16 Aug 2017 10:37:07
There's been a lot of debate about our defence for quite a while now.

Is it systemic or personnel based? I think maybe a combination of both.

We have 2 players that are not working together at the moment (Lovren and Moreno), we also do not have a DM that could help out plus our system means that the FB's need to bomb forward at every opportunity.

There was one point in the match last night (first 10-15 minutes if I remember right) and Moreno was chasing down their keeper.

The ball gets knocked over over press and Lovren has to cover the LB side.

Luckily Matip got a tow onto the cross to put it out of play.

Our system meant that Moreno was far forward, leaving the LB side free.
No DM to cover
No midfielder given instructions to look for these things and cover
No midfielder able to recognise theses things and cover.
Personnel issue in that Lovren gets beat easily by jumping into a tackle trying to win the ball mainly with his wrong foot a lot of the time.

Why oh why are there still problems after all this time?

People are now starting to question Klopp and it doesn't help when we mess up with the VVD signing, have Sakho (rightly or wrongly) blocked from the 1st team and Gomes not being given a chance, when I don't think he will make as many mistakes as Lovren.

1.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 10:58:40
I do feel sorry for lovren a bit, he's been completely exposed and pulled out of position when Moreno has been playing, I know he's not the best but he's not the worst either.

2.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 11:11:19
When our fullbacks bomb forward, we need a disciplined DM who will sit back and form a sort of back 3. However, Henderson and Can are both ball playing midfielders who prefer to look forward than back. Hopefully this can be just a training issue and get our midfielders to work on defensive shape more effectively.

3.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 11:12:35
So now its Morenos fault that Lovren has no awereness at all? Moreno played a good match exept for 1 brainfart where he just stood watching the ball and a Hoffenheim player almost got to it. He had several good passes and was good going forward. He has been playing good the whole pre season and the 2 first matches. Give him a chance, he works he's ass off and even beeing one of the smaller players in the team he has the balls to not shy away from a duel.

{Ed001's Note - I just wonder why Moreno is getting pelters for closing down the keeper? That was what he should have done in the position he was in, it is up to the team as a whole to see what is happening and adapt. That is the problem we have, the team is not reacting to the situation and just continuing to play the same way and do the same things, no matter what.}

4.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 11:52:49
Don't give a toss if Moreno / Robertson doesn't track back enough as long as they provide an outlet for attacks going forward. Buy an offensive FB and ask them to defend! Sorry you can't have it that way!
Mendy won't be defending a great deal at city!

5.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 14:45:17
I have no issue with the FB's bombing forward or Moreno chasing down their keeper.

It is the result of this that needs addressing.

Lovren has to cover Moreno so is out of position and once he gets beat, Matip only just got a toe on the cross.
I know that's what they are there to do, but if we had a DM or midfielder with either the brains or instructions to help out, we wouldn't have half as many defensive issues as we do.

On this basis I can see why the arguments for 3 CB's might work, as it allows for more central cover when one CB is moving to cover the FB position, but it would still require a midfielder to be keeping an eye on what is going on to be there if required.

I don't know if it is under instruction that they do this, or that they lack the intelligence to take on-board the coaching or maybe they are not coached this way at all?

I like the speed and trickery that Moreno offers. I also like having a proper left-footer playing that side, it just means the system needs to be covering the flaws, temporary shape-changes if a move breaks down etc.

6.) 16 Aug 2017
16 Aug 2017 12:25:26
Spot on, Ed and Stoupid. Moreno is an easy target cos well, his former transgressions have not been forgiven. He has been very good of late. It is not his fault that our players are so robotic and can't think for themselves to adapt to situations on the pitch. This goes for the coaches as well. if something is not working, fix it.