21 Feb 2019 17:44:04
I see klopp has been fined £45,000 for his questioning of refereeing decisions. I really don’t get why managers are not allowed to question decisions? Of course, abusing referees etc is wrong but all managers, not just klopp should have a right to voice their concerns over decisions if they believe they have been wronged! Just another way for the FA to make money in my eyes!

{Ed002's Note - It is nothing to do with the FA making money.}

1.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:05:10
It does seem odd that their first response is to do this. Refs seem to be off-limits when it comes to any sort of criticism. Perhaps if the FA/ referees actually looked at the criticism and took it on board more (when it’s factual and constructive) they might improve and then receive less criticism.

2.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:05:14
Ok then ed, can you tell me why criticising a referees performance deserves such a heavy fine?

{Ed025's Note - because most of it is just self centered nonsense JK, they come out and slate the ref and publicly humiliate him in front of the cameras, why not civilly go to his dressing room and ask him why he made the decisions he did?, we all know its not perfect but castigating the guy on TV will only serve to lower the confidence of the already vilified officials mate..

3.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:16:08
Why should you be allowed to question our decisions? Do you question your mother? A judge?
People need to learn that it is the referees field of play, the ball is his, and the players are under his protection.
If a referee says black is white, you accept it, and move on.

{Ed025's Note - well said benny..

4.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:26:27
Without a ref there is no game. No football! Can you imagine the players trying to self-arbitrate?! They are such cheaters, which is instilled into the game. It would be a farce. Fact is we need refs and it all evens itself out over a season. Show some respect. Set a good example for the kids. Suck it up and get on with it.

5.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:25:09
Ed25 I don’t think Klopp did castigate him. He just said he’s human so was probably influenced by the offside goal we scored in the first half and didn’t want to give us anything in the second half.
It’s a bit over sensitive of the ref if he took offence to that don’t you think? Plus it was Kevin Friend who is an incompetent buffoon at the best of times anyway.

{Ed025's Note - but bobby in the end you have to show respect to the man with the whistle mate, you might not like some of his calls and i get that, but they are already on trial by TV which scrutinizes every facet and dont need over exuberant dick heads like klopp rubbing salt in the wounds, no wonder they make mistakes, its hardly helping with their confidence now is it?..

6.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:13:24
What’s it to do with then Ed? It makes me very uncomfortable when any organisation has the power to enforce a fine and profit from it.

{Ed002's Note - It is simply a case of Klopp breaking the rules and being punished for it. It is not some conspiracy against Liverpool.}

7.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:54:56
Fans can question referee decisions, managers and players cannot.
It’s very simple and ridiculous that Klopp has got himself in trouble for this again.
He’s not the first, he won’t be the last, yet more evidence that football managers are not the sharpest tools in the box 👍.

{Ed001's Note - it is not about intelligence Ron. They get into trouble because of frustration. Not always frustration with the referees, they just get the brunt of it, like the 4th official does throughout the match. It is something that could be dealt with better by the game in not allowing players and managers to give interviews straight after matches. People say things in the heat of the moment that they shouldn't do.

Referees are struggling, but they are not getting help from the game itself, and that needs to change and they need to be more open to discussing things after a match as well. There is nothing wrong with explaining why you made a decision to those who were affected by it. If refs were willing to do that, then managers might be more willing to talk to them on the quiet after a game to discuss their performance.}

8.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:57:02
Ed002, nobody is suggesting there is a conspiracy against Liverpool, that’s just your imagination yet again! If you read my original question I stated all managers, not just Klopp should have the right to question decisions without punishment.

{Ed002's Note - Read the posts.}

9.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 19:00:34
There is a complete lack of respect both on and off the field for referee's i think it is completely right to fine Klopp for questioning his profession.

They should go to the Rugby approach, any backchat and you are out of here!

10.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:34:31
As I said ed025, coming out and abusing him is out of order but simply saying “I believe he got this decision wrong” is simply opinion and shouldn’t be punished in my eyes.

{Ed025's Note - if thats all he said then your right JK, but you can bet your bottom dollar that there is more to it than that mate..

11.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 18:44:34
Ed25 is right here. Whatever Klopp needed to say to the ref, he should say it in the ref's dressing room after the game and respectfully disagree with his decisions cos remember, Klopp feeling hard-done by is his opinion, NOT a fact. Him doing it the way he did just invites the type of punishment that frankly, is the law instituted by the FA. There is NOTHING else to see here.

{Ed025's Note - dead right red wolf..

12.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 20:08:00
Instead of having a go at refs managers should help them

A) tell their players not to fall over
B) tell their players not to appeal for everything even though they know damn well it’s not going to go their way

If your instructing your team to go out and play on the margins- decisions by officials are going to be marginal

They do a good job- and they do sit down every week and review crucial decisions, could they have been better placed etc

The piece Carra and Neville did with refs for Sky was an-eye-opener.

13.) 21 Feb 2019
21 Feb 2019 23:08:13
He was angry, end of. it happens! Refs are human and make mistakes but they're also professionals and like any professional who makes errors in their place of work I don't think it's too much for them to have to explain or even admit the mistakes made. I know if I screwed up in my place of work I'd have to explain myself.

14.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 00:31:30
And that is exactly why referees will never get respect Benny. They never seem to learn, are unaccountable to all but the inner circle (and god only knows what happens there), make far too many mistakes for the level they should be at and if you are demonstrating the default refereeing attitude, altogether too arrogant.

A bit more openness would go a hell of a long way toward helping people understand the thought processes some times.

15.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 04:51:27
imo i don't see a problem with the fine. there are proper channels to use to make a complaint (rescind red cards for example, a claim needs to be submitted formally) . i do however think this can be further improved.

either way i don't see public comments by either a player or manager as being good for anyone.

{Ed001's Note - agreed mate. Klopp was in the wrong, he knows the rules and did not abide by them and so got the punishment. Still the game does need to look at these after match interviews, they are unfair on the referees to have someone shouting about how incompetent they are out of frustration. They need help not abuse. AggerDo is spot on, managers can hardly complain about referees struggling when their players are cheating constantly.}

16.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 05:10:10
Regardless, i hope the money goes to a good cause.

17.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 05:55:51
You and me both lerchy. For the record I think Klopp deserved the fine, as much as I love him, in situations like this he should be more careful, he's been silly to himself but aren't we all at times? in the heat of the moment refs get far too much stick, that needs to be stopped and if it means giving out hefty fines then so be it. He won't blink twice at 45k should be more if you ask me, make them learn not to do it again.

18.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 08:38:53
I think managers and players should not be allowed to give interviews immediately after games. And I think every manager and team get a fair amount of decisions their way, which they shouldn't get. No manager comes out and says that our team was lucky that the decision went our way when it shouldn't have. In the same way if decisions go against you, managers and players should just stop moaning about it and move on. It's done. It can't be changed. Then why break the rules and get yourself in trouble. Also, it a manager feels hard done by decision by the ref they should calmly address the same to the referee rather than question it and point it out on live tv.

19.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 09:16:09
I think ed 001 has a point

If I remember correctly a few years back referees used to do interviews after games and explain their reasons behind decisions

I know it's a different era now with social media and the likes so the chances of that ever making a comeback is highly unlikely but just wondering if anyone thinks that could help this issue with the refs

I think if they explained why they gave a certain decision people May have a bit more respect for them.

{Ed001's Note - it is just about reminding people they are humans and have a different viewpoints. It might cut down on the abuse if they are not seen as these arrogant, aloof hate figures.}

20.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 09:41:23
agreed

if a ref came out and explained why he gave a decision people may realise they're just normal people doing an incredibly difficult job and respect it instead of just giving them abuse constantly.

21.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 11:13:30
Redinthewrongway, it’s clearly straight over your head. Do you think rugby referees don’t make mistakes? Or cricket/ tennis umpires. They all do. Yet no one talks about them, why? Because of society and how it behaves.

All starts at the lower levels. The abuse I get from the sidelines from coaches, would never happen in the street because they’d get a good lumping and they know it. Yet our shoddy football association turns a blind eye to the constant abuse all officials receive, so knobheads, like klopp was here, are all protected. £45k? Get a grip, not a drop in the ocean and will do nothing to combat it. Fine him £5m and there won’t be a peep from managers ever again.

22.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 12:25:44
Benny, you come across as a top guy in many of your posts and I applaud you for doing your bit as a referee in lower level football. But I think you are wrongly conflating 2 separate issues here. At the lower levels of football, referees are volunteers without whom the games could not be played. They deserve and should receive total respect from all participants and those who abuse them will only have themselves to blame if the game at this level continues to decline in the number of leagues and games played for want of enough referees. I get it that referees need to start at this level and progress up the league ladder, but for me the circumstances at the lower level are a world away from the pinnacle of the club game in this country, the PL. Referees at this level are all full time professionals and while they, too, should receive total respect from players during the game, surely it is perfectly valid for commentators, pundits, supporters, viewers, journalists and, yes, managers to hold them to account for their performance and applaud or criticise them when they deserve it. I have banged on about referees long enough in previous posts and I won’t bore everyone again but there are decisions made by so many referees in the PL elite group that are so downright contrary to the first hand and televisual evidence as to be mystifying. Surely they should be called out on these decisions?

23.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 12:47:31
Cheers Wirral. I’m very well compansated for being an official, so it’s not volunteering. You are wrong in saying the levels are totally different.
You cut out the problem at the root, and it doesn’t go into the petals. Why should anyone who’s never done a job, hold someone accountable for doing it? Do I hold an astronaut accountable for crashing into the space station? Do I hold a doctor accountable for a misdiagnosis? No, because I no know better.
People sit and slag off pundits for commenting on managers and say “ they’re only a pundit because they can’t hack management “ yet managers pundits etc have not been referees. Why should you be allowed to comment on a world you know nothing about?

24.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 13:19:19
Benny, I don’t need to be a meteorologist to look out of the window and know that it is raining! 😉.

25.) 22 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 13:30:09
Spot on Benny, it's one of them conversations which is always going to create debate, but you are right. The people up there earning millions have no bloody idea so all they can do is point the finger at the refs. It should be more balanced but it never was, isn't and never will be which is why I previously stated they should be fined more, make them notice what they're doing are wrong and won't be tolerated, make them pay attention in order to stop it full stop. 45k is nothing to these people therefore bugger all will change.

26.) 23 Feb 2019
22 Feb 2019 23:50:31
100% disagree with you on that Benny. The game does not belong to refs and they are not allowed to make mistakes just because they are in charge of player safety.

They are paid very well to do their job and if they make a mistake they should be critised for that so they can learn from it. If I make mistakes at work am I not culpable because it’s my computer log on, so it’s my rules?

The game should and does belong to us, the fans. Without us there is no money and without money you just have Sunday league football. Referees owe it to us to get decisions right, otherwise why are they getting paid by money that we put into the game through tickets, memorabilia and tv subscriptions?

I am not saying for one second they deserve abuse or vitriol, but it should not be punishable to state that they made a mistake, which it seems to be.

The FA and the referees governing body should not all bandy round together to try and make excuses, they should say, yep a mistake was made and we will review it and provide training to ensure it does not happen again.

Players get it, managers get it, clubs hierarchy’s get it, even us fans get it. So why are refs the only immune ones?

They shoes this as their career and are paid by us- through our input to clubs - to do their jobs. They should be able to be criticised.

27.) 23 Feb 2019
23 Feb 2019 00:01:17
Not saying what he said wasn't wrong, but would allowing managers, not just Klopp here, time to settle after a match before answering questions, be a start in preventing these situations in the first place? You can also tell the interviewer at times wants to get these sorts of answers, by the questions they ask, sometimes even re wording a failed question to get the reaction they want, possibly to sell their paper! Again, not saying managers like Klopp aren't wrong, as they obviously are at times, but the sport doesn't help themselves at times.