning about us not paying rediculous transfer fees and wages for players who dont know what this club is about,playing for the liverbird is what it should be all about,not the bank account.Keep the faith lads ,the future holds some very special days for us redmen. stan the red
He doesnt have the stones to be captain
thats will be lucas s job
tom1975
Totally agree mate somebody who can have a 100 per cent pass completion at half time against the champions then by full time still have it in the nineties has got to be a class act, hes only played 7 games for the club, whats he gonna be like once settled, we have a monster of a player
Tom1975 where you saying that 3 years ago about Lucas? If not so why then can't joe Allen improve the same way, not that he needs to cos the boy is class
Actually yesi wassaying that about lucas 3 years ago
anyone can have a high pass rate when ever pass is back to his cb
allens a tidy player but he doesnt dominate the midfield like lucas does
tom1975
Actually i think henderson has more potential than allen
tom1975
11 Oct 2012 15:35:43
for all the people talking about the price tag of joe allen and his ability are so far wrong, the boy oozes class his work rate his passing his calm head, the boy keps play moving weather its side wards of backwards its better doing that than passing to the opposition, you all talk about the 16m payed for him like it was ludacris and we have never wasted money befor can i just remind you of signings like aquilani, riera, babel, downing, carroll, dossena, joe cole on stupid wages all these players signed by previous managers i would take joe allen for the money we paied over any of them
princey
He does nothing that lucas wasnt capable ofdoing,
lucas is a way better dm
11 Oct 2012 15:14:06
Rooney needs to ask for a refund on his hair transplant , looks more bald now than before he got it done !!
I thought he was wearing a bathing hat:):)
kidmillions
No amount of transplants can hide stupidity
Paisley's genius
11 Oct 2012 15:09:26
I think we are closer to the title than many believe. We need our DM back. A lot of people don't know football so they only saw how important Lucas was after he was gone. Some people still don't see it & others never will but the stats tell the story. We have one of the best defenses in the league when he is playing. Instead of looking at our defense as a flat back four, starting thinking more creatively. Lucas diverts the runs of opposing attackers with clinical tackling. One way to look at it is a triangular back three of Lucas, Skrtel & Agger. It then shifts when he sits back a little becoming a part of the back four as one of the original back four goes forward with the ball. It took him time to perfect what he does. Our possession stats place us amongst the best in the league this year. Maybe that's down to Allen. I guess we will have to wait until he's sidelined to appreciate him. That's 2 out of a formation that uses 3 mid fielders. So you can see some real selection head aches for that final spot with Sahin, Gerrard, Shelvey & possibly Suso as I think he offers more as an attacking midfielder than as a winger. Now onto the forwards. With so many to midfielders to choose from why not push Gerrard forward as he is a proven goals scorer. Plus he loses the ball a lot cause he is so attacked minded & as a forward it wouldn't be so detrimental when he looses the ball. Then we would have Gerrard & Suarez as our two main forwards with Sterling, Borini, Assaidi with the versatility of Suso making him just as viable as a forward option as he is as a midfield option. Add a top ranking forward in January & a top ranking leftback. We will be right in the thick of things once we sort out these issues.
I am still laughing at this analysis. But I need to get out of this cab and get to a meeting.
Stick to Fifa13.
Title and Rodgers are not words you will see together in years unless you write them down yourself, though I am not sure which competition you are referring to.
This kind of mentality is why undue expectation hampers a club like LFC. The club is one injury or sending off away from having even less striking threat in the league than they currently pose. I don't see any top 8 team currently concerned about this system that BR plays. They are reading it like a book.
It is interesting that the most successful matches have been against foreign teams who won't have the same day to day book to read as premier league teams do. Jmac
I agree a bit with you Jmac, but foreign teams do their research and I'm sure they know the system we are playing just as well as other premiership teams do.
Big Bill
Borini has broken a metatarsal. There goes our strikeforce
Do we have a chance to sign Alexander Khorzhokov?
Aneesh {Ed002's Note - There is no interest right now that I know of.}
Who is he never heard of him ...
...You mean Kerzakhov, the Zenit guy, right?
RedKopite
11 Oct 2012 14:27:49
I'm sick of all the kids crying on here.... I want this and I want that.... Etc.....well I know what you'd get from me n that's a good slapping lol......the youth of today have no patience, they need to realise that great things take time to build.....big things have small beginnings
Ack17
Anyone who writes 'lol' must surely be under 25. Mature people don't write that do they?
They are the "Now!! Now!! Now!! Me! Me!! Me!! generation.
kidmillions
It wasn't our generation who spent money we didn't have on things we couldn't afford. We a merely a product of what has gone before us.
11 Oct 2012 13:28:01
Burak Yilmaz is being linked with a £13m January move, problem is his age 27 so it looks doubtful, but eds whats ur info on this? {Ed002's Note - Seems very much a rumour right now.}
11 Oct 2012 13:23:43
I am getting to like BR as I get to see more of him, both in the documentary and in interviews. But I am a bit puzzled by his new envelopes strategy. Apparently, he is putting the names of three players he thinks will let him down into three envelopes and probably reveal them at the end of the season.
Wouldn't you say that this motivational tactic is a bit strange and could be counter-productive?
Its a motivational stratagey fergie used it in his early days at scum, its for players to go prove a point if they are in the envolope prove they dont deserve to be there if your not in the envolope prove you shouldnt be there next season
Fergie does it as well. The envelopes are blank, its just a motivational tool.
Its nuts. Its not management that's more like ego playing up to the camera. Its not about appeasing the manager, and his quack schemes, its about performance.
If any of those names get made public the players would be entitled to grievance. They didn't join a club to play reality fly on the wall co stars to Buck. He has a habit of shooting himself in the foot whenever he goes public. Though he did say he was nuts himself. Jmac
Well, if old Whiskey nose does it then that says it all
The envelopes are blank, you don't need to be the brain of britain to work it out.
For me, I genuinely think BR is a student of the game, clearly knows what he wants to have happen, and is overall a very decent manager.
From what I've seen though, he seems to lack a sense of humor and is a bit too much 'all business, all the time'. Maybe he's joking around with the players and it's not being shown, but a bit of the general smiling-ness displayed by Dalglish probably wouldn't hurt every once in a while...
11 Oct 2012 14:14:26
Has sparky sold out? As i've read that sparky is in the new tim burton film. Taggart is go on x factor and be flavor flav (sp) and if he isn't winning can hold up the timepiece to the referee and say its fergie time. Gutted no proper football this weekend, then again can read the real Bill Shankly by Karen Gill. Finally heard a January transfer rumour that stoke are signing pinzi of udinese as he did a textbook (rugby) tackle. redevon
11 Oct 2012 14:07:43
Someone asked me this question, and now I want to ask you all the same.....
Go back to the last week of the transfer deadline and all that went on.
In hindsight, would any of you have taken back 1 or both of..... Fernando Torres and Michael Owen?
My personal reply was.....no I wouldn't.
I'm just interested to know everyone elses
K.Bennett
No.
The real AG
That's quite a silly question tbh. Michael Owen is way off his peak and would make no impact to the team and would only be a sub. So no I wouldn't take back Owen. Torres on the other hand would be very useful. Gerrard knows how to play with him after their days under rafa. Suarez would create bags of chances for torres and he would be our main striker. Yes I would have to take by Torres, it's not a case of loyalty it's a case of getting where I want to be. As close to the top as possible...under any circumstances.
I prefer to move forwards not backwards.
Huws
I was just asking the same question asked of me. And I've seen posts on here asking of any possibility of Owen coming back (when there was talk of us going for a free agent etc). So why is that silly?
And I'm sorry, but it is about loyalty. If Torres had left gracefully and didn't have that last 6 months where he looked and played like he had a black cloud over him constantly, then maybe I would feel different.
K.Bennett
Thinking about it objectively (as I often try to) Owen is too old and injury prone to be offered a bridge back (even if we did for give his unforgivable act) so no to him.
Torres? If we got the torres of 4 years ago yes I would take him. I would even be willing to overlook his comments because it would be beneficial to the team. But he's not that Torres, he's the jaded and clumsy striker swinging at thin air. Neither of these two offer anything we dont already have, less than that they are like poor versions of what we already have.
Nevada
I would rather have taken Robbie Fowler back. I would not take any player back as it symbolises a backward step.
Scouse_Pride
11 Oct 2012 13:45:56
A question for Ed001 please.
In your opinion, would you say that Gerrard has not been the same player for us since his head was turned by Chelsea?
K.Bennett {Ed001's Note - yes.}
He was phenomenal in 2006, 2007 and 2008. He hasn't been the same since Rafa left where the system was suited to him.
BthekingB
Hasn't been the same since rafa left.
Injuries haven't helped mind... {Ed001's Note - good point, but that is part of the problem, he is getting older and injuries will be more and more of an issue.}
Rubbish. His best probably came in the couple of seasonsafter that, he was phenomenal in 07/08 and 08/09, then he picked up a couple of injuries and Rafa left. Definitely has not been the same since.
GLfc
11 Oct 2012 13:37:46
Eds whats with the hatred of Stevie G are you all Mancs or something? His form may have dropped in the last 3 years but for the previous 10 he practically carried us single handed excluding the couple of seasons we had an in form Torres, Alonso and Mascherano! Lets have some respect for a guy that over the majority of seasons pretty much made an average team qualify for the champs league year in year out, win the champs league with the likes of Djimi Traore, Harry Kewell and Milan Baros starting and the GERRARD FA cup final of 2006. All that is being proven now is that now hes past his best and fits in with the team rather than being our outstanding player who carried us every week is what every Manc supporter used to say "Your a 1 man team and take him out of that team you would be a mid table side." I am one of the supporters who used to brush that off as bull but the last 3 years go to proove everything they said is true! There will be no other player that will be as influential as Stevie in his time at our club! YNWA! Captain fantastic!!! Still deserves to be a first team starter!
Rob
Rob {Ed001's Note - you sad little boy! Nothing more pathetic that someone who thinks a differing opinion means you can't be Liverpool fans. That is just so childish and immature. He was great, he is now no longer great, that is not hatred, that is an honest opinion based on watching him play. He single handedly did nothing, he was part of a team that won things, a team that has often played better without him. It is childish little fanboys like you that will stop the club progressing as it should. Perhaps you would like us to sign Pele, he wasn't so bad a few years ago either? I have to ask if you are really a Liverpool fan or just a Gerrard fan?}
Ed if u think gerrard should not be in the midfield 3 which i do agree on at times, who would you like to see as a long term replacement for him not only as the cm leader he is but the captain and the poster boy for lfc, i think shelvey is on his way to being the key cm we need but is he ready for such a step up {Ed001's Note - I don't think you can replace someone like him, being a local boy etc, no player is ever going to get the same hero worship he does.}
Ed001. Gerrard has spent the last 4 seasons playing for a club in turmoil. "Mitigating circumstances" Great players and teamates leaving? 4 Managers?
If we were a stable and successful club over the last few years? I could better understand your viewpoint, but as it is? Methinks you should cut him some slack.
kidmillions {Ed001's Note - and he was doing nothing to help the situation, so no I don't need to cut him some slack. He is a player and that is all he is, if he can no longer cut it he has to go. Stop with the misty eyed, look at what he has done for us rubbish, his time has come to an end at the top level.}
I'm pretty sure most liverpool fans have the upmost respect for gerrard. But why should we turn a blind eye to a player that's playing poorly just because he was great before. If you've lost the fight and the spirit you no longer deserve to be in the team... As simple as that. This is called professionalism. Why gerrard is coming out and saying all these things about other clubs wanting him is beyond me. Maybe he knows he's at the twilight. Rogers should be ruthless and put shelvey there where he deserves. To get to the top you can't have a heart.
You said it yourself he's just a player. How could he have helped. The Club has been bought and sold twice and the turnover of players has been astronomical.
I still think Gerrard will do a good job for the team. When we we get a proven Goalscorer upfront with Suarez and a proper Goalkeeper? Would say that's more our problem at the moment.
Goalkeeper as good as joe hart and a forward like aguerro would turn us into at the very least challengers.
kidmillions {Ed001's Note - how could he have helped? You know full well Gerrard has more input into the club than a player should, we would never have had Hodgson as manager without him choosing him.}
Ed calm down mate this is a footballing debate dont get upset...... Totally agree Gerrard isnt as good as he was but still walks in to this team..... You say he was part of a team that won trophys not being funny but take Gerrard out of the last decade and compare the trophy cabinet he was an outstanding player in an average team apart from as i say the team that mounted a title challenge.... You go on to show how little you know replying to a poster his loss of form was because he had his head turned by Chelsea which was the summer of 2005 and he went on to grab PFA player of the year in 2006 haha also the partnership he formed with Torres were the greatest years of his playing career which lead to the football writers player of year 2009..... Last 3 years you keep talking about which admittedly he hasnt been at his best but still returned 8 goals in 24 apps, followed by 9 in 28 apps and so far this season 3 in 11 so over this period your so angry about still returns a goal every 3 games only Shelvey who is growing towards this but still has a long way to go! Just a question.... You're not the guy he smacked after bagging a brace in that 5-0 win v Newcastle are you? You dont seem to like him much! {Ed001's Note - you think an award like that shows him to be playing better? That shows how little you know about footie! Just because Rafa altered the system to suit him, doesn't mean he was at his best. In fact it was disgraceful his little tantrum about playing wide on the right, where he did have his best season for Liverpool, is forgotten. How am I angry? That is such a ridiculous and pathetic little comment. It is amazing how you try and make out my opinions are personal, when it is clearly only you that is making it personal with your clear bias. This is the problem, you can not see anything but the guy scoring goals in the past and what he has done, in the past. Until you learn some objectivity, your opinion will not be anything other than flawed.}
Gerrard is too good to be given all of this , have a go at people who need to prove them selves , i.e for all the hype and great potential what does sterling do and mr overated allen come on lads we are in this together please give our players no stick they are in the team despite what we may think of them.
I agree with Ed and wrote a lengthy post last season about this topic (its titled Thou Shalt not Worship False Idols if you fancy a read).
Look at it from an objective standpoint, and ask your self this... does he currently offer more than Shelvey? Sahin? No he doesnt. I'm an objective person and so if his form improved, keep him in but I am very much of the opinion that his 3 year decline in form is not a blip. If you do believe that a 3 year dip is just a blip then perhaps you need to think real hard about that.
Real players will sacrifice everything for the club, even their own status. I don't think I'm wrong in saying that Fowler would do it, Rush would do it, Kenny would certainly do it. Would Gerrard? Would he sit on the bench if he knew it was better for the team? I don't think he would.
Remember - Football is often a romantic sport, but it should never be sentimental
Keep up the good work ed, this site is always the most interesting on the net.
Nevada
I personally think gerrard was better before rafa tinkered with his game, when he used to cover every blade of grass and put in telling tackles and burst his lungs to get into the box to get on the end of a ball, obviously he could not carry on like that but he was better in my opinion, before {Ed001's Note - that is exactly what I think too, he is a victim of being over coached. His game was fine exactly how it was, it would have been far better to just work on getting the most from his strengths.}
11 Oct 2012 12:27:40
Why are people laying into Joe Allen so badly? He may not be producing these Hollywood forward passes but he is maintaining possession in midfield consistently - the lad literally never gives the ball away! If all our players had the possession keeping quality of him we would barely concede! In a system where there is such a strong emphasis on passing and maintaining possession he is vital to our squad.
He has also gained possession more than any other players on the league...
Allen offers no attacking threat..
If you view it from this point of view.
And knowing that the team was only lacking a striking capability. Remember last season Liverpool were the third strongest behind Man Utd/City at not conceding.
So a defensively orientated holding midfielder who doesn't score was NOT a priority.
Yet someone saw fit to spend £16.7m on him, when he was just not needed or a priority.
That's why his purchasor deserves a hard time. NOT ALLEN. He was only doing what any player would do when offered te 'lottery win' that joining a bug club from Championship mainstayer club.
The question is why, when it was a striker the money should have been used for. jmac
If all our players had the possession keeping quality of him we would barely concede!
And you would never score either keep passing it around the midfield and defence.
Djay
I think your more botherd about the price not the player or performances, lfc know they made a mistake not bringing in a attacking player but dont hold that on joe allen, if he was a spanish player with the now jose allen u would be over the moon with a gem of a player who dictates your tempo of the game he is like sergio busquests for barce he wins the ball makes a simple pass and keeps the game ticking over the sooner u realize his talent the better
princey
To the 3rd poster; what happened when Lucas got injured last year? And this year, whilst he is injured again, who would you play in the CDM role? Someone HAS to perform that role or the team can't function as a whole.
And Allen will shine even brighter once Lucas is back playing again.
Allen is covering the absent Lucas and his role at the moment. We will see him move further forward once Lucas is back.
Huws
PLenty of people keep harping on about his lack of goal threat. Do you say the same of Lucas? Nope. Why not? He is a DEFENSIVE midfielder, which is the same role Allen is being asked to play.
Nevada
11 Oct 2012 12:12:20
When Lucas and Shelvey returns, what is our best midfield trio??
Lucas - Allen - Gerard
Lucas - Allen - Shelvey
Lucas - Sahin - Gerard
Etc, etc etc.
I believe Lucas should be in the trio once fit.
Is Gerard (in his current form) a starter with recent pressure from Shelvey and Sahin?
Would be interesting to get everyone's top 3 and why?
Lucas - Allen - Sahin
Lucas-Sahin-Allen
Gerrard should be impact player or play only 1 game per week.
Has to be .... Lucas, Allen, Gerrard for me pal
I would rotate so that our players do not get injured and tired.
Lucas - Sahin - Gerard
Why ?
Lucas is the rock and protects the back 4
Sahin & Gerrard can both score, pass and create goals which is whats needed.
BigD
!st
Lucas - Sahin - Gerard
2nd
Allen - Shelvey - Henderson
Lucas-Allen-sahin
The middle group. Gerrard gives the ball away too much atleast 3 goals (from memory) he's given them the ball. Allen has won the ball back 60x this season more times than anyone else in the BPL and shelvey is a future England captain and world beater as long as he sorts out his tackling and Lucas probably picks himself ATM
Liam
Has to be Lucas Allen as the CDM and controller, with Sahin rotated for Allen, then on current form Shelvey is the CAM that best fits our style with Gerrard as rotation for him. Shelvey is young and form may dip so Gerrard would play more but Jonjo will replace him completely in a year.
Lucas - Allen - Shelvey
Allen - Lucas - Suso
Huws
I think it should entirely be based on form. By that standard, it should probably be Allen-Sahin-Shelvey.
Lucas is going to take a long while to get fit since he hasn't played for any significant amount of time in over a year. I'm also not sure he's ever going to be the same player he once was, unfortunately- seems these days after major surgery players just lose something- good examples being Gerrard and Torres, neither of ever seemed to reach their previous heights.
Lucas Allen messi ah to dream we would be boss though ha ha!
11 Oct 2012 12:11:14
I wish all the doomsayers would ef off. Despite the poor point tally so far there are lots of positives. 1. BR is the right man or the job. As well as his impressive interviews and persona he has the Cojones to impose his playing philosophy on the club. This will take a little time but the players are already showing much better movement. Notwithstanding Carroll's fee he had no hesitation in shipping out a player who does not fit his playing style (shame FSG screwed up the Dempsey pursuit) 2. Suso looks the biz. 3. Sterling looks the biz. 4. Wisdom looks the biz. 5. BR is not afraid to play the youngsters. If they are good enough Anfield is now a place where they will flourish 6. Allen looks the biz. 7. Moving on high earners in the summer has saved over 500K a week. 8. Our reserves/ academy look the biz. 9. Shelvey has really developed and looks like being able to fulfil his potential which was always to step in to Stevie G's shoes. Shelvey has the lot in his locker and once he gets this season under his belt I have little doubt that he will be a monster of a player for us. Once the club has had a full season of BR's coaching and some additions have been made in January 2013 and the summer of 2013 of players who suit BR's style of play we should be really well set up to have fantastic season next year. This season is one of bedding in. Change takes time to implement. We will have ups and downs this season in terms of results, but progress is definitely being made in the right direction. BR and the players deserve our 100% support. Reality Red
This guys post is 'the biz' and I agree with his sentiments entirely! I've told my 3boys the same and this is the start of an exciting period for them in a similar way Paisley Fagin and Dalglish was for me! Indeed even at 9,11 and 13 they can see the promise and progression of this team and are excited about the future(which can only be a good thing) In Buck Rodgers we(allshould) trust!!
11 Oct 2012 12:06:57
Can anyone explain why Rogers has been selecting a 4-5-1 all of a sudden?
Historically he only believed in 4-3-3, 4-2-3-1 and 4-3-2-1.
4-5-1 is very defensive, even with attacking midfielders and if the left and right midfield wingers push up wide in attack, it doesn't give the left and right backs the opportunity to push up as much???
Is it due to the lack of players to choose from up front and Borini's current form or other tactical reasons??
Lee
11 Oct 2012 13:49:16
I think with Rodgers it's less about formation and more about what each player needs to do in his area of the field for the team. The wide forward players whether they start deeper in 451 or pushed up in 433 are there to beat players or make the defence feel like they are going to drive inside to either shoot or slip a diagonal pass to a better placed teammate. This then offers a double problem of not only goal threat if they get inside but also the overlap of the full back stretching the defence wider with the wide forward then being central to add numbers in dangerous areas. If the wide forward gets pushed wide the full back can make a inside run or they may be able to get a cross or pull back into dangerous areas. The 451, 4231, 4151, 433 etc are all variations on the same formation of overloading midfield to control key territory at the expense of numbers either wide in defence or centrally up front. Rodgers IMO has very cleverly come up with a way to turn a weakness into an illusion of strength and by controlling the possession you give the opposition less opportunity to get at your weakness even if they work it out.
Simon
Don,t know
Robbie
4-5-1, 4-2-3-1, 4-3-3 and 4-5-1 are all variations of the same formation
I haven't noticed a 4-5-1 at all.
Allen is the only midfielder who sits, Gerrard & Sahin pretty much alternate going forward.
Our wide men, Sterling/Suso/Borini/Assaidi are hardly ones to sit in front of the full backs.
It's almost a 4-1-4-1 in attack (disregarding the pushing up of full backs).
I think we are still in a 4-3-3 with an inverted 3.
To be honest, formations don't mean too much when you play fluidly, Suarez hardly lurks in the box so maybe even a 4-1-2-3-0
Sure your watching the right team mate?
Its not a solid 4-5-1 its only like that off the ball on the ball its a 4-3-3 its to be solid defensively in the midfield and solid going forward its a system that rodgers has used through his time at swansea and will use at liverpool it just requires alot of work from all the midfield 5
Fgs we are a football team! We attack together and defend together, in attack we typically have on on the left one on the right and two in the box but when we lose the ball we don't suddenly lose those players they get back and defend we declfend with 11 and attack with 11 and yes they all float around it's called football not table football they aren't stuck in lines.
Liam
Really there are only two formations, 4-4-2 and 4-3-3. The rermainder are just variations. 4-5-1 is just 4-3-3 with the flanking forwards playing a bit deeper.
11 Oct 2012 17:50:54
Its 4-2-3-1
Jamie
11 Oct 2012 11:30:59
people on here slating your manager and current owners should be ashamed of yourself growing up i always learnt that liverpool fans gave people time respec and there support, but all i see on here is disrespect and a all round lack of football knowledge, your all expecting big things from your club i understand that but because of previous mangers and there transfers its letting rogers down, he is having to clear out all the over paid useless trash left from roy, and kenny players like joe cole downing and many more which for me he is doing a good job of, he is bringing through some young exceptional talent find me another manager when he goes to a huge club like liverpool under imense pressure that would to that, for me its a big statemnt of BR charector he is bringing his philosphy to the club about "total football" you might not be getting the best resuts yet but give it time and im sure he will come good, joe allen has been getting alot of stick from his own fans which i dont understand he is a composed head that does a brilliant job he is always ready to recieve the ball and you moan he dosnt pass forward but sometimes its better to retain the ball than hoof it upfield every time u recieve it, i think all you people insulting your own players and club need to take a long look at yourself and rememer YNWA is not just a song its a way of life for liverpool so why not give rogers the same support
Princey
Fantastic post
Couldn't actually agree more but you have to realise most real fans don't go on this page it's just filled with kids that think they know about football but have no clue this page annoys me so much now :(
Londonred
Great post
most of the fans on this website just watch the highlights or the score and come here to give their verdict. A team which plays beautiful football will not develop in one day, other than that even teams like barca or munich dominate games and then lose to crappy opponents who have like 2 shots on goal so be patients. at this moment we have the people who care about our club and will make it successfull
Red 316
Because time has moved on! Lot more investment within clubs at present also owners, backers & investors are looking for global branding and with out instant or near as to instant success clubs lose out on moneys, they lose out on global fan base due to the more successful clubs being shown on their t.v on a more regular basis! This ynwa way of life thing isn't just Liverpool thing United have their way of life as do spurs, city, arsenal, Everton & every other club their fans are just as passionate about their clubs as Liverpool fans are about Liverpool. Other fans are just as knowledgeable about football some even more so than Liverpool fans! this living in the past has to end!
Think you'll find it's just case of an empty vessel makes the most noise.
The more clueless they are! The more noise they make!
Think you'll find they don't in any way represent the true Liverpool supporters viewpoint who can see what Rodgers and the players are trying to do and give there undying support... obviously with fingers crossed as success as we all know is never guaranteed.
For first time in a long time the Club is set up right from top to bottom.
I believe and have always believed the only way to achieve sustained success on the pitch is through pass and move possession football.
We've had over 20yrs of just one off cup wins.
So we have to give Brendan Rodgers a chance..
kidmillions
11 Oct 2012 11:09:00
Brendan rodgers has told raheem sterling he can still learn a lot from liverpool's senior players.Rodgers has told young raheem to watch stewart downing and do the opposite.
Downing could learn a few things from raheem sterling the 17 year old,ironic or what.
You guys need to chill out. Last time I heard downing is still a liverpool player and try's hard everytime he plays. He's got enough quality to be in team B and we need all the depth we can get. So support him.
11 Oct 2012 10:57:46
With jonjo shelvey back now,and lucas due to return next month,we will soon start to kick on in the league.Shelvey has the ability to score the goals from midfiled that we are desperately short of.In my opinion we are seriously missing lucas and his ability to protect the back 4.I belive a new striker will arrive in january to play alongside suarez.The second half of the season will be much more positive and enjoyable.We have a very talented young squad,and a manager trying to make us play football the way it should be played.The dark clouds will lift and liverpool fc will rise again..
11 Oct 2012 10:56:36
I see that Saint Michael Owen has come out with a statement about diving which nicely contradicts his club manager. I wonder if Owen's picture will be splashed all over the media next time there is a 'diving' outcry!!
I don't condone diving but compared to some of the career threatening tackles that occur surely this needs putting into perspective.
Brian
Michael Owen has to get a game first :p
Red Raw
11 Oct 2012 10:33:07
Maybe someone should enlighten me, but Gerrard has created 20 chances so far in the season, but people are saying drop him? Surely if that's the case it would be the fault of those who failed to finish off those chances? (Johnson springs to mind). He obviously is slightly off colour(so is the rest of the team), but still very important to the team as a whole.
Keith YNWA
Johnson is a defender mate any goal he gets Is a bonus
While Gerrard has created 20 chances so far in 7 games in the premier league, he has also given the ball away a staggering 109 times I think, which is the most by any player in the premier league. And, this has lead to us conceding a number of goals.
The real AG
All I can say to these Gerrard doubters is have some respect, he is class and always will be. He will be the biggest miss when he retires. Yes he has had the odd bad game but that is compared to the unbelievable high standard that he has set.
Gally {Ed001's Note - no, he has had 3 years of almost entirely bad games with the odd flash of brilliance here and there. The club will be better off when Gerrard and Carragher go, just like United was better off when Robson etc left.}
I find myself agreeing with Ed001 - is this allowed?
Puzzled
I agree with the ed on this one, i believe we already have the replacements at the club in Martin Kelly & Jonjo Shelvey.
BigD
Gerrard takes corners and free kicks all of which count towards a 'chance' look at how many assists he has this year for a more accurate stat
Liam
Enjoy Gerrard while we have him
Were unlike to have a player of his quality for a long time to come
Just to add to Liams point I think Gerrard really needs to give up some of the dead balls now and stop pulling rank. His corners never get past the first man and Suarez is proving that he is the best man for direct freekicks.
Huws
11 Oct 2012 10:12:06
Recent post states: Joe Allen is a fantastic player - I dont think so. For almost £17m I would expect someone to at least pass the ball forward.
11 Oct 2012 11:24:33
Utterly clueless
I probably won't have the time to come back and click the disagree button time and time again, so I urge other good fans of Liverpool FC to do that.
Drigan
Another armchair supporter/WUM/Bitter Manc with nothing better to do!
Obviously never seen the lad play.
This clown posts the same thing on here every single day. Boring muppet.
Well I've seen Messi play - he's bloody useless too!
solidair
How long has Alan Shearer been posting on here?
11 Oct 2012 16:13:11
I've seen Allen pass the ball forward many times this season already! You obviously don't watch the games.
11 Oct 2012 09:32:17
Just an idea for the Ed's......how would you feel about adding two buttons below the Agree/Disagree buttons and call them "Agree with Eds/Disagree with Eds"
Sometimes it's the Eds comments that i agree with and not the original post and vise versa ofcourse!
Just a thought.
Mike in leeds {Ed001's Note - it is on the to do list, but the to do list has enough on it to keep us going to 20 years and gets longer by the day!}
11 Oct 2012 08:30:50
Is there a budget for January transfer window?
Gav the Red
I doubt there would be much..
Chaki
£2.50 and a packet of pork scratchings
£2.50 and a packet of pork scratchings -
Oh no the Kun Aguero rumours will start again
Irich Red Dog
Is that 2.50 after sales?
11 Oct 2012 08:27:52
Can someone tell me where the hell Doni is?
Why? does he owe you money?
All will be revealed in due course . Doni has not been in Europe since mid June , he will not play for the club again . Be patient .
On the loo.
Mighty reds
Why, is his dinner ready?
He is on extended leave for personal reasons.
Bet he's still getting paid.
At 8.27! Bit early for dinner don't you think?
11 Oct 2012 08:35:26
Hi eds, do you know anything about Raheem Sterling's fee? When we bought him from QPR it was £500,000 but were there any add-ons? Some people on the internet have the idea that with performance based add-ons this could rise to £5 million but I can't see any team in the world paying £5 million for a 15 year old.
BthekingB {Ed063's Note - It was 500,000 mate and it can rise to 5 million based on appearances etc. But we didn't pay 5 million for a 15 year old - we payed 5 million for a quality 20 year old in a couple of years. Think of it ths way mate - if a team tried to buy him now as a 17 year old it would cost A LOT more than 5 million}
11 Oct 2012 08:08:01
So Downing was "hurt" and "disappointed" by Buck's open, plain assessment of his situation.
And fans have subsequently had a go at Buck, condemning his actions as "undermining the team".
FFS! Will you just get over yourself?
Downing is no one to complain. Ever since joining, he's been as awful and rubbish as you'll ever see. Mediocrity doesn't come any better than him.
Buck started with him on a clean slate, putting aside the expensive embarassment he was last season. To show his gratitude, Downing showed the same ZERO committment, ZERO motivation and ZERO contribution that typified his shambles of a stay since last season.
Buck points out his very glaring flaws and shortcomings to him? And Dowining, instead of taking that on board and start knuckling down, he chooses to mouth off to the media. BOO HOO! BOO HOO!
Big girl's blouse.
Interestingly, a week or so before this, Mourihno had openly rebuked, perhaps even berated, his players. Their response was mature, swift and emphatic. They outplayed (champions of England and Manchester) City and won that game. They followed that up with a string of improved performances and results in La Liga.
No bleating, no whinging, no mouthing of to the media.
Mourihno did what he had to do to hammer home his message, the players took it on board and responded positively.
Professional and mature.
So if these players, who earn several times his wages and have egos just as big, can take criticism well and respond with maturity and professionalism to it, who the hell is Stewart Downing to think that he shouldn't be subjected to the same rules?
Why should Brendan Rodgers be expected to rub this man's belly? Doesn't he get tens of thousands of pounds a week to do his job? Why should it be Buck's responsibility to make this man want to do his job?
Downing is a "professional" paid to do his job. If he cannot bring himself to get motivated enough, I suggest he quit football.
Kick this man outta my club. Such a disgrace.
WILLIE
He maybe a professional but plays like an ameteur
Downing is right
You do not wash your Dirty linen in public
And it certainly was never the LFC way before H&G, & FSG
11 Oct 2012 09:41:20
brilliant & elequent piece by the way;verification, if it was ever needed, that passengers like Downing should ship out
Learpholl
I remember hearing rumour that one time he did not start a match last season, he was in Kenny's office shouting the odds and Kenny just gave in to him throwing a strop ... I wanted him out as soon as I heard that, we need to cut our losses on him immediately.
He has never deserved to wear red.
si666
I seem to remember Bill Shankly saying that if a man was playing in front of the public, was beein well paid and was not dedicated to the job then he (Shankly) would put him in jail if he could
Redpath
11 Oct 2012 05:21:04
FSG won't be spending big this window £10m plus sales is the budget (extra funds would be provided if an unmissable deal happens to come our way)
Downing to be sold we will say 10m but will go as low as £8m
Cole £1.5m (QPR/Westham)
Pacheco sold for £1.5m or sent out on loan
= £10 - £12m
Striker - Son Heung-Min - £7m
the others if there are any more will be to add depth
Ricardo Quaresma - £1.5m (if rodgers gets his way.....quality depth, good option to have, game changer when on form)
Marcelo Brozovic - £5m plus £2m add ons
Ale Cissokho - £7m
........
in the summer outs
Enrique £7m
maybe Henderson (depends on whether he brings it or not) £10-12m
in
Creative Midfielder - either; Eriksen £12m, Sahin £17m or Ozil £18.5m
A striker; Higuain - with £19m from selling Carroll & Spearing plus £14m (from owners pockets)
net spending between £9-15m
If you knew this much you would be a rich man. {Ed063's Note - I'm a rich man.}
Eriksen for £12m
He' better than Oscar, Mata or Hazard who all cost double or triple your valuation
Well it would be great if we can get Eriksen,will add to the depth of the squad but we already got Shelvey & Suso for that role behind the striker. We also have Adorjan. ZA13
Eriksen 12m
Ozil 18,5m
What world are you on? They would cost a lot more than that!
Chaki
Not bein funny but why wud the likes of Ozil n higuain want to join Liverpool? Got to b realistic boys
Big Mac
11 Oct 2012 02:38:42
BR needs time, that's a fact. It took time for Fergie, Wenger and even Mancini to start to get the results. People need to think long term, even if it's difficult these days.
Joe Allen is a fantastic signing and anyone, who knows anything about playing football can agree with that.
Suarez is a latino, he won't change, they're always be dramatic and passionate, he's not the only diver in the league, come on! All those hypocrites should mind their own business!
All I wanted to say is be patient fellow Reds the future is ours.
Within a few years the Old Whiskey Nose will step down and we will have a more experienced manager with the likes of Suso,Sterrling and Wisdom on our team!
YNWA
HK
Wenger won the double in his first full season.
Time is like the clock in my heart
Take to much and its beats too much
and you have lost me from the start
rodgers has certainly lost me
10 Oct 2012 21:29:49
002: Have now now used the retromingent gliffnard to death (what a phrase)and am now looking for another inspirational insulting phrase to use. Can you help.
Nothing to post regarding transfers and banter so just keeping my eye in, if you know what i mean sir.Thanks in advance.
Jim22 {Ed002's Note - Try "tenteferic fangle" and that should work until we can come up with something new.}
10 Oct 2012 20:33:02
ED 002, commented on a post earlier saying the owners are legends, why people criticise them is beyond me! Well if I supported Chelsea I would think they were legends too, so I will ask the ED this, if they are legends would you like them owning Chelsea insted of Abramovich?? I will await your reply with intrest, presuming you will post this in the first place because I think we already know the answer, unles you give one of your politically evasive answers insted of a straight yes or no!
Waro {Ed002's Note - I did not say anything of the sort of course. You have to be some sort of jerk to think people will believe this.}
Wasn't Ed002, mate. Might want to belittle the correct Ed at least. person.
The only thing ed002 said on the subject of our ownership was in regards to the fans lack of gratitude for what we have, I believe ed said Liverpool have some of the most fickle and ungrateful fans.
I'd like to point out that ed was only referring to the few which criticise the owners which saved this club from disappearing. If you took umberance to that statement then you must clearly be one of those fans.
Nevada
11 Oct 2012 00:47:58
how about rodgers changing his style to suit gerrard..there is no way he would be on the bench and jonjo and sahin would start before him..instead of talking crap about him why dont the rest of the team step up and stop expecting him to perform his magic when the chips are down {Ed001's Note - grow up. Gerrard is not Liverpool, he should adapt or go, like any other player. Anyone foolish enough to think the club should put Gerrard above others, they need to spend some time learning why this club dominated football for such a prolonged period. It was based on being ruthless, getting rid of players just before they started their slide into retirement. Gerrard started his 3 years ago, from a very high peak admittedly, but he has been in decline for that long. Under Paisley that would never have happened, he would have been sold for a big fee and there would have been someone slotted into the team to replace him.}
Stevie is the best midfielder we have ever had,but he ought to be used wisely as he is getting older and needs to protected and used to the greatest effect, ie cant play 2games a week anymore and we are very lucky to have decent stand ins in the shape of suso or shelvey
tom1975 {Ed063's Note - Gerrard is not the best midfielder we have ever had. Go watch Souness and then tell me Gerrard is the best}
With you there eds, Gerrard was no doubt a great player 4 years ago, probably the best midfielder in the world at the time, at the least the most influential.
But its not 4 years ago, and today he is near the end of his decline. As such the club is more important. We know how you feel original poster, many of us have had to watch our favourite players leave or wash up a little.
My comments on Gerrard were well documented on these forums last year, and I still believe that he is not the die hard kop idol that he and some other posters would believe, evidenced by the fact that if he truly cared more for the team than himself, he would gladly sit on the bench or adapt to a new role if it was better for the team. He does not however.
Nevada
He was in mourinhios own car driven by his body guard and hired help from kirkby. He askd kirkby lad to return on route when he changed his mind. Stevie g was closer than u think moving to chavski than anybody realises. This is a fact as i know mourinhio lad ex army who used to live with jose family and drive his kids to school
What is being said about Gerrard joining might be true however Rafa did not want him
Much like the treatment RAFA gave Alonso and we all know what he did
So give some credit to Gerrard he stayed with a manager who p*ssed off many players including Gerrard
Sour Puss
11 Oct 2012 00:47:10
For all those SO CALLED liverpool fans calling for the head of Brendan Rogers head after the start of season, please check the following tv interview and see for yourself, the following qualities in the manager:
Passion
Ambition
Loyalty
Intelligence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xyGdHRER9aU&list=PLJRb6yxlBkhM106GWO1uSQ4T90-sDjdKW#!
We now the start has not been the greatest on earth, but everytime I hear BR speak, I listen and buy into what he is about.
The players in certain positions are not the players for the future. There have been too many average players bought in previously (especially under KD), that are not tactically or technically good enough for the system that BR wants to play.
He needs time to get the team playing the way he was used to at swansea. But I see that moving to a higher level, now that he is at a bigger club with better players.
The season is going to be a learning season for BR, not only on the way to play but also what the players are capable of that are at the club now. Lucas has been a big lose, even last season under KD, we could see the difference from a defensive perspective. BR will use this season, even playing a team once, to see where the errors were made and improve the team tactically.
The league is important for him for a job security position, as we know that KD was sacked as a result of this. Therefore, he will be playing his best team (available) always in the league. The cups will be a chance to use the fringe/young players to get to know them and who is good/rubbish.
We need to give this team and manager time, as you can see in the results so far that playing at anfield is very very stressful for the players. There have been many comments on the atmosphere at anfield lately, and this affects the players and the way they play.
I have been watching a lot of the games this season and the only game I felt that the team let us down was against arsenal. In all the other matches they have played brilliant football at times.
This is the start of a new EVOLUTION at liverpool and given time and patience, we will see the best team in the world come back to where it belongs!
I am.....
Is anyone dumb enough to be calling for his head already?
tom1975
11 Oct 2012 00:43:33
The Problem with Liverpool...
Hola mi amigos! Decided that todays lengthy post would be an over view of problems in general. Both with the club, players and fans. Those of you that enjoy my posts normally continue, if you dont... skip now.
Ownership
--------------
Many fans on these hallowed forums have been voicing discontent with the owners recently over a perceived lack of investment, and their dismissal of Kenny/hiring of Rodgers.
Firstly, they do invest. They invested £300m to buy the club, and in the process save us from doing a rangers. Keep this point in mind... without them our club would not exist. You can claim that there may have been other buyers but the simple truth is they were the only ones who actually came up with the money in a timespan acceptable to the bank which was about to put us out of business. We should be grateful for that, a lot on here are not.
They also invested over £100m on transfers last year. I know... "it was Torres money" but it was still money which if they were the broke/greedy "Yanks" which some claim them to be, they would simply have not re-invested that money. But they let Kenny spend all of it, plus some more. For perspective think of Utd and their record sale of Ronaldo, did Fergie get all that money? Nope, he got a very small amount. Our owners gave Kenny, all of it. Again this year they have allowed Rodgers to spend 10m on an inexperienced and virtually untested youngster, and 15m on another youngster. That strike you as owners not willing to invest?
OK, the last point is people are annoyed they dismissed Kenny. Football is often a romantic sport, but it is not sentimental and never should be. Kenny was hired to improve our leagu form, it got worse and thats after 100m worth of players were brought in. If you can't improve on 7th after 100m worth of players then your job will be questioned. Nobody is bigger than the club (even the man which has given just about everything to the city and club, for which we are all infinitely grateful). BR is a young, inexperienced manager with potential. Has studied his trade at many of the best coaching schools across europe and is constantly invited to training camps with the current European and World cup holders, he wouldn't get that invitation if he weren't regarded by them. I questioned whether it was too soon to manage a big club for him as well, but you know what Kenny had no managerial experience when he came in, worked out ok for him because he was a student of the game. Rodger seems to be as well.
The Players
---------------
A lot of the players are very inexperienced, and many are also new. In addition to this our experienced players are being asked to play a formation and system that they have NEVER used before. There will be a period of adjustment while they adapt, give them time. I told myself that I would not complain or criticise Rodgers or the team for at least ten games due to the amount of things that were changing. If after 10 games, I couldn't see an improvement (not the finished article just improvement) then perhaps some criticism could be valid. We have improved though, our general play is more fluid and comfortable than in game 1. You can see that in our play, and our game against Utd is one of the best performances against united in recent years. We've also just kept our first clean sheet, thats another improvement.
The progress is slow, but there is progress.
The Fans
------------------
I'm disappointed by some of the fans on here recently. The jibes about Rodgers, Allen and Suarez are not really things that should come from their own supporters. Don't get me wrong everyone is entitled to their opinion but should you really judge the team so harshly after only 7 games? Its so early in the seaon West Brom are 6th and West Ham 8th, proof that its way to early to judge.
I made a post the other day about diving and Suarez which was misinterpreted. I did not agree with diving or encourage it. I only said if you want Suarez out because of diving then you should also want Gerrard out (see this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GKXAKQY-0Y). I dont want either out, I wish they and other players would stop diving but I will not victimise one player and excuse all others.
Allen has played 7 league games and people are criticising him for not playing more forward when his job is to retain possession and help the back 4. When he has played a full season in his natural position (which according to Rodgers is CM not DM) and still not impressed, then you could perhaps have some valid criticism.
I think with the way things are going, we as fans should be looking to stick together not just with each other (because on a daily basis we bicker amongst ourselves) but also with our players and manager. This is a very tough period of transition for everyone, but moaning at each other doesnt make it easier, complaining about our star striker, our young midfield or our brand new manager doesn't make it easier for anyone except our opposition.
Lets have some soildarity and remind people why we were once known as the best fans in football, because sadly... we lost that title a couple of years ago.
Thanks for reading everyone, comments appreciated as always.
Nevada
Agreed with everything you said, Nevada.
RDL
Agreed with some things you said but not all,yes last year i guess the owners shot there load with kenny and gave him over 100 million,so this year they came up with a new solution to transfers,only buy young lads with a sell on value,is that what this club is now academy for clubs with money buy them young make them good,so we can sell them on for a profit,i think it already cost us signing dempsey who i think could of scored a decent return of goals for us,also i believe rodgers should be judged a little further along in the season ,but i have to say he is starting to look a bit like a 1 trick pony at the moment,all this tika taka football is well and good in spain were you get alot more time on the ball and the game is played at a slower pace than they epl,i do agree some fans on here go over the top with somethings they say,but they are entitled to say what they want even if some off it is s##t talk but they pay for club in long run so let them off not everyone can be happy,i am not happy at moment with things and i guess deep down what fan is happy with are 6 points after 7 games.ray {Ed002's Note -
A good, well argued and rational post. I think there are some additional points to be made.
In general the owners have done well in bringing the club back from the brink of administration and the nightmare of TH/GG. However they have made some mistakes.
1 Giving KK a long term contract. KK deserved more than the interim role he took up which stabilised the club but it was always a risk to follow this up with a long term contract and put so much money at the disposal of KK/DC
2 Employing DC. Need I say more? Most people close to football knew he was a disaster waiting to happen
3 Not appointing a home based Chief Executive with their confidence and trust who could make on the spot decisions and commitments. If there was no-one who had yet gained their confidence then they should themselves have provided a higher profile on the spot presence to avoid miscommunication etc.
4 Taking more detailed control of the ground project by banging heads together to make progress
I have no real problem with the buy young with resale possibilities. It makes business sense. We have been victims too many times of the buy older players at the height of the value scenario. You end up with players you want to replace but can't because they have no resale value and their contracts are too expensive. Cole? Poulsen? i was not too disappointed with the Dempsey deal as I did not see him as an LFC player. The fault there was that a strategy does not appear to have been agreed with FSG regarding AC leaving. See the comment above re
a chief executive.
We just have to be careful that being too inflexible in applying a policy which is basically sound does not mean we miss the Gary Mac opportunities
Barrym
11 Oct 2012 00:43:12
Ed why are such a pessemist with any player linked with liverpool. if it has been said its probably been mentioned at anfiled. Do you know that the only reason a loan move didnt materilaise for gaitan and villa was because of a valuation and wage demand?The only real rumor right now is Villa on loan and dries mertens with downing and enrique going if buyers can be found. {Ed001's Note - I have absolutely no idea what you are saying, sorry.}
I kind off believe this post. I too think that these are our main targets for jan.
10 Oct 2012 23:27:18
Fair play Luis. Let them all talk whilst they should be looking after their own front yard.
"Everyone should focus on their own team," he told Ovacion. "Those who want to talk can do so, I am not worried about what they say.
"They can keep talking and in the meantime I will keep on playing football and taking care of my team and what I do. Nothing else matters."
Liverpool boss Brendan Rodgers responded angrily to the criticism of his striker, and Suarez appreciates having his manager behind him, adding: "The support of the coach is very important to me and that's what I really care about."