1.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 19:01:19
How much more do you think they need to hand it over to Klopp to win the league or beat Swansea and hull Waro? You clearly don't understand the game, Do you mate? It's no surprise everything has come down to owners fault. Ayre, FSG, Gordon Well three unanimous names when things doesn't go according to the plans?

You want all the moaners to support the club but you also have a bucket of abuses towards owners who are also a part of the club. How ironic is that?

Can you deny they haven't spend a penny in 4 years?

2.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 19:02:35
Out of interest waro, Were can I read about this or find out about it please. Both what the problem with the owners are and what action is being taken to solve it. thanks.

3.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 20:38:52
Waro, beating up on the owners is nothing but a fool's errand. They have made funds available to every manager since they've been here so is it their fault that the funds got wasted half the time? Is also a bad thing for them to want us to live within our means hence, balancing the books and running a club in a solvent manner? Just how much do you think they should be spending every season? City spent almost 200m on CB's alone in three years alone yet I wouldn't want any of them at LFC as they are that awful. Is that what you want Waro?

If the squad is not good enough, then Klopp is your guy as this is "his team now" (his words not mine) . The owners have made mistakes and that is fair BUT to say that they haven't spent money for player sales is ludicrous.

4.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 21:46:36
Waro is back beating the abuse the owners drum. I preferred it when u stopped posting. Complete and utter nonsense as usual.

5.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 21:48:22
Hi Waro, you've been very quiet all season until January. LOL.

6.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 22:32:46
Harry, I won't get involved with you sorry. As I've stated before as I'm not sure if English is your first language or another underlying issue that I wouldn't bring up on a public forum.

Jay, its there business model that is the problem and the undercurrent of using the club as a cash cow long term. I could elaborate but that will involve a very long and exhaustive post and as I'm winding down with work in the morning i don't think it's appropriate tonight. Look into the fundamental principles of the spirit of shankly, the short medium and long term aims of the group and the responsibilities the owners undertook when they purchased the club. Hope that helps mate.

7.) 09 Feb 2017
09 Feb 2017 23:08:29
Stop peddling lies noah, I won't debate with people pushing FSG propaganda. Just digest my original post because that's the road we are now heading along and that's down to these Americans.

8.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 00:00:22
Waro mate the club is still losin money every week. How much should the owners keep forking out? The club should operate within its means. That's not too much to ask for. To claim they aren't spending is ludicrous. That being said, good to see you back.

9.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 00:15:42
Waro cracking up as usual.

10.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 01:25:28
I don't see any of them starving just yet.

Is our spending on a par with our contemporaries? Not that buying the dearest is the answer.

Does our club pay wages comparable with our contemporaries?

Is Liverpool geographically more attractive to top foreign players who have only heard of London life and don't give a toss about a clubs history?

The answers to the above questions is no to each of them.

But the option when LFC was nearly bankrupted by Hicks and Gilette under the watchful eye of Rick Perry and the stupidity of Moores.

I know which I prefer. So while FSG aren't Russian billionaires they have brought stability and have stuck know to their word in increasing seating capacity.

All was well as few months ago where we flattered to deceive and all is not as bad as it seems now though it is frustrating but that's why we are Liverpool FC. And not Leeds Utd FC.

{Ed002's Note - You don't seem to have the basic understanding about finances and the needs to balance the books - the spending at Liverpool has been out of hand building significant debts - which have been reduced by the owners writing off their equity in the club. Gross spending on transfers is well beyond the likes of Arsenal and net spending well ahead of the likes of Spurs. Wages paid by Liverpool are significantluy ahead of the likes of Spurs. It is simply a case of this desire to spend money regardless of who is purchased. Over and over again Liverpool supports have craved mass change every summer demanding "marquee" signings - and year on year owners have obliged spending well beyond what is affordable. You all want the owners gone, and most of the managers and all of the players - it is a complete embarrassment.}

11.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 01:44:50
'I won't debate with people pushing FSG propaganda' translates to me as 'I won't debate with people with alternate viewpoints'.
Surely they are exactly the people you should be debating with, Waro?

12.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 01:50:04
Typical Waro. don't hear a peep when things are going good but as soon as our form changes baam he is back.

13.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 02:51:10
I legitmately don't think I've ever agreed with waro, sorry if that offends you but you seem like a very narrow minded right wing type of person. In terms of FSG I think there are plenty of negatives you can attribute to them but financial backing isn't one of them. We have spent so badly under their ownership and unfortunantly they do not know how to change that and do not have the financial power to just spend more to correct those wrongs. I feel like they are owners with generally good intentions that want this to be a successful business both for themselves and for the fans. They are not football people and I believe even now they have very little idea on how to successfully run a football club and even their so called advisors are poor at this also. You look within the club and certain employees clearly shouldn't have a job with a global brand like Liverpool football club, they are just out of their depth. The amount of blunders we have made under their ownership has been astonishing, but unlike hicks and gillet (this is my opinion) these blunders haven't been done by the owners themselves just some of the idiots they hire. I believe ayre has the wrong position within the club very good at negotiating commercial deals and marketing Liverpool but awful and dealing with transfers of football players, mike Gordon has no idea how to run a football club, the recruitment/ scouts have been nothing short of appalling and there's some amateurs on the coaching staff as well. It's clear we are not the most well run club, not even close and whilst that trickles down from the owners I feel the owners have had their positives also. Financial backing is one of them. I prefer these to hicks and gillet, but there's certain things they must correct asap and if they don't we might be better off with new owners once they decide to sell. It's inevitably going to happen, I just hope we end up with owners that have a genuine interest in football, otherwise we will continue to be run in a amateurish way.

14.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 03:38:34
Ed002 and folks
Appreciate the candor and insights you bring to the table, especially regarding financial outlay. I wanted to share my 2 cents (i don't have the same level of understanding on the details, but want to take a generic investment view) .
From your comments, it is evident that the club is outspending income at the moment - but that is hardly a unique situation. End of the day, what FSG care most about will be long term shareholder value creation. By purchasing liverpool and investing in the business, they are trying to build out an asset that they can monetize over time. We should not look at the ongoing P&L impact in isolation. We should look at the impact to the valuation of the business as well.
This is the same model under which most VC funded companies (e. g. Uber, snapchat, etc. ) operate. While they have a negative operating income, they continue to drive value through creation of greater promise and setting the asset up for future success. I believe FSG are doing the same, so that as and when they exit, they get good returns on their investment.

{Ed002's Note - I think a fair comment but income this season has a significant uplift and FSG are "investors" and not soccerball fans. If you have an investment fund you buy to grow, sustain and maybe sell. You don't however much the Spirit of Shankly believe, buy to build a family club. If Liverpool get sold it could be to a Chinese business that want the street cred the name brings for exploitation (but the fans get the massive spending they crave), or it could be floated on a foreign exchange to institutional owners - who knows. FSG are good owners, but they are investors. They buy and invest to win and got the structure wrong in this case. They are not Venture Capitalists - that is an entirely different animal. Every single owner or group of owners of any club in football wants a return on investment - Liverpool supporters want a charity.}

15.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 04:38:23
Hi Ed
.........

{Ed002's Note - No, you have misundersood the situation completely.}

16.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 09:07:30
I might of misunderstood this from a while back, but weren't we sailing very close to FFP spending limits and investigated by FIFA about it.
If so, apart from the extra spending our increase in the new tv money would allow, what more could our current or future owners do within the rules, unless we invoke exceptional circumstances and sign Messi!

17.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 10:40:05
is that true of Barcelona, Real Madrid, Man City and Chelsea ed?
Seems like it will be difficult to achieve.

18.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 09:50:43
A lot of demonstrably false 'alternative facts' from Waro here - why bother debating facts about finances when you have nothing to back what you're saying, there is plenty to back the other viewpoint but you believe your rhetoric alone is enough to see you through? I wouldn't debate either!

Keep fighting your fight Waro. No matter how the evidence stacks up. No matter how much you have to deny the basic facts and figures in front of you. No matter how much you have to ignore basic issues (like when you get a free agent like Matip, you don't have to keep spending because you didn't give away enough money) . Everyone needs something to believe in!

19.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 11:45:53
Most likely opening myself to be criticised and derided by some fans. But is Waro's argument purely based on the amount of spending on the squad?

Surely spending way beyond our means in order to match Utd and Chelsea (no idea why some fans worship those clubs) on the transfer front is the sort of nonsense that H&G did that led us to within a whisker of administration.

Are those who slate the owners forgetting the state the club was in commercially when they arrived. I forget the article now but I read that when they took over the merchandise office was basically one guy in an office. So you were trying to order a shirt say in Australia but it was night time over here your order wouldn't go through. This was 2010 for Christ's sake and we were still trapped in the early 90's regarding our merchandise and commercial potential.

I might be wrong and I'm sure the Ed's know more than me, but from reading around FSG have put a lot of effort into improving us as a brand and a commercial entity, yes this ultimately benefits them (they are investors after all), but football is a business and no owner will do it for the love of the club despite what Spirit of Shankly pander about.

Question for Waro,

I'm not having a go here I am genuinely interested in this- What are the group's plan if they ever managed to get control of the club. I don't mean squad or management wise, I'm talking about all the other bits. The infrastructure (the academy and training ground being in different locations for example), the commercial interests and growth, brand exposure (the last two I feel FSG have improved quite substantially)

20.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 11:07:10
Lol Waro perfectly fine mate. Out of curiosity, who according to you are Good owners and how do we find them mate?

21.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 13:44:12
I have read your initial post Waro and it reads like the same dross you've been posting about FSG since 2013 regarding spending on the squad. You think them trying to make us live within our means is a bad thing well, that's fine BUT not all of us agree as that particular myopic thinking is what H&G did that almost put us in a whole BUT hey, that's not your problem now, is it? Hence, you are right, there is no point debating you as you have an innate gripe with FSG that even the facts and figures on the ground, bear no impact on your reasoning. There's none more deaf than the one who refuses to listen.

22.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 13:52:56
Fan ownership, and recruit the correct people to handle the commercial side of the club, and it would not be owned by the spirit of shankly so I'm not sure what your implying!

It's easy to scoff and give the impression of a gang of scallies sitting around the, boardroom table scratching there heads saying "what do we do now! " fan ownership doesn't mean amateurish handling of a world wide brand, the club would be run in the correct manner and would not be used as a franchise or cash cow for venture capitalists to exploit for there own gain.

But your views are meaningless to be honest because the ground swell of opinion in the city is the lack of interest in the club and squad investment by F$G will not be tolerated much longer, if the summer doesn't see a marked improvement in both then they will be in for a very very bumpy ride!

Oh and before you reply about the money they've spent don't bother because they haven't given any manager genuine money, because more or less every window we've recruited in we've sold to buy FACT! Our net spend is negligible.

23.) 10 Feb 2017
10 Feb 2017 14:38:18
Waro ( excuse my English ), you want one of the biggest brands in world football to be handed over to a group of fans who have previously held nothing? How many of the clubs in Europe are owned by a group of fans?

Other than emotions and meaningless rants, does an ordinary fan know anything about ownership?

Football is a business and every club across the globe is run purely on that basis. It doesn't matter how the money comes in ( sales or lottery ) the money has been invested to purchase players.

Are you trying to say the owners are sucking money out from the club, which is already losing money week in week out?

What is wrong with expecting a profit from a business?